"The reason many wealthy business owners support open borders is purely for their own bottom line interest"
-- Bernie Sanders
I could kiss you. You just stumbled upon the great moral virtue of free markets: leveraging people's subjective self-interest to get them to voluntarily, peacefully do good things they'd otherwise have no interest in doing.
Yes, a lot of market actors want open borders for their own self-interest. And a lot of immigrants want to immigrate for their own self-interest. And a free market allows both of those people to get exactly what they want without hurting anybody.
Bernie and other immigration opponents, on the other hand, see that same dynamic and yet want to use the violence of the state to prevent both of them from fulfilling their interests. What gives?
I really think it's nationalism. I do.
Bernie thinks it's the American government's job to protect American workers. And if that means keeping Mexican workers out, then fine. And if it means stealing jobs from Bangladesh, then fine.
The interests of Americans trump the interests of foreigners. Even when it's an interest against a right.
Large multinational companies working together with corrupt third world Governments perform quite a number on the citizens of these third world countries. They take advantage of high unemployment to push wages to a bare minimum. Long working hours are used to minimise the number of workers employed to maintain the high unemployment to keep wages suppressed. When people are desperate and starving they will take whatever they can.
If multinational companies packed up and left. There would, without doubt, be hardship forced upon the third world country. This, in time, can be solved through entrepreneurship. Most third world countries have the natural resources to be able to start something. Necessity is a great driver for success. This is Darwin 101, survival of the fittest.
In regards to open borders. I support open borders because I support freedom. Those entering another country still need to demonstrate their worth. They need to fill the gaps wherever they can.
Nationalism can be expected as part of life. Many groups have strong traditions and cultures and outsiders can be perceived as intruders. We can not fight basic human nature (ape nature, gorillas often reject new additions to their troop) on that. Anyone new to a society should expect to be treated with distrust. Eventually, as people start to assimilate, this distrust will fade. Sadly, this tends to take a very long time with some cultures.
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with open borders American can become just as big a shithole as the places people come from.
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Many of those places are shitholes because of American foreign policies and American multinational companies. The people fleeing those countries have very little to do with those places being shitholes.
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LOL, the people fleeing have everything to do with those places being shitholes. Those places were shitholes prior to American multinational companies ever existing.
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Drought and nature are harsh, and many people have died without any human intervention. We are very lucky for the civilization our forebearers constructed, but there is more work to do.
Laying most of the modern hardship at the feet of humanity isn't very accurate. That said, corruption needs to be rooted out of our public services and the corporations. Transparency is critical!
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I think violent cultures like American gang culture has a really negative impact on its participants and proximal peoples.
Even though manipulation is rife in America's Western-culture, and let's be honest manupluation is rife in most of our world, I think our standards of freedom are the best systemically established standards in modern times! American #CommonLaw allows #logos, reason to reign supreme in affairs between sovereign individuals, and I would not trade it for any other system!
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Yup, America may not be perfect but it is the best and we should not destroy it by failing to secure it's borders.
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Well, it is American govt after all , it is not world government.
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how dare they?!
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I think we have argued vehemently on this person's account before?
@funbobby51
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maybe, I do like to argue with people, though not that vehemently.
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I find it to be amazing that we have found a point to agree upon , judging from last conversation it seemed highly unlikely !!
Probably the only thing we would agree on...I think
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I don't recall our last discussion but perhaps you would find we have more in common than not. The more often you are right the more often you will agree with me. ;)
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there you go...already disagree with you..by for now
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it all starts with agreeing with me once.
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🙆🙆👏👏👏
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Flood labor markets; lower wages.
-Not my first choice.
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Yup, even Bernie Sanders understands that without America the whole world would be a shithole. It is not the American governments job to protect American workers?
Hmm?
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