The Joys [/sarcasm] of Internet Discussion

in life •  7 years ago  (edited)

Online debates are always frustrating for a few very simple reasons, and all of these reasons boil down to either people who resort to fallacies to support their position, or people who are only online to troll others for personal amusement. Below, I offer some examples of bad arguments I have faced and my responses describing their fallacious nature along with my rebuttals

It is only fair to point out that my position is that of the classical liberal, and my foundational principles are individual liberty and natural rights. If you oppose the concept that each individual is responsible for his choices and actions, we may not be able to make progress here. Nonetheless, life, liberty, and property are the foundation of any discussion about rights because as I stated before, these are universal and reciprocal measures to define the limits of anyone's sphere of authority and the boundaries of trespass against others. This is doubly important because the specific arguments I confront often use a counterfeit version of these principles as their basis.


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Example argument: Immigration.

1. "He's an illegal immigrant!"
This is an appeal to authority rather than a rational argument. Legality has no bearing on morality or rationality. It is just the arbitrary dictates of people who claim political power.

2. "But government represents us, so their laws are just!"
This is an unsupported assertion followed by a non sequitur. There is no agent/principal relationship between a politician and those who voted for him, much less between the politician and those who voted for someone else, declined to participate, or were barred from participating. There is even less of an argument in favor of appointed officials and bureaucrats.

3. ""Well, government borders are like property lines, and immigrants are trespassing!"
False analogy. Property boundaries are defined by the homesteading principle and voluntary exchange. National borders are gang turf lines. National borders just define which group usurps the authority to trespass against you.

4. "Then how do you get to a free society by letting in people who will support the government's welfare programs?"
That would be shifting the burden of proof. How do you get to a free society by advocating more government control? Don't shift the burden of proof, and excuse tyranny as somehow protecting liberty. I know this is merely anecdotal, but I have worked with immigrants, and they are honest hard workers who don't care about arbitrary government dictates. There is no attitude more liberating than that. And furthermore, the government welfare programs are illegitimate in the first place because they are funded through theft, not to mention the disputes around the claim that immigrants are welfare leeches more than those born here.

5. "But immigrants smuggle drugs and commit crimes related to the drug trade!"
This argument is just a mess. Prohibition creates violent black markets. The solution is to oppose arbitrary government prohibitions. If the prohibitions go away, the violent black markets do, too. The only crime related to beer now that alcohol prohibition is largely gone is that Budweiser claims to actually be beer.

Now it's Your Turn!
Are my responses off-base at all? Did I miss any common arguments I should have included? Comment below and let's attempt to have a real rational civilized discussion on this social media platform and defy the odds!


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Ah, but what would the internet be without all the failures of logic that help the debates keep going? (if not it'll be STERLING DISPLAY OF LOGIC and the discussion ends)

There can be room to discuss the merits of the evidence used to support an argument, and alternate explanations for cause and effect especially as systems under discussion increase in complexity, but it would be nice once in a while to see people say, "You know, that is an interesting point, and I need to give it some thought. I'll get back to you." But instead, it's usually, "You disagree with me, so you must hate puppies and kittens and happiness!"

I agree the problems with welfare programs lie in the programs themselves more than the people who abuse the system. Here in northeast Pennsylvania we have had an explosion in the hispanic population as immigrants have realized it is much cheaper to live here than in New York. I always hear people complaining about hispanics using access cards to purchase things, but the truth is I've seen plenty of citizens abusing this system as well.

I think everyone can agree that Budweiser referring to itself as beer is an insult to our intelligence.

Unfortunately, the common response when observing an injustice inflicted by politics is to demand that more politics be used to inflict new injustices.

So true. Bureaucracy is never a good solution.

Doesn't it also come down to the fact the people are more bold to say what they say online? If they were speaking face-to-face then for the most part people just would not talk in the same manner!

I have seen people make the same bad arguments in person, too. Anonymity may exacerbate the problem, but does not create it.