You Shouldn't Take Advice From Those Who Are Successful

in advice •  8 years ago  (edited)

All too often I stumble upon people who seem to be fascinated with the success of others. It seems logical that if someone is successful, then following that person's strategy, would also bring success to you. Thing is, life doesn't work like that. In fact, you would have had the same luck taking money advice from someone who just won the lottery.

Crows, much like humans, are pretty intelligent beings if they are trained under a specific context. If you doubt their ingenuity then check this out. Crows are also known to be simpletons — they pretty much collect everything that blinks. We might consider crows silly for not knowing any better but we are not that much different. Crows possess an innate jerk reaction to anything that reflects light. Humans have a similar reaction when confronted with societal memes that involve someone flashing money, driving an expensive car or wearing a fancy suit.


Part of the reason we are often rendered emotionally handicapped to these societal memes is because we suck at making logical deductions. People don't just hate math for no reason. Logical thinking goes against our nature. Humans function primarily on an emotional autopilot. Thinking is hard and takes energy so the brain tends to avoid it. This is also why the decisions we take tend to be emotional rather than logical.

For example, you have the same odds for winning the lottery as with a tiny asteroid landing on your right testicle. Yet, people keep playing over and over again. There is a saying that the lottery is a form of tax for stupid people. People see the advertised winner and forget the millions of people that didn't win. In other words we pay attention to the wins and forget the losses.

Most gamblers think much the same. Most traders think much the same (sure, not you). Most positive thinkers carry the same false mentality. All it matter are the wins. The losses are ignored. Thing is, in a world that is governed by demand and supply the losses will be always far greater than the wins. Although there is no such thing as zero sum game, the overall relative gap of wealth will always increase due to competition and the nature of value. In other words, losers will always be more than the winners. Much more. Relative value exists because of this uncanny unbalance.

Many people that read the Warren Buffet books or Steve Jobs autobiographies, believe that if they follow their ways they will too become successful. Statistically speaking, the exact opposite is true. Buffet became Buffet because he had a unique set of circumstances aligned for him. His father owned a brokerage and he could also have a good strike in a couple deals. Then everything after that rolled out effortlessly. Whatever move he was making, whatever strategy, could be explained as a post-hoc event. Thousands and thousands of traders followed Warren Buffet's classic strategy but not all made it. In fact most got owned because they created a predictable trend in their trading strategies and others ripped them off.


This phenomenon is easily demonstrable when it comes to popular videos and news. We are showered every day by the top million views-popular videos, forgetting we are witnessing the extreme exception to the rule. The exception, in our eyes, becomes our norm. Self-help gurus like Tony Robbins know this trick very well. This is why they only flash the followers that made it. This form of confirmation bias plagues humanity in more instance that I can enumerate.


source

The crashing majority of people don't do anything wrong. Even if they follow the books, lives and advice of successful people, they simply don't make it. Their child might have caught an illness and changed their venture's prospects. A boss might have just promoted their relative. A physical injury might have stopped progress. Heck, one might have stained their tie by mistake causing them to lose the jackpot deal of their life that could have made them the next George Soros. If anything of those events had rolled out for the better, the post-hoc narrative would have changed along.

Most people hate the idea that life is mostly about luck because losing control is scary. The fact of the matter is that life is mostly luck. You can even demonstrate this to yourself. Take a note and start writing down all the small events happening around you, along with the potential outcomes. In an hour, so many things affect you in your vicinity that you could have written a book.


Your daily life involves trillions of micro-events that together create your own unique future. A small change can make you win the lottery or leave you paralyzed for life. The control we have on events in our life are extremely limited. Life is highly unpredictable. If you believe that something bad is unlikely to happen due to a statistical impossibility then why would you think otherwise about becoming a millionaire?

Following the lives of others is not only silly but is also damaging. If for example everyone starts copying Buffet's investing strategy then someone with an opposing game can screw everyone over. In fact much of financial fraud in trading happens exactly like this. Moreover you are not them. You will never be them. Trying to take advice from a person that has lived a different set of events is futile. One cannot get the same outcomes in their life. It is statistically improbable due to the collusion of a myriad of other factors. It is similar to copying the training regime of Usain Bolt in hope to become the fastest man alive.


I wrote this article because I see some celebrities here on Steemit who "made it" advertising their success. It is only logical that even if everybody followed the same strategy, nobody would be successful. Everyone would ultimately be in the same position thus the perceived value of that action/s would have rendered them all useless.

The "Look at me/Be like me" success stories are nothing but self-loathing narratives that people use to market themselves. The primary usage is for them to make even more money by having common simpletons (that do not understand statistics) follow them. They have no basis in reality and can turn your excitement into dire disappointment. It's your life. You are in control. Prefer to ignore the flashy folk. Most likely they are so full of themselves that when the tides turn, they won't know what hit them. Even if you still don't believe in luck, she has her own way of proving you wrong.





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I agree with this to a certain extent but not entirely. Sure if you try to walk in the exact same footsteps as a successful person your life will not turn out like theirs, but you can still learn a lot from some of the underlying principles behind their actions. As a musician I see many others trying to copy the sound of their heroes, forgetting that what their heroes did was create something unique and original. Instead of trying to recreate the exact sound of another artist you can only be successful by coming up with something original that has it's own character. Many if not all of the greatest artists in history understood this, but most people do not.

You can learn a lot by the underlying principles of any person. You can take any successful emperor and learn to be ruthless. You can take Steve jobs and learn how to be an asshole. You can take gandi and learn about self sacrifice.

it is irrelevant who you choose to take examples. Qualities don't matter. at all. it is the sequence of events that bind everything together.

You are talking nonsense here.

@captaincanary has a valid point: by observing successful people one can extract what's common between them and learn from this.

No you can't. if that was true then most people on this earth would be successful since most people are sheeple and follow the leaders.

the earth's population proves you wrong.

  ·  8 years ago (edited)

Yes, you can. Extracting common features is not easy (that's why most people cannot do it) but actually this is the basis of abstract thinking and intelligence in general.

People learn from each other, mostly by looking up to other people. But you need to make a distinction between imitation and inspiration.

Which proves you wrong.

Extracting common features is not easy (that's why most people cannot do it)

not hard. very easy actually. anyone can do it.

People learn from each other, mostly by looking up to other people. But you need to make a distinction between imitation and inspiration.

both go hand in hand

Which proves you wrong.

You just told me "this is a can of coke therefore potato"

no it doesn't prove me wrong. It proves you incoherent though.

Yes, sir. I'm incoherent. Therefore potato.

On one hand I would say that you are right. If someone is successfull and takes cocaine, it does not mean that you taking cocaine will make you successful. If he has green hair, you having green hair will make you successful.

But: people who work hard and in a smart manner should be copied in a way that the other person should work hard and smart as well.

If not, you are saying that they should not try to learn a thing or two from successful people and that there is no way to become successful.

If you cannot learn something from successful people from who can you learn something?? One thing is for sure... one cannot learn anything from those so-called teachers at public-schools... those are really the worst persons...

But: people who work hard and in a smart manner should be copied in a way that the other person should work hard and smart as well.

even so, still doesn't work since all contexts are different.

If not, you are saying that they should not try to learn a thing or two from successful people and that there is no way to become successful.

I am saying that learning from all people is the best way to go. There is no need to focus only on the successful ones. Heck, you can even learn more from the unsuccessful ones.

If you cannot learn something from successful people from who can you learn something?? One thing is for sure... one cannot learn anything from those so-called teachers at public-schools... those are really the worst persons...

Public teaching is useless

  ·  8 years ago (edited)

I totally agree with your point of view. So many people fall for the survivorship bias, which firstly ignores people who have acted the exact same way as their successful counterparts but got different results (due to the fact that their failure has rendered them invisible); and secondly ignores the fact that there really can't be "the exact same way". :)

@elemenya is quickly becoming one of my favourite users. :)
You've made some cool observations on posts, I've noticed.

@kyriacos was on the list already.

Cheers to both!

Thank you, @schattenjaeger! I'm trying to do my best :)

Kind of makes you wonder if the whole idea of the "American dream" is one big case of survivorship bias.

haha, indeed!

the "American Scheme"

oh nice one. I should have mentioned that.

You need to do what is right for you.
never take mindlessly any action based on someone’s advice, least of which that of a "so called" guru for whatever topic.
My problem with ie “financial gurus” is, that they’re not relevant to the people they are trying to teach.
Sure, at some point in their life they may have been relevant, but not anymore than.

exactly

everyone is unique and you will have your own way to reach your own goal, I think it is worth to see how other's meaure , but not to copy, you will never know which suits you well until you do it. Strive hard everyone:) steem on!

So I always try. But as it turned out, if you're lucky with one in a thousand, it's definitely not me :)

thank you

Great write up. I agree following what someone else does will most likely not make you successful. You'll just be a carbon copy of that person who possible brings little to nothing new to the table. You really have to find what works for you, what can you set you apart from the masses and use that to your advantage. That take lots of hard work and creativity....

Too bad I like math!

nicely put.

I agree where you are coming from, but I would rather take my advice from someone that is self loathing then someone self defecating their pants because they don't care lol.

Well I guess this guy has a pretty dope crib, so what am I saying...

you could learn the same amount of valuable info from both. that's the point.

Good chance I could guess the reason why the homeless is that way (Drugs, Lack of parental-ship growing up, addictive personalities to partying/gambling)....Now it is a little harder guessing how someone became wealthy.

yeap. 90% of the prisoners in the U.S come from troubled families. (abuse, poor, crime...)

Trying to emulate others who are successful is not a bad thing as they have found a successful formula. Not trying is worst than doing nothing.

Success don't come easy and is all about trial and error. You can tweak the formula of success to make it your own. With the rare exception to the rule, many successful people have failed over and over again and succeeded in the end.

The reason being is that most have learnt from their failures. So trying to emulate someone else who are successful is not necessarily bad as long as you learn from the process when if you fail.

never said it is bad. I am saying it is pointless.

Success don't come easy and is all about trial and error.

luck plays a major role.

Yes, luck does play a big role. Successful people just happens to make it by being in the right time and place.

mostly is about that indeed.

Excellent post.
In 2016, the Nobel prize were the British economist Oliver HART, Professor at Harvard University (USA), Finnish economist Bengt Khol'mstrem, Professor Massachusetts Institute of technology (USA), the elaboration of the contract theory in neoclassical Economics. The neoclassical direction assumes the rationality of economic agents, widely uses the theory of economic equilibrium and game theory. Oliver HART in the mid-1980s has made a fundamental contribution to a new model of contract theory that deals with the important case of incomplete contracts.
Impossible to predict and anticipate, @kyriacos=)))

excellent. :) thank you for this. Heck, you could make a post about it.

Could,@kyriacos. With pleasure. Only sorry for my bad English :))) I also interested in this topic

no problem

  ·  8 years ago (edited)

Wrote a post, @kyriacosSo unpredictable economy. Or what gives the Nobel prize?.
I'd be happy to hear your opinion =))))

This is actually quite close to what went through my mind when I saw one of the smug "imported celebrities" introduce himself on Steemit the other day.

Funny how quickly people see you as jealous and toxic when you openly state your opinion on such self-declared demi-gods, like you are some sort of infidel who needs to be silenced.

Yeap, that "toxic people" meme is one of the most nauseous things of our generation. Anws, like you know, I wrote two articles, one for toxic people and another one for the flashy celebrities :)

there are celebrities on Steemit?

"More known than the average folk"..not really.

Thought so.

Yea I agree. Doesn't mean you can't learn from them though. But you are not a carbon copy of them so trying to mimic them to become successful is stupid. Be uniquely you.

Ah, but i couldn't help myself here:
"The control we have on events in our life are extremely limited"
So you admit we do have some free will in our lives. Since we do possess some control. In your other post you made it seem as though we are just helpless humans floating through life with no free will or control. Nice to see you do know we have some control over our lives ;)

You can learn from anybody, anything. They don't need to be successful.

So you admit we do have some free will in our lives.

extremely limited. for example if i put a gold fish in a tank it has the "free will" i already set for it.

Then your post from the other day should have been titled instead of "we have no free will" to "we have extremely limited free will"
:)

You Shouldn't Take Advice From Those Who Are Successful - I totally agree with that ;-)

thank you

Thank you very much @kyriacos, you spoke my mind. I always believed that success depends on multiple factors from hardworking, to creativity, to opportunities and many others "hidden" events.

In Chinese there is a saying, "Upon the right time will make a hero", a hero is created by circumstances, they just merely were there at that precise moments where the conditions are well and made the "let's do it" decision and success followed.

I am not saying hard work or creativity doesn't matter, those increase your chances of getting into the "precise time" or create that "precise time" for success. And just like here in Steemit, many of us are following some whales, while tons of minnows are still scattered.

The true success way is to adjust your mindset to feel satisfy for what you have done regardless of the result, success should be something you felt, not defined by others~

Beautifully put.

OK so I wont take advice form people who are sucessful such as you, so if I am ignoring your advice, do I therefore take advice from others? Im so confused!! :)

Read the article. I explain. It is impossible that you have read it 30 seconds in

  ·  8 years ago (edited)

It wasn't 30 secs it was 2 mins and yes I did read it. I don't comment on posts I haven't read. And it was meant to be humorous!! Obviously failed!

there is a website called steemd.com that shows every single bit of your activity. You can check what time you posted in relationship to my post ;)

on one hand you are kind of right, but on the other hand taking advice from those who have experience is better, instead of asking those people who do not have experience about the subject is stupidity...

having experience is not the same as being successful.

omg, advice-ception :D

This is a very thought provoking post. Thanks a lot for posting it. I think for me the biggest issue for a lot of gurus or famous people for instance is what they say to do is different than their actual actions.

For instance, someone like Suze Orman who tells you to save your money and invest in stocks didn't actually become rich investing in stocks. In fact, she only has a minor portion of her wealth invested there. In her case, she mostly acquired wealth from her books and related TV shows. What she did to gain her wealth is different than what she tells other people to do.

I think ultimately people will have to not follow successful people and find their own path to success since our individual life circumstances can be so different.

Well put. There are so many examples, it is really mind boggling how people end up thinking like that

I think it also doesn't just apply to people. I think corporations also make similar mistakes. Through things like corporate benchmarking and trying to adopt other companies best practices, companies can also fail in trying to follow other successful companies. For instance, a company like Dell might fail in imitating a company like Apple since their corporate cultures are different or the market conditions were different at the time.

Excellent parallelism.

❦ Look how Flashy this Comment is ❧


"you have the same odds for winning the lottery as with a tiny asteroid landing on your right testicle", sounds even funnier if you are a woman... >_<


"Trying to take advice from a person that has lived a different set of events is futile", ok then, I guess I won't take your advice on this, but then again that's taking your advice on it :0


"I see some celebrities here on Steemit who "made it" advertising their success...by having common simpletons (that do not understand statistics) follow them"

Are you thinking what I'm thinking? Oh no, it would never work because I am not them ;)


❦ Don't forget to make me rich with your upvotes ❧

I think it depends what your definition of success is. If success = having a lot of money, then there are thousands of ways to get there and many won't apply to you at all.

But if you find someone who's successful according to your definition of success, then it might be a good idea to listen to their advice.

indeed. well said

Good post. You break down the biggest problem people have when they follow people, the problem, that they cannot recreate the exact same sequence. However, I believe people are also doing the wrong things when they follow someone. For example, if you follow the ideas of Warren Buffet you will be probably be better of, but you can't expect to become a billionaire just by following what he does. But then again, if you understand what his message is and successfully apply it to your own life you will most likely make more money than you otherwise would, with continuing the same way you always have (if you are not "successful"). Taking things too literally, however, will lead you to failing. You cannot recreate the same environment that another person had.

It can also be a bit misleading to say that life is about luck, well yes to some degree. But say you are born into a western family where things are ok. You have the ability to do great things with the help of other people. Again, just don't think that you should do everything they did. Understand what their main asset was and try to do that. If it was luck, forget it.

Just my two cents :)

Well being born in a western family is has 1:4 odds to begin with :)

Sure, my argument about that is because people in that situation are usually those who actually have the possibility to study someone elses life and learn from it :)

You can still get dealt bad cards though. e.g bad health, poor family...

Excellent point! I hope that more people realize that you can't treat everyone's life the same. You can live in the same house as someone (say a sibling) and still have lives with different outcomes. This is often evident in seeing how differently siblings end up, one being well off and another being not.

indeed

If i may add to this, following those ''celebrities'' except the fact that you keep making them generate money you lead steemit to become like instagram, facebook as far as it concerns the mindset and the community lvls. I get that you think following them and do whatever they do will lead into becoming like them and ''having money'' but i can say for sure that's not the case.

If you want more followers and money and in general in life to have success work hard and interact with more and more people. Just make posts that you like and you believe that add value in the platform and then just read other posts and interact with others, it's simple as that!

well said.

so true, and also people misunderstand the true concept of success :)

most always

the foto of that guy on the Ferrari looks sooooo succesful ahahah he looks like a twat.
cool read, but i dont totally agree that everything is luck. for example, if you see a girl that you find incredibly attractive and you wan to ask her out your not gonna just rely on "luck" to get her. if you did you would never get her, shes not gonna approach you, or even care who you are. people that say "i got lucky last nite" or with anything, they dont focus there energy on what they actually want.
they half ass it, they are afraid people are afraid of the things they want - success.

so i find that if i focus on the things that i want, luck has nothing to do with it, it comes down to me and how im taking control over my wants and needs. sure luck may play a small part in it, but overall its the effort to put into something that the results will come out.

I just realized that people are lazy, they dont want to put the work in, so they rely on "luck" ha!
slackers

if you did you would never get her, shes not gonna approach you, or even care who you are.

why not? she doesn't have a mind of her own? You could play her with your eyes and she could still come over.

never said you have no control at all. I said it is mostly luck.

  ·  8 years ago (edited)

I know you never said that. Im saying that its not mostly luck, its skill, determination, knowledge, hard work, time and so on. you cant just walk around and telling people that situations have happened to you cuz of your good luck, its more than just luck is all im saying

and about the girl thing, 9 times outta 10 she aint gonna approach you, I have bin approached b 1 girl in my life, but i have approached thousands. your the man, you gotta take all the risk, just the way it is in the dating game.

of course not.

nd about the girl thing, 9 times outta 10 she aint gonna approach you, I have bin approached b 1 girl in my life, but i have approached thousands.

maybe she is not worth it then. Why approach a woman that is so ...traditional? :)

i guess its a bit of an adrenaline rush. call me old skool than, im a man and ill act like a man, not one of these new age sensitive bi*(#@%

you can get the same rush even if you are old school

great advice, which many people should learn! will resteem for sure!

thank you

Great content! So are you saying my degree is worthless?
😜✌🏽🤣

all degrees are worthless

Except yours?

100 percent agree

Congratulations @kyriacos!
Your post was mentioned in my hit parade in the following category:

  • Comments - Ranked 8 with 217 comments

@kyriakos
You are the man...A true square peg in a square hole... I loved this ur lines where you stated inter alia. "There is a saying that the lottery is a form of tax for stupid people. People see the advertised winner and forget the millions of people that didn't win. In other words we pay attention to the wins and forget the losses (Kyriacos, 2017). Those lines sums it all up. I rest my case while asking you to keep it flowing while I keep upvoting & commenting.

thank you man

Take the advice that applies to your current situational and the rest you'll have to learn for yourself. Your path is not the same as the other guys'. Thanks for the advice @kyriacos, it's something we often forget.

yeap.

I agree with many premises and statements in your post, but not the conclusion you draw from it.

Following other people's strategies and emulating their tactics is too rigid of an approach. Life is dynamic and we all get unique stressors and feedback from life in any endeavor we pursue. Being locked in by other people's "laws for success" is just a symptom of a lack of belief in one's own judgement and lack of clarity as to where exactly one is going and why.

I sometimes wonder when rich and successful people explain why they succeded in life if they aren't completely oblivious as to the real reasons for their success.

I do not believe in luck. I find it frustrating to even try and penetrate the meaning of that word. Like destiny, I just don't know what it means.

What I believe in is vibration. I believe that people get the circumstances that they get for one simple reason: they attract them and draw them from life based on the vibrational soup of their being (I like tomato soup, and mushroom soup, but I digress...). When I read about someone like Bill Gates, I can't help but notice that life seemed to give him all he needed on his way to where he is now, especially in the beginning. Looking at it from a vibrational point of view, he is the perfect candidate to demonstrate the power of one's thoughts. He was allowed, by his upbringing and his environment, to think "higher" thoughts, and so he attracted "higher" things. But people can do it by changing their thoughts first, and attracting a new and better environment

I think that people should realize that life is custom made for each and every one of us. We are supposed to have unique experiences, so:

  1. practice stoicism (or something like it) and see your thoughts and emotions "from a distance"

  2. understand that clarity of thought will bring about clear solutions, so work on being clear

  3. know you have an unique journey ahead of you and you will have to, if you desire to be as happy as you can be, listen to your inner voice and discern what is right for you

  4. read Nassim Taleb to understand when experts suck and why:)

Peace, all!

good LUCK to you. lol

I do not believe in luck. I find it frustrating to even try and penetrate the meaning of that word. Like destiny, I just don't know what it means.

It doesn't matter if you believe in it or not. Luck is simply a poor understand of the unfathomable amount of events that are taking place at any point in time and space and how it relates to you.

What I think, is while you follow lives of successful and rich people, you're just wasting time that you could've spent on actually becoming rich and successful.
Isn't it true?

very much

Well worth the read. thank you for taking us to school on this. It makes sense to me.

glad you enjoyed it

thats right ..it is better to be realistic i know one day right people will recognise you ...

maybe so

Awesome read! :- )

I think one should be creative. By following successful people you see much idea's that will be milked out soon. By being creative you create new interesting content which users like to see. Just an idea :)

yeap

The day I want to become Warren Buffet I'll probably read what he read. By reading him I don't think I can ever surpass him.

Well written, as always.

We are what our fate wanted us to be,
We are where we are meant to be!

Very well written article however, sometime ago I read on newspaper that copying successful people's "good habits" is actually a good idea

  ·  8 years ago (edited)

that's like the worst place to take advice...

Holy shit 🤔

lol. quite accurate

If you want quick money, sell your soul. If you want to be successful and value your mental health, learn to swing trade/long term investing. ✌🏼Well that's my path(:

meh...you could go broke still with swing trade.

Well, some people might go broke swing trading. Depends who you are.

nobody can beat the market long term

Celebrities have thousands of followers in a short time, owing to their success and popularity outside of Steemit.

You are right about not emulating them, as that can only lead to disappointment.

No Look at me/Be like me for me. Thanks for an interesting post.

I wasn't specifically to Steemit but about in general in life

I know.. I was just talking about Steemit...because I see a lot of popular people walking in now.

As always a great post! You are one of the best content creator of this platform, I was talking about this very topic with a friend of mine few days ago. I completely agree with your point of view.

Thank you. Much appreciated.

Very interesting read! Thank you

you are welcome

I guess it's not really that bad to look at someone succeeds, thinking if they made it, you can do the same thing, as long as you are genuine and you go into the depths of what can you offer to bring value instead of just scratching what others already did.

thing is what works for them does not work for you

wow u r earning very good amount of money it's a dream to me please help me to grow my page please resteem my only 1 post please please

Agreed so much so that... FOLLOWED and RESTEEMED!

All steem ahead! Cheers

thank you

Always =)

#follow4follow

@frieda The following came to mind when I read your post:
"Perseverance is a great element of success. If you only knock long enough and loud enough at the gate, you are sure to wake up somebody" Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
and
"Great works are performed not by strength but by perseverance" Sameul Johnson

good one.

A self-disciplined mind goes a long way towards real success. I honestly scanned this article. Fear and misplaced exuberance influence all of us far more than we are willing to admit.

I do try to read counterpoint material if I make a decision that's important, like with money matters or spiritual matters.

i see

I feel a lot of the time the more famous youtube business motivators such as Gary V, Tai Lopez and that feel as if a lot of the time every video they're mentioning thing which benefit them. I do this for free blah blah blah.

:)

Thanks for this great post
Really is so great
Have a great and sunny weekend

what a great comment, great!

yes... You shoud do everything to be successful too))), but up to you)))

Payment for artistic success

oh dear...

hey i totally agree

good post @kyriacos...

You nailed it. I think that most people have great ideas/thoughts, they just dont act upon them. Also, the more you want to live like someone else it sparks negative energy which will effect your direction/decisions. Best keep a hard working drive, positive thought and Bless God each and every day....

Domi

I think you may have gone a little too much toward the 'there's no correlation' side to make a point about people that think 'there's a 100% correlation'.

Ultimately I think it's about the process, rather than the outcome. Also your own personal context and situation. There's certainly something to be learned from studying successful people and how they came to be but very little value in just 'cloning' their path.

  ·  8 years ago (edited)

There is something to be learned from studying all people. Heck there is more to be learned from those who fail rather than those who win.

I don't think there is a strong correlation to make a case about following successful people. Luck is a major game player.

He didn't say to follow successful People rather "study them". Even said not to try to clone them. different context

Again, even that is irrelevant. You can study anybody really. Still their characteristics would have nothing to do with what you are trying to do. different times, different content different dynamics,

heck, the same people that became successful might even try to follow their own strategies and fail. this is actually the rule rather than the exception.

So if you think "Luck" is the driving force behind or as you said "major payor" then please define luck in your own words? In this context most , not all, Successful people have used strategy to their advantage and strategy isn't the same thing as luck

  ·  8 years ago (edited)

I did already 3 times in this thread.

Luck is simply the poor understanding of the unfathomable amount of events that are taking place at any point in time and space affecting you.

Successful people have used strategy to their advantage and strategy isn't the same thing as luck

confirmation bias. unsuccessful people also used the same strategy. your point?

"I don't think there is a strong correlation to make a case about following successful people. Luck is a major game player."
So you are agreeing with me that "luck" in this context is actually when successful people use strategy to their advantage.
Therfore how could your definition of "luck" be a bad thing for unsuccessful people to attempt?
:)

So you are agreeing with me that "luck" in this context is actually when successful people use strategy to their advantage.

no. i am just saying that they being human and doing what everybody else does.

you need to stop making post-hoc fallacies

I agree in part. There is no doubt that life is much about luck. Buffett himself agrees with this as he says he won the Ovarian Lottery.
Surely there is much to be gained by learning principles from the wit and wisdom of Warren.

You can learn much the same amount of value from someone who failed. It doesn't matter who did it but how it relates to you.

Every single human being is different, we all have our own paths to follow. But I do not believe in luck, however I do believe in circumstances, dedication and consistency. With the last 2 you can "create" your own luck, but there is a difference! Whenever someone stumbles up something that's gonna bring them success, I analyse the circumstances, the odds. The whole "You got lucky" thing is best kept for fairy tales. Like for example, if I signed up a new client for my business, it's because I kept being consistent on my trade and worked hard for it, luck had nothing to do with it. If you're waiting to get lucky in order make your business a success, well let me tell you, if that's the case, you're gonna wait a LONG time.

Anyways, just my way of seeing it. We all have different ways of how we see things.

It doesn't matter if you believe in luck or not. It will come after you either way.

One could land a client just by showing in a random party wearing a tie that attracts your jackpot client. On the other hand you could play your cards right and happen to mention to something a word that disturbs the client because he has a childhood trauma.

life is mostly about luck either we like it or not.

Who wants to be the next George Soros?

You have to be really evil for that LOL

lol

I'm a common simpleton.

Well put. For every winner, there MUST be a whole lot of "losers". I am new to this and think i've stumbled into an honestly bizarre(to me) "crypto-culture" which seems to reject the idea of "the man" etc etc, all the while forgetting: you are TRYING to be "the man"!!! You're trying to be a wallstreet trader except the big difference is you are playing against an even more stacked field. Insider info? Lmao, this is crypto, there are no rules.

So while it's cool to look at recent wins like that jsnip fella, you must remember: This is capitalism. His wins came from SOMEWHERE.
This is blue horseshoe loves anacott steel, boys n girls. It's who you know.

well said. awesome nickname btw

You give really great advice . I would summarize my understanding of this into
Always filter other's perceived success through your own world , possibilities and expectations,
and :

Prefer to ignore the flashy folk. Most likely they are so full of themselves that when the tides turn, they won't know what hit them

thank you

It always depends, if you manage to use the advice you get from the autobiographies of people like Steve Jobs and Warren Buffet and customize it to your personal circumstance, you can benefit. But yes, if you follow blindly any advice of sucessful people you'll probably never get the same result as you can't know every detail of how they did it.
A good example is when Kobe Bryant said in an Adidas commercial that people see him being the best on the basketball field and think he is gifted or something, but what they don't see is the countless hours he's put in training, waking up early in the morning, the struggle, pain and devotion he has in order to reach that level of excellence.

It always depends, if you manage to use the advice you get from the autobiographies of people like Steve Jobs and Warren Buffet and customize it to your personal circumstance, you can benefit.

not always and not really. You could follow advice from a loser and be successful yourself.

A good example is when Kobe Bryant said in an Adidas commercial that people see him being the best on the basketball field and think he is gifted or something, but what they don't see is the countless hours he's put in training, waking up early in the morning, the struggle, pain and devotion he has in order to reach that level of excellence.

that's mostly self loathing. All athletes do this. ..he forgets to mentions his genes...

Its so frustrating because we're also told not to take advice from those who have never done it before. And so many other variations of who's advice we should or shouldn't take. I believe in learning from my own mistakes. So when i screw up i feel proud because i know i have just passed something that i will never do again in my life.

If that worked then most people on earth would be successful. they are selling fables to naive people.

So true. The person you're trying to emulate is perceived to be of value because they are offering something others don't. Once everyone follows that path, not only is the duplication less valuable, it also tends to dilute the value of the orignal contributor. Whith that in minde, people should refrain from the "just do what I did" calls to action. It may, for awhile, bolster their standings, but is not the best strategy for a long term success. People will eventually grow tired, leaving you branded obnoxious Old News.

very well said.

I absolutely agree with this post! All these online gurus aim for one goal -> making more money with their success story

exactly.

Thanks for this. I enjoyed it Andy resteemed it 👍🏻

thank you

Survivorship bias as others have mentioned, is completely at fault here. We like hearing about the person who made millions, but we disregard all the failures in the background.

Even with people who eventually are successful, we don't see all the past attempts they made where they didn't achieve their goals.

I don't feel bad seeing someone succeed. For me, it shows that it is possible, and I use that as inspiration to work on my own targets and systems.

well said

You are the best version of yourself, not anyone else. Great post

Fun Fact... this made my day. I am more on the page of @captaincanary because that is the purpose of mentor-ship. I believe the mistake is when people try to emulate all aspects of another's success when in fact, it's the underlying behaviors that you are to follow. The crazy thing about knowledge is that it has to be organized in order to use it.

Yes, I, too, like a crow, focus on the winner. I want to believe that I'm lucky, one of a million :)

:)

Exactly the reason that I threw out all my self help and other advice books years ago.

excellent

Nice writing. Interesting topic. I enjoyed the read. I believe luck has lots to do with life. I mean when the lions attack all the herd needs to do is not be the slowest/unluckiest. I think for humans though it has lots to do with who you know. Like my lil' brother always says "I make my own luck!"

thank you.

you can't really make your own luck. that's superstition. In order to be able to do that you have to control the future.

I think for humans though it has lots to do with who you know.

now you are talking

Haha I'm with you on that but it is something my brother says all the time. Confidence plays a big part in that.

Nice Article
Ferrari❤❤❤❤

lol

Interesting article and I enjoyed your sense of humor. If you want to follow someone's strategy, you should not do it blindly but to adapt the strategy to make it work for you.
That aside, I want to take you for your encouragement regarding my autistic son's artwork. I made done another collaboration with my son and I have mentioned you in the post.
https://steemit.com/art/@positivesteem/communicating-with-my-autistic-son-through-artistic-collaboration-those-fallen-leaves

Crapitalism too often lead us to value money over character.
Following a successful character may deliver better than following a financial wizard.
But not necessarily for your bank account.
My heroes have mostly died in prison, poverty, or both.

Well said

Thank you, you do well at this.

thank, YOU.

This was one of the best posts I have read in a long time. Congratulations - much wisdom here.

Thank you

Really inspiring piece, love contrarian thoughts like this.

It took me a while in my life to realize this, as i grew up surrounded by certain self help books/gurus who suggest you model your life exactly like certain so called "Successful People/Masters", it took me awhile in the real world to realize, this doesn't work as said, that there is no single formula, that life's much more complicated. Nowadays i try to discover and apply myself. This ancient axiom is still worth it today

"gnothi seauton"

"know thyself"

Please share more of this often.

Thanks.

and in greek "γνώθι σαυτόν"

you are welcome

I couldn't agree more!
Create your own success story, don't "copy" someone else.

indeed

I think the problem starts in school with learning subjects, life is not about subjects. Then kids are asked to decide what they want to be, and that puts them on a path that they might then feel they can not get out of.

yeap, school plays a major role

Thanks for the post!
I believe successful people have qualities that we can try to emulate if we genuinely believe that it will benefit us rather than distract us. Of course, we shouldn't follow them blindly, and we should adjust our expectations. Just because you copy someone's early morning routine (e.g. all those gurus that wake up at bloody 5 AM in the morning) does not guarantee you success. To me it all boils down to hard work and consistency. And even then, you might not get your success. But at least you tried.

Thing is everybody has good qualities. Heck most successful people tend to be assholes

That logic @kyriacos makes no sense. You just directly contradicted yourself.
"Everybody has good qualities....successful people are assholes "
So everyone doesn't have good qualities then?

No, being an asshole is a good quality. Look at Steve Jobs and how his asshorly made him a good boss. Heck, check most bosses. :)

Chelsea, don't rush

I guess everyones experience is different. You are essentially lump summing all "bosses " as assholes. Is that because you've had a lot of asshole bosses? A good boss mentors, challenges , appreciates, and values his or her employees because this increases morale. Being an asshole decreases morale leads to increased turnover which can clearly make your business less successful.
Steve Jobs is the exception to the rule. Maybe he is a super successful asshole. But again you did say we shouldn't try to follow successful People. Seems in this case you are a bit enamored by thequality of being an asshole

I guess everyones experience is different. You are essentially lump summing all "bosses " as assholes.

Not all, many. Let us not make over-generalisations.

Is that because you've had a lot of asshole bosses?

logical fallacy. begging the question

A good boss mentors, challenges , appreciates, and values his or her employees because this increases morale.

we all know the dictionary definition of the self-help class.

Being an asshole decreases morale leads to increased turnover which can clearly make your business less successful.

Steve jobs was admittedly asshole-asshole yet he build the most successful company on the planet. Your textbook parroting doesn't really cut it.

Steve Jobs is the exception to the rule. Maybe he is a super successful asshole.

No he is not. Ruthless bosses are the rule. true across history, whether we talk about business or politics.

But again you did say we shouldn't try to follow successful People. Seems in this case you are a bit enamored by thequality of being an asshole

Don't try to play psychologist online :) . it's pathetic.

Usually when people resort to personal insults such as calling someone pathetic is a clear sign of losing an argument. You are talking out both sides of your mouth and when i have a counter all you can say is 'don't play psychologist online" . Great job defending your views there buddy. Lmfao.

I didn't say you are pathetic. I said your choice about playing psychologist online is. You lost the argument long ago with your false projections.

Yeap I can definitely think of quite a number of successful assholes in my life. Not as many that are nice, humble or kind.

There's a saying success leaves clues and I think there's a lot of truth to it. That said we all are unique, have different skillsets and passions, so your path or your walk isnt going to be the same as mine and vice versa. That said as long as you understand that somene else's story isn't a recipe to be followed preicesly I think we can learn a lot from following things others who were successful before us did.

There's a saying success leaves clues and I think there's a lot of truth to it.

why?

That said we all are unique, have different skillsets and passions, so your path or your walk isnt going to be the same as mine and vice versa.

true

That said as long as you understand that somene else's story isn't a recipe to be followed preicesly I think we can learn a lot from following things others who were successful before us did.

You can argue that you could learn more from those who were unsuccessful

Some very interesting points. I can agree that following in the footsteps of successful people won't always bring you success, and usually won't, because a unique set of circumstances gave them that success.

On the flips side, successful people do tend to share certain traits. Don't copy the whole but take inspiration from the little things. It's a bit like diets, never follow a diet to the letter but find out why that diet does what it says and integrate it into YOUR diet. Take tips from successful people and integrate them into YOUR process but don't be afraid to adapt or even drop them.

I follow Caissey Neistat on youtube, but I'm 100% certain if I made videos like he does I'd have 0 followers. He can make those videos because he already has a following.

My strategy, learn from those doing slightly better than me, not those in the millions, their situations are totally different. But never copy someone, you never know what's different or what they are hiding - plus you never see the downsides, people hide those!

On the flips side, successful people do tend to share certain traits.

not really, all humans share those traits. we just tend to focus more on some because they are post-hoc exemplified by successful people. aka. after people become successful they start behaving the same and suffering from the same delusions. this is why they look the same in their autobiographies. Everyone writes them AFTER they become successful, not before.

I can see your point, I was thinking more about motivation, tenacity etc.
Of course, people can become successful by having none of those but that's truly random (lottery win etc) but I think we're all working towards the "earned success" if for no other reason than to improve our odds :)

It may just seem that way to me though as I'm a sufferer of ME (chronic fatigue) so motivation and endurance are huge problems for me. If I do too much in a day I pay for it in the next 2-3 days by being able to do nothing (that's why I'm sat writing comments today - I overdid it in the garden yesterday). It's all perspective. I just want to make a better me, step by step.

I can see your point, I was thinking more about motivation, tenacity etc.

well, again post-hoc. survivorship bias. You see those who used those traits and made it. others though who also used them didn't make it.

Of course, people can become successful by having none of those but that's truly random (lottery win etc)

the amount of successful people on the planet are very much distributed much like a lottery distribution.

ut I think we're all working towards the "earned success" if for no other reason than to improve our odds :)

you can try but the amount of your impact is extremely minimal.

It may just seem that way to me though as I'm a sufferer of ME (chronic fatigue) so motivation and endurance are huge problems for me. If I do too much in a day I pay for it in the next 2-3 days by being able to do nothing (that's why I'm sat writing comments today - I overdid it in the garden yesterday). It's all perspective. I just want to make a better me, step by step.

ok man. take care

True, no-one hears about the motivated failures. I guess at least if I don't make it then no-one will hear about it lol

As Sir Arthur Conan Doyle wrote, through the mouth of Sherlock Holmes - We can but try! :)

yeap

Any advice for a beginner

comment 80% of your time. post 20%

Interesting post. Can't say I agree with all of it though. Through careful and strategic focus one can create their own luck. Luck is really just a set of circumstances converging to create an opportunity. You can put yourself in a position to try and create as many of those circumstances as you can and then take advantage of opportunities.
While success is not a single formula that everybody can follow, it is something that can be achieved by taking certain actions and thinking a certain way. Also, how you deal with the curve balls that invariably get thrown at you, can help you to take advantage of such situations and respond to other situations more positively in the future.
I guess the bottom line is that you can live your life just thinking everything is fate, luck or whatever, or you can live your life strategically and begin creating your own luck. Some successful people just want to share their experiences and get that message across.

I didn't say everything is fate. I said most of it.

Yes, you did say we have some control over our lives. Bravo.
I agree with @unclehermit living strategically creating your own "luck" vs manifesting "oh I'm doomed bc everything is fate" theory. There wouldn't be any buffets to speak of if that was the case

VERY TRUE

Thank you for your vote, also vote for you and follow you. I hope the same from you...

"The "Look at me/Be like me" success stories are nothing but self-loathing narratives that people use to market themselves."

I took drugs just to find ego death. I got really close once but resisted..
I think the issue is that its fun showing off your hard work, showing off that Mil. I like nice cars and food and taking pics. I made this year..... blah. Do you know how hard its been not talking to my friends or family. Just showing up in my nice car is.... AHH! no winning. Im a stupid guy that now has $, and way less friends... #sucks

I was once flat broke even after winning a famous design award which I wont mention. I then read Napolian Hills Think Big and Grow Rich. I followed it religiously and went from, sick, broke and almost homeless to becoming an AD for a 3 hundred million dollar company earning a thousand plus a day permanently to owner of a company on 3 stock markets with the need to never work again. So I don't agree based on my own experience. I think everyone should be coached to achieve their goals. I just used a book.

i don't buy it.

Not a problem. I dont think you're aiming to become financially free. I'm sure you're happy enough where you are. When you wake up one day and ask yourself, is this it?! Is this all i wanted to achieve, that might be the day you want to change. But if you dont believe in yourself then you'll never change. Not that anyone has to change. I lived myself on a greek island, i loved it!

worth reading!

I fully agree with you on this writeup. Successful people brag by claiming to have the magic wand to life. My take is do your best to make it and be yourself

exactly

Thanks for sharing this post. It really made me think about the people who should and shouldn't give advice and the ones we should take advice from. Great piece.

thank you

You are right, a big mistake when we admire successful people, because not necessarily what we see in accordance with what we think.

yeap

Congratulations @kyriacos

You took 59 place in my Top 100 of posts

Great Post and Work!!! Upvoted, Follow me and I Follow Back!! Regards!!

I go t a laugh at that picture of the guy lying on a ferrari!
XD