The Dele-cut off

in steem •  7 years ago 

When I take macro photos like these the most annoying thing is when I don't get them all in frame. I should probably take a fraction more into frame but, I like trying to get the shot I want without needing to crop. It doesn't happen often but, there is some satisfaction for me. But, that is not what this is about anyway, this is just looking for some opinions.

There are several ways for a user to create accounts these days but I think this has aided quite a lot of alt abuse and has resulted in a huge number of tiny accounts with barely any Steem Power to even operate creating bot nets. What I was wondering is if there should be a minimum delegation amount for an account to be created (the recommendation for bandwidth is about 15) or, an account must have a certain amount in it before it is allowed to delegate out for example, 100 SP and can't delegate more than below say 50 SP.

I know that there are various ramifications of this but perhaps it would mean that people would be less inclined to make as many accounts or, more discerning on who they make accounts for. I know that at one point, some people were delegating so much out to bots that they were unable to post because they had no bandwidth left. I am wondering what kinds of ramifications it would have on retention, signups, engagement, investment and other factors and, if it would have greater positive or negative impacts on small users.

In my opinion, delegation is a possibility that should only be accessible if someone has enough SP to support being able to delegate. I have heard stories of people creating accounts and then removing the delegation almost immediately so that they can create more accounts. This is not the best way to get users up and running and will destroy the experience for many at the beginning.

Anyway, just a little line of thought that came to mind that I should probably think a little more about but, you can help me with that :)

Taraz
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Limiting delegations is AN answer to the bot-nets, and encouraging further genuine growth of Steemit, but maybe a better answer is to somehow, using blockchain security, enable real identity account linking. This would mean that Dwayne Cunningham (me) gets only one account, and therefore I can't spam the network with fake accounts, and create a bot-net.

I know the hesistation around sharing private identity information that many blockchain advocates hold, but what if the blockchain in question, held your identity in the cryptographically secure blockchain, and didnt reveal that data to anyone except you, and the Steemit chain. It would operate for the sole purpose of establishing your ID, so that Steemit could then confirm you are a unique, and identifiable person, entitled to one account on Steemit, not more.

Thoughts?

It is not going to fly however, an SMT would have the potential to do that.

It looks like starting new accounts with delegation is going to be removed at HF20 anyway. They're still pretty unclear on how that's going to work - if it leads to new accounts having 3 effective SP instead of 15 that's probably going to be pretty bad.

Agreed that we need to make sure there's a minimum SP left in the account to at least be able to undelegate. There were some people being caught by phishing scams and losing their accounts that way.

I find these discussions weird since I'm essentially running a multi-account botnet with @themesopotamians, even though it's one people seem to like. How do we distinguish between spam botnets and white-hat botnets? Are we willing to kill one to get rid of the other?

You have the SP to delegate to all a minimum amount (that isn't 2). It doesn't stop all bot nets but, it does limit some very useless account creation and therefore, some of the retention numbers... perhaps.

Oh. I quite like the self creation of accounts and have used steeminvite to create accounts for my onboards so they never had to wait. I hope the new system is fast.

I just delegated to a movement I believe in. I had wanted to build my SP a lot more, but felt the community probably needs it more. I agree with you though, it's all a bit conflicting to be honest

But, you hold enough SP to do so. There are people with 15 SP delegating and creating accounts which is ridiculous.

I was reading the HF 20 update yesterday and realized that a few things that are being done were going to give bots even more power. Although they did mention power downs (in fact they removed the 10X powering down restrictions for new accounts) but delegation was never brought up.

If the delegation limits are placed then there is going to be a lot of crying but I think this could eventually benefit the platform in long run. We need more accounts to climb to climb from red fishes and minnows in the middle (dolphin) category.

Having a minimum limit would reduce the amounts of alts people create and park at least.

I didn't even realize that people could create accounts for others through delegation. I'm going to have to look into this. I'm just curious how it works. Not that I am going to do it or anything. I obviously don't have the SP required. I thought that everyone had to wait a couple weeks to get their account like I did. My girlfriend is currently waiting right now. I know this blog wasn't meant to be about the photography but it really is a shame that you didn't get the first photograph in the frame. It is really a beautiful photograph. The bee is placed almost perfectly on the rule of thirds. It is still a beautiful photograph. Maybe if you cropped out a little of the left side of the photograph, changing the aspect ratio, it would look like it was meant to be that way. All of the focus would be on the bee and the flower would become the background. I know this isn't how you intended it but it can still be fixed.

you can have a look at https://steeminvite.com/ created by @pharesim.

Yes, it is a shame and with a heavy crop it would likely be okay :)

We should definitely limit delegations to always leave a minimum balance in an account (to undelegate at least), to avoid noobs getting caught in that frustrating trap.
Many would contest a minimum SP size to allow delegation, as whales pulling the ladder up after themselves or shutting the little guy out of the lucrative delegation game.
I'd still like to see it happen, though.
Maybe your max delegation amount is your total SP minus 100.
Simple.

Many would contest a minimum SP size to allow delegation, as whales pulling the ladder up after themselves or shutting the little guy out of the lucrative delegation game.

Yes, it would be contested on principle even if in practice it would actually benefit real accounts.

I'm sure you know exactly what you're talking about so I'm just going to say, great photo's mate, I think they fit beautifully.

Yes, I saw this issue happening among many of my friends who set out to delegate to bidbots like smartsteem and minnowbooster even as they have less SP. They then struggle to involve in interactions or even to post something good.

@erode- Bro, see this post. I saw you delegating and undelegating to such a service. I guess you might have struggled with bandwidth these days as your effective SP is just 8.4. Keep at least 100 SP with you if you think you have no time to utilize it!

Hi Taraz. I don't know what a reasonable amount is to hold in one account. Maybe for the smaller accounts at least keep some value in your vote. I haven't checked but around 6 weeks ago one needed 50 SP to have 0.01 vote value. I think it is more around the 100 SP mark now. What I would suggest then is keeping 100 SP as a base then.

I understand that one feels frustrated when making a macro and that the first shot is not good. Regarding the other mini accounts, do you think it's a good idea for many to open a mini secondary gutter?

Thank you for sharing. i support your speech. We should help everyone. If we can't help, we should not harm them.