Regarding the 50/50 Curation and Author Debate

in busy •  6 years ago 

The cryptocurrency markets are down and Steem is no exception. For all of us great and small that has equated to taking a pay cut each and every day. The stress is starting to show.

If you are a blogger you have likely seen the dollar amount of your earning decreasing with no end in sight. If you are a stakeholder you've watched your Steem Worth steadily dropping.

The site has seen less activity and participation and it feels bad.

There has been a flurry of proposals to change the economy of Steem.

I like the idea that the community is attempting to find solutions and stop the bleeding of the value of Steem.

The 50/50 debate is among the most interesting proposals I've read because it is counter-intuitive.

Currently, we see a 75/25 Author/Curation Split.

image.png

The proposal changes the distribution of rewards - if approved a $10 dollar post would pay roughly $5 dollars to the poster and $5 would be spread to the curators. (upvoters)

At first glance, it seems that Content Creators would earn less. However, the idea is to change behavior. If you could earn by curating excellent articles and engaging with them, maybe people wouldn't feel the need to post as often, which might create fewer posts with more engagement.

The theory is that there would be less motive to post and more motive to curate and engage.

No one knows if this measure would work and there is a lot of discussion about it. Many predicting they are the only one who really understands how this will work.

It could work as intended and create fewer posts with more engagement, lower the profit margin on voting bots and reduce the number of shit posts. Or on the other hand it could backfire and become a gameable way to "bet' on who's posts are going to earn the most and direct most of the rewards to Authors that people assume are going to be successful. This would happen as a result of chasing the now more profitable curation rewards.

My thoughts are we are going to have a long grind waiting for SMTs and I see zero indications that there will be a huge Crypto Pump in the near future. (not seeing it doesn't mean it will not happen) So, I am glad to see anything that pumps some life back into Steem, gets large stakeholders to come out and discuss and debate topics. Those who are pushing these changes would have the motive to help make the changes successful. Although it is risky it is a calculated risk, and I am FOR changing to 50/50 rewards. That doesn't mean anyone is going to code it, drop it and ask that it be included in a future hardfork. None the less, it is great to see animated discussions and attempts to bring value back to Steem.

In the meantime, there are plenty of things we can do to improve our current situation without code changes.

Fight abuse via flags
Support Engagement

We already have the tools to reduce the flow of Steem out of the system by bad actors. I made a post a couple of days ago about an account that was obviously fake and plagiarizing content and had been voted up via the bots, although my post got quite a bit of engagement, very few followed up with flags to return those funds to the reward pool. I guess because they think it is cheaper to watch the value of Steem drop than it is to break out their flags.

In addition, we bleed users because many stakeholders are busy stacking tokens, and are uninterested and uninvolved in ensuring the rewards go to those who are putting the effort in on the site.

I manually curate every day with both flags and upvotes. I engage and comment, if your stake is sitting around doing nothing or you are choosing to burn it, why not delegate to someone who is actively trying to make this site work? If you don't want to delegate, feel free to follow my votes.

@whatsup

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@whatsup,
I would like to support this proposal! Author will not earn less by this change! Coz people will start upvoting more! So, this is better and it might help us to pump STEEM as well!

Cheers~

Good points. Kinda funny how back-and-forth this is sending my mind on haha.

On one hand: Better curation rewards could equal more upvotes on good content
On the other hand: Less author rewards could equal content-creators feeling demotivated and leaving the platform.

I think one of the main things that plague current Steem content-creators, and it's really a shame, is they feel entitled to rewards. I'm sure you've talked about this very issue before, if my memory serves me correctly. Lots of people simply feel like Steem is for them to make money, NO ONE ELSE!!11!!!1

Whichever route we take, there needs to be a major push to re-educate Steemians on that fact that... Hey, sometimes shitty photos of frogs don't deserve $50 upvotes. [ shameless plug to a photo I posted earlier today hahaha ] It's ok to post low tier stuff, memes, cellphone-photos, tweet-lengthed posts, etc. That's good, and to be honest I somewhat encourage the occasional "jot". But not every fart that comes outta your head should earn you a weekly salary. That's just not how any of this works.

I don't think I've ever told you this, so I'll say it now, thank you for using your flags. It's a tough thing to do, even I struggle to flag people. But I do see it as immensely important, when done right, of course.

I totally understand being able to see both sides of this debate. I can see it also.

what I am totally against is .. The reward curve element, which will totally stack rewards to the same people.

Yes, I totally agree that Steemians, in general, need to see this from all sides. Investors, Content Creators, Developers all have a valid point of view and different goals.

One of the best ways to get more of what you want.. Is to find out what others want and try to help them get it.

Educating people is tough. It's extremely difficult for the general public to look beyond the surface of anything. When there is immediate reward for an immediate action, that's what's going to happen.

The moment the system itself rewards good content and incentivizes proper upvotes, you will see engagement leaps and the Steem blockchain will propel itself upward at a speed that might be unimaginable at the moment.

Nevertheless, I truly admire your relentless efforts to the betterment of this community and platform, keep up the good work!

A very different idea I have to protect the reward pool is to build in a weekly limit on how much any one account can "earn" - say 500 Steem - so that accounts couldn't constantly do massive bot and self votes.

Don't say commie stuff like that! lol!

3500 a week seems a bit too capitalist!

https://steemit.com/@chbartist

Well, on that topic we will have to disagree. He is abusing the apathy of the community.

If nobody even sees his boring fake positivity posts, isn't that more just slipping under a non existent radar?

We are making the same argument. I call it apathy, you call it unviewed. We have a curation responsibility.

How on earth could we do anything about thousands of dollars a week of bot votes using flagging?

Like this... Who would decide it is okay to upvote this?

https://steemit.com/pregnancy/@bindubobinson/baby-blues-new-mom-feelings

It is being done, because no one wants to spend their stake, to stop it. We are watching the value bleed out because people do not want to flag this... For one week if everyone flagged the shitty posts,... It would be over, just that fast.

  ·  6 years ago (edited)

All we have to do is flag away the profits. It doesn't have to be taken down to zero.

If people see it doesn't pay to promote shitty content, then people will stop promoting shitty content.

If 50/50 reduces the number of crap posts i'm all for it. (I post a lot of crap too, but I try to be original)

75/25 versus 50/50 could be good or bad, I’ve seen cogent arguments both ways. I’ve yet to decide which side of the fence I’m on.

Some of the people suggesting 50/50 are also touting a change to the Author reward curve. Good or bad, that change might be an even bigger issue.

Strangely, I’ve never seen any discussion about whether the curation square root curve might warrant a revisit. The author curve question comes up again and again, but the curation curve seems to get little attention. Why?

I think we already had both in the past and it didn't work well. That's why they changed it to today's system.
I don't see the point to roll back to something that it's proven that it didn't work.

This is a valid point as well, and I guess I'd say the stakeholders' values will always control the distribution of the site, no matter how we tweak it.

It all starts and ends with Steem Power.
As the old saying goes:
no matter how you turn your butt is always behind you.

Let’s assume for the moment that the curation square root curve is doubleplusgood. If so, why no discussion of also using it for the author curve?

That is a really interesting point regarding the curation curve, I guess I don't look at that element, because I can't picture how it works, in part... because it is never discussed. (lol)

I agree the change could be good or bad, if it gets stakeholders engaged, I'm for it.

yo 50/50 might actually solve out bot issue! I would gladly take a cut in post earnings to actually enjoy the trending page again haha

  ·  6 years ago (edited)
The theory is that there would be less motive to post and more motive to curate and engage.
Interesting take but I wonder what happens with the newbies with almost zero SP, how much are they going to earn from manual curation rewards if their votes worth almost nothing? At least in posting there is a chance to catch someone's attention from time to time. The higher the sp the higher the curation rewards, right? Also, new users won't be capable of upvote so much because their RC's. Only the bigger accounts will benefit from a more curation focused platform

This is a pretty fair point that I hope gets added to the discussion. We shouldn't just view this as simply as "will stakeholders vote more with 50/50?". It needs to be more of a "will everyday joe's engage more with 50/50?" type of talk.

Also, the "quiet" part of the story is it would make bot voting less attractive and return some of that money to the reward pool. I am not pretending to know the outcome, just trying to try the idea on.

This would be great for us

.....why not delegate to someone who is actively trying to make this site work?

Posted using Partiko Android

My only concern is that it seems too soon to propose changes too soon before reviewing the impacts and implications of the last Hard Fork. However, I think it is great that ideas are being shared around the community and that witnesses are being quite proactive with opinions and transparency when engaging. It seems as though they seem more accountable than it the past.

That is another good point. I don't think the development would happen quickly... if at all. However, point noted.

Its worth a try, seems nothing else is working, 50/50 is fine with me..
I flagged on that post, :)

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