$ETC has much more potential for growth than $ETH, no bubble, solid backing.
Today I decided to go long on ETC, so you should know I do own some now.
Why?
This tweet by Emin Gün Sirer:
Yes, I know he is talking about ETH, but that is not the point. The point is if the killer App is Tokens! then why invest in something that already has too many tokens. Why not start at the bottom with projects that have a lot of room for growth and the ability to add killer apps?
Although ETC was born out of Ethereum developers incompetency, I think I will give it a chance to prove itself. Another reason that prompted me to change my mind is the fact that soon we might have to deal with two Bitcoins and be forced to pick one over the other or accept both. UASF: user activated soft fork for Bitcoin will happen on August first.
Risks vs Rewards:
I know betting the underdog is a long shot, but also putting your money on a sure bet does not always work. But I do not regret losing my bet with @ned on the elections, to be honest if I knew he was a comedian I would have voted for him, covfefe.
Basic Attention Token (BAT): listed on Bittrex exchange, ICO price ~1500 SATS reached as high as 15K SATS before rolling back a bit. Collecting ROI and waiting on free coins is a great feeling. BAT has a lot of potential for future growth. Even vaporware like AMP reached 85k SATS at one point, and this is nowhere near that by comparison, but coin supply is very close. The AMP price even to this day is puzzling, it makes me think STEEM is way undervalued.
or Expanse... first ETH clone, still only at 24 mill marketcap...
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Why is an ETH clone needed? Is it better than ETH in some way?
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It's ideologically different. Code is law!
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But for those people we already have ETC?
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Vitalik met with Putin today... guys, i know these Russians and it might well be the end of ETC :)
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Bought some Expanse recently. Definitely think it's undervalued and I like the Bonds app earning me a 12% return.
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Expanse looks pretty good, I notice that certain coins definitely follow similar graphs. http://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/expanse/
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There is a reason for the market cap. Support and development is worth a lot.
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ETC has VC support, that others lack.
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Quite clearly a scam...
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For what is ETC even used for? I realize that ETH is all hyped up as a BTC killer but that's not gonna happen. And yes, Steem is highly undervalued since it's one of rare coins actually used for something besides pump/dump POLO adventure. Hope to see it rise much more than it is now by the end of this year.
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Ethereum powers smart contracts and tokenized assets. There are many applications running today and many businesses building on top of Ethereum.
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So the future of ETH is more tied with apps?
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Apps are the entire point of ETH in the first place.
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Yeah so ETH's future is Apps but also currency.... in a very unique way.
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Well the value of ETH is really the POS and Gas in the network to run the apps. Yes it will be used as a speculative asset but more along the line of the incentive mechanism powering the Ethereum applications.
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There are many "experiments" running today - all choked up on high gas prices and low transaction speed.
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I would consider that inaccurate. 4Gwei gas is the norm now, even lower if you don't mind waiting 2 stinking minutes. I get confirmations in the next block with proper fees, a cent or two. Call them "experiments" all you want. What does ETC have running?
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I'm not an advocate for ETC. The only real working decentralized application running on a block chain is steemit. It would not be possible to run this on ETH or ETC. Those chains have a long way to go technology wise to get on graphene's level. Speculation wise there is probably a pretty penny to be made in ethereum alts, but market cap doestot reflect intrinsic value. Steem does more daily tx volume than Bitcoin and ethereum combined and look at where it is. We have a huge bubble circa 1999 on the horizon, it will make us all rich, but unless ethereum solves the scaling problem it wont survive.
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Well steem and ETH are very different blockchains with very different tradeoffs. Steem is absolutely not the only application running on a blockchain. Steem/graphene make serious tradeoffs to get the speed they deliver. There will always be tradeoffs for speed and security.
There are plenty of solutions to ETH scaling issues.
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what security tradeoff are you talking about?
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They have a small set of federated block producing nodes. This is much different than other consensus mechanisms and makes many tradeoffs on the security side to allow for fast transactions.
Look at the Mauve paper below for a better idea of what some of these tradeoffs are:
https://cdn.hackaday.io/files/10879465447136/Mauve%20Paper%20Vitalik.pdf
https://medium.com/@VitalikButerin/safety-under-dynamic-validator-sets-ef0c3bbdf9f6
https://medium.com/@VitalikButerin/minimal-slashing-conditions-20f0b500fc6c
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What about bitcoins transaction speed and prices? WAY worse than Ethereum.
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Bitcoin is the most valuable shitcoin on the market
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Ethereum is not a ment to be a Bitcoin killer. Period.
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It's not about what it's used for, it's about what it's not used for.
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I agree.
Where oh where will all of those ETH miners go later this year?
:thinking:
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They will mine HUSH ;)
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I have since it was called Zdash, its a sleeper
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We're gonna take it some neat places, I need to post more about the ones I've thought of the last week and update the roadmap!
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Awesome, cant wait to hear more!
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DDOS? JK
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Golem ;)
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I'm very interested in Golem
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Golem is one of the most well known projects building on ETH. It is very popular and their first product version is coming public within two months.
Those who are very interested in Golem should watch this video:
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Thanks, going to blog the video, thanks for the info.
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Congratulations @joseph! You have completed some achievement on Steemit and have been rewarded with new badge(s) :
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Thanks for the heads up on the date of the Bitcoin soft fork. Is that when it will split in two if it happens? How will that effect the price do you think? Perhaps the ETH-ETC split could be used as some sort of predictor. I know very little but would guess there would be a period of high volatility until the market decides which one it likes best.
You know way more than me. What do you think?
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Aug 1st, from what I understand, doesn't necessarily mean a split for BTC, I think that is worst case scenario or perhaps if it does split it's temporary. But if the same thing happens to it that happened to ETC, I think, given the history of something like that goes, the newer version is the one to invest in. Could be a huge opportunity, what do you think?
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I will write another post about the soft fork with more details.
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Great. I will look out for it.
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Everything needs it's time to get its justified attention, and sometimes momentum can change very fast! It's just like as it is in sports: when the leader loses his attention he becomes delicate for failure and when he sees his goal slipping too much tension's building up so that David passes Goliath in the end of the game!
I had two dogs, they were bros; from birth on one of them was very strong and tall and the other one was exact the opposite; but he was the clever one, he was the first to go upstairs without my help and he also was the first to jump into the car. The same I see in ETH and ETC, while the big might fail little brother, the unloved one will surpass!
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despite the current undervaluation of STEEM covfefe
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yes covfefe indeed :D
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IDK how true it is, but some people messing around with google translate claim it means "I will stand up" in Arabic, which makes perfect sense in the context ;)
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oh I saw so many meanings, to me it means even presidents make typos :D
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Haha yeah, and particularly this president, tbh I don't mind because typos mean at least he himself is using his twitter, rather than a team
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I disagree entirely.
Your certainly right about the token economy. Too bad that is happening on ETH right now. The token economy will be blockchain agnostic - let the ETH point stand as a metric of market assessment
You probably want to check out my comments on ETC here, lots of information not often discussed. Why Consensus: the tale of the two Ethereums
https://steemit.com/ethereum/@kyle.anderson/more-money-for-the-early-visionaries-why-the-eth-chain-is-so-successful-revisiting-why-consensus
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One thing I agree on is it just makes you think how undervalued steem is! I was lucky to be a part of the ETH bubble in the past few weeks.
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I love steem, but I've been looking into some people's opinion of inflation being a problem with Steem... what are your thoughts on that?
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My worries as a trader is that some ETH supporters started to think of Tokens as the killer App and if that is the case, the argument for bubble grows stronger. What will be the equivalent of the SEC if ETH turns out to be nothing but an ICO platform. I know nobody want's regulations, but where is the self regulation? Who will make people whole when the bubble burst and 70% of these Killer Apps kill people's life savings?
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I don't doubt the token bubble will pop. I can't wait. It needs to.
I'm still passionate about ETH for some of the reasons stated above. I think the market has agreed.
Let's see after the hype dies down.
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I can not argue against anything in this answer. It all boils down to wait and see.
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make people whole? why should anyone or anything do that? invest at your own risk like anything in life.
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Yeah they are going to lose their money. They need to. Some people need to learn the hardest lesson. This is simple economics.
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Yeah, I don't want anyone to come to harm. But, for any investment, people need to learn about it and use it in the context of proper portfolio sizing for their overall financial situation. Stocks, real estate, cash savings, crypto, whatever.
If we are going to advocate "something" (i.e. the government) is going to make us whole if we lose money on crypto then we are inviting government to regulate and control it - and kill it. Also, people need to get into their heads the lesson that the more dependent you are on the government the more at its mercy you are - a slave.
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Congratulations @joseph!
Your post was mentioned in my hit parade in the following category:
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ETC it doesn't even have to be actually better project.. it only have to make enough people believe it ...
the crypto market is much more speculative than the stock market !
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Try and research about the ETH hard fork.
Take a look at how and why Ethereum Classic has been created. Also about the massive Ethereum hack.
Some Bitcoin holders were not happy that Ethereum has been developed.
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ETH vs ETC history
https://www.reddit.com/r/ethtrader/comments/6d62td/the_story_behind_ethereum_classic_etc_and_whos/
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Trying to buy BAT like
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Can you tell me more about BAT?
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Basic Attention Token, Based on ERC-20. Is meant to monetize advertisements more effectively. More importantly, its founded by the creator of Mozilla Firefox.
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lol, yep. You can get it on Liqui though.
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This is what I've been saying! lol ETC baby!.
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I have invested in ETC some time ago. Thanks for the good read, it gives me hope that my feeling might have been right from the start. Let's do this!
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There are no grantees, but ETC did not get the price appreciation like all the other alts got this year.
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You might want to read over my post linked above. The immutability you value may not be what you think it is on ETC.
https://steemit.com/ethereum/@kyle.anderson/more-money-for-the-early-visionaries-why-the-eth-chain-is-so-successful-revisiting-why-consensus
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Definitely agree with the conclusion that STEEM is still way undervalued!
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eth amazing
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Not likely eth has established application and etc is speculation
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Does anyone feel like ETC will be worth more? Why?
Let's start a convo :)
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Good to know..... I'm glad I read your article!
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Excellent post. I like that it creates more questions than it provides answers. It is very engaging.
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I think your wrong on picking ETC over ETH. You might have a short term gain, but in the long run ETH will grow more than 10x the value of ETC
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nice....your post deserve my upvote and resteem....
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Will a new tax code kill the cryptos?
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They do not make TAX code to kill a new source of income, but to utilize it.
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How do they tax cryptocurrency now? Isn't it perfect for tax evasion' you don't think their working on a way to monitor and tax the hell out of it!
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well, you're supposed to report realized gains. And, that's why the lovely IRS is attacking Coinbase right now and trying to get records of everyone using it.
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don't keep your ctypto on coinbase :)
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I think Ethereum won't give the throne easily. Their whole platform (not only coin) has huge success and attracts big investments!
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Indeed, is like you said, STEEM has more potencial that people can see.. Thanks for yout post, keep going like this! =D
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Cool posts from you @joseph
I like it ^_^
Good job..
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https://steemit.com/ethereum/@tornadojoe/ethereum-call
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My two best long term hold coins are Stratis and ETC. They've been mega solid performers and I haven't even been holding them for that long! (1 and 1/2 months)
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Sadly I sold Stratis early due to some misunderstanding. But long time ago I promised myself no regrets in crypto.
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That is unfortunate....but we all miss stuff. I read about RDD and its initial readings looked like a total scam to me (low volume, old holders, massive sell walls) at 5 satoshis. If I put in even 2% of my portfolio at barely any risk I would've been happy. Now I know!
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Yes, that's what I tell myself quite often :D
or more like " If I only knew "
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Stratis... sigh... the one that got away. I was late to that party and investigating it the week before it started taking off. Not wanting to chase it, I just watched it continue to run.
~kicks self~
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Nice post thanks for sharing!
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im holding equal ETH and ETC right now though ;)
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:-/ This comparison is major.
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I mine ETC sometimes when it's more lucrative than Ethereum. I like the coin and I really do think it could go places!
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ETH is King
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if this is true, I have alot of mining power in genesis mining for my ethereum, and youre making me really scared!! :(
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Thanks for the info
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I wrote an article about this earlier. Agree 100%!
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I think ETH has more than just the moniker of BTC killer, It has smart contracts and it's going POS, much more efficient than BTC mining. As a payment coin, it is faster and the networking fees are fare less more expensive that the overpriced, clogged BTC network.
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winning
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agreed .
ETC has more potential.
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Good post @joseph. I agree with you ETC has legs to grow..
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Its also nice to remember that if you mined or purchased Ethereum in the early days before the major Fork and had it in your wallet you also own ETC. https://steemit.com/ethereum/@pauls/ethereum-fork-step-by-step-guide-to-safely-splitting-your-eth-etc
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Here's the thing: Ethereum classic is NOT changing from proof-of-work to proof-of-stake like the regular Ethereum is. Though you might see some gain, I really think without the transition to Casper ETC might not be all that great...especially without the massive funding and connections that ETH has.
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Almost every coin that has converted from POW to POS had an initial pump followed by continuous dumps. We will see if ETH breaks that pattern
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I mean, I believe there's gonna be overhyping after any news and a consequent dump/correction. (Well, except after the EEA announcement I guess because that was huge).
It's probably a good strategy to keep ETH and sell after the POS change/pump then. Could you mention a few coins that switched to POS and had this pump/dump? Also, I'm not very knowledgeable as to whether or not STEEM is POW or POS...
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STEEM is DPOS, delegated proof of stake. Which means only community voted witnesses can produce blocks.
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Why is there so much jargon invovled in trading crypto currency? If I only knew what some of these sayings mean. I want to invest, but with even a masters in finance I feel like a block chain .... I mean head.
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Eth value pushes etc value. For me eth is gold etc is clay.
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I think your logic is flawed here.
The answer to the question is: NETWORK EFFECTS.
there is no such thing as too many tokens, just like for a smartphone eco-system there is no such thing as too many apps, since every app makes the eco-system more valuable. -> NETWORK EFFECTS
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@crypto-curt have a look
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have eth and etc, but I am a bigger fan of waves now, because all icos will be launched on it soon, in my opinion its possible that waves can be soon the standard platform for doing an ICO instead Ethereum but check up my Blog for other Hig Value Infos!
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My opinion of Waves is well known already. So I will not comment on Waves right now.
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Better buy steem now when it's still undervalued.
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In the case of cryptos, clones are good!
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I like ETC for several reasons. One of which, the team behind. The CEO, was previously head of ETH, very smart and looking long way deep in the future.
Great road map, pretty ambitious too, which I see as a plus. And also among all the rest of great things, there are working on a new code which will come about in late 2018, similar to smart contract but will have an additional extra point in favour. Which I will wait to reveal in future :)
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Head of ETH? I'm pretty sure Vitalik Buterin was the head of ETH before the split and is the head of ETH now...
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My opinion about ETC is very similar. I published about ETC on my crypto investment sections:
https://steemit.com/bitcoin/@arvydas/cryptocurrency-investments-2-ethereum-classic-etc
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I am Hodling to my ETC like this guy.
Been doing it since the DAO.
The best are yet to come
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I have sell it all just a week ago.
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ETH has more devs getting a paycheck than BTC... lol. ETH will pass BTC mext year. ETC will be an underdog favorite. Competition is always good :)
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It would be great to see ETC grow. I am curious though. What dapps are currently running with ETC?
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I was also quite fond of investing in ETC, but then I read about the DAO incident and that made me kind of reluctant to want to invest in ETC. However, I understand your point of view that in terms of investing it sounds like a solid option, short term. I quite like supporting projects like Steem, Lbry and Storj because these coins possess a viable product. I would like to hear your thoughts on investing in penny coins? Worth the risk? Coins like Reddcoin and Bitbean?
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The future is bright for the crypto world but it is important to be diversified.
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Agree. I have been white knuckling my ETC since the split, and picked up a bit more since then. Prices now are happy. I'm looking forward to euphoric. ;)
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Upvote and followed. Thanks!
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Appart from speculation what is the value of etc? At the moment I only have invested in eth because I don't see what it has to aport.
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All value in crypto is based on speculation so far, even bitcoin. It will remain that way until industrial and institutional use of blockchain technology becomes a reality.
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So true...
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It always make me feel pity about ourselves who lives in Hong Kong when I see comments like this one. I mean when you realize that the property prices now in Hong Kong are at record high but base on nothing physically.
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where can i buy some ETC?
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I am holding ETC, people will soon realise its true potential.
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Whats being built on ETC?
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Good comparison
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Why would an older gerneration of this tech be more likely to suceed?
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mantaps
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Excellent your analysis on ETC and ETH
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thanks for your explantion
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Thanks for the information, still trying to understand all this.
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2017, the year where we make arguments by reposting tweets... The value of ETH is not very tied to the value of its tokens. Also exactly why is many tokens a bad thing?
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Look like bipyramidal formation
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Yeah and I was thinking about it as well lately. You help decide for a moment. Thanks for the tips :)
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I also have bought some ETC last year but it has not incresed like ETH has grown up. They are like the two sons of the same mothers, why so much difference between them.
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Utility - ETH is the one promoted by the Ethereum team and getting various tokens built on it. Until tokens are being built on ETC, it probably won't enjoy the same level of popularity. I'm banking on it happening. It still may never catch ETH, but even at half it'd be nice. Right now it can't even maintain 1/10th.
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