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Well I upvoted this because I like it.

  ·  6 years ago (edited)

How do you ask someone to power up $1M worth of Steem (a high-risk investment) and then expect them to give almost all their rewards away.

If earning less STEEM would lead to a higer STEEM price, I immediately would agree not to earn any single STEEM anymore ...
If supporting others and make them grow could extend the user base and thus make the whole blockchain more attractive for investors (who may only think it's worth to advertise and try to sell theirs products on a platform with a sufficient amount of active users), then I wouldn't actually call it altruistic doing so ...

The term.. give awards away is hysterical.

The stakeholders are entrusted with allocating the inflation to that which brings value. Not to use it as payment to themselves.

Would you mine (POW) a token that let those who mined the most previously get all the future mining.... :) Our DPOS is like a Democracy gone bad. Once the masses realize they can vote themselves a raise... it's all over but the crashing.

It is, but that's how people see it.

Oh I agree, it is viewed as their rewards.:) Not arguing just saying, that's so painfully frustrating and short sighted... Sigh.

!

there is no democratic element at all. This is the very point why Steem will die. It´s sad that people see self voting as proof of work. In two ways: first, this shows that they have no clue what POW means, second its the same shit murders do when they kill a child. They look for a reason why their action was justified.

Anyways, we will get our platform without "whales".

Wow...the more things change, the more they stay the same. I don't get the self-vote theory; mainly because the majority of Steemians don't have any value in their upvote. The last hardfork really put a dagger in the vote.

I enjoy Steemit because I simply have never been one to enjoy pointless social media. If technology doesn't serve as a business venture on some level, it's not worth my time/energy....jmho.

I've always felt Steemit had a plan up to a certain point; but, how to make it reproductive lacked fertility.

Lots of people made their millions...powered down...and well as I started...the more things change, the more they stay the same. That's not to include the continued dark start-ups that develop apps that pump and dump...

Peace.

  ·  6 years ago (edited)

7c steem? buying, but not based on games, smts, etc taking off. If they do cool, added bonus. Based on what we have, can have, right in front of us.

{reason to buy steem} i thought this would come from wanting to decide which authors blog made it to trending. Your voice / steem power to push them to the top, plus the fact that your making bank curating.

The problem with steem is that the incentives are not aligned. What I mean by this is that SP holders can allocate resources to themselves. Ideally SP holders should increase their holdings only if content creators do it at the same time. To get to that "ideal" situation we would need two things to happen:

  • Remove the ability to selfvote.
  • Remove the possibility to use alt accounts.

I have thought about this alot and I can't find a way to solve it. There are always ways to circumvent whatever measures we come up with. For instance, if we are able to identify who owns each account to prevent self voting via alts then the parasitic actors can resort to backroom dealings to bypass the system (for those who were not around this type of behaviour created some drama in the early days of the platform).

The next best thing would be to penalize alt account usage with a non-linear rewards distribution curve coupled with the possibility to negate rewards to those who insist on leeching from the reward pool. In other words the EIP is the next best thing.

Unfortunately a non linear curve has some dowsides, mainly that the bigger the wallet the bigger your influence will be. That's way the shape of proposed curve is very important.

Another measure that could be taken is to reduce the portion of the inflation that goes to the reward pool but that would hamper the token distribution which is anoher goal that we should also focus on.

If interested, just check out this idea concerning the reward curve.

Actually I remember reading your post back then. If I am not mistaken the shape of a Sigmoid_function is similar to the one on the EIP.

Yes, and I am in favour of the convergent rewards curve.

500mv influence cap, n2 to encourage max account value, flags for abuse, and we can get back to where we were before stinc, et al, hijacked pob to give us powallet.

For someone with your political stance it strikes me as odd that you would be in favor of and n^2 curve which only encourages an oligarchy to entrench itself. Why would you want to go back to the old days? Back then if you invested 10k USD your vote was worth a whopping 0.001...pathetic.

Putting a cap on the stake doesn't help, it just creates a point of equilibrium where whales start to power down and does not encourage further investment.

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while we are mentioning @whatsup "One thing I am sure of, if you have to pay yourself to take care of your own investment... It's not much of an investment, it's a scheme."

also you could look at it this way? how will life change for me if steem goes to 10$ and how will life change for someone with 500.000 - 1M steem? In whose interest is to make steem a good social network with people who want to be here?

Also the question is how did they get to the 1M steem?

You make a number of good points here, but ignored the easy answer. Why not ask the Steemit users who actually bought a significant amount of Steem to be here? Significant is a relative term of course, but spending 1,000 Euros to be on a platform when you can be on Youtube or Facebook without spending a dime is far from free loading. I'd further like to add that flagging original content to the degree it has been flagged will discourage current users from onboarding new members, why would we bring our friends here just to have their work shat on?

In case it hasn't dawned on anyone, it's not so much about the rewards as it is about a level playing field that gives you a fair chance of getting rewards.

Of my followers, most are dead accounts, and by that standard I'd have to conclude that the majority has spoken, like it or not. If I approach it strictly from an investor's point of view, things aren't looking much better. Why would a 100K steem holder earn at a higher percentage as a 2K holder? I could have just kept my BTC and made the same gains and losses as every other BTC investor, but here, the 100K investor can deny me an equal opportunity indefenatly.

Steemit is not asking anyone why they are leaving or why they are so pissed off, that means they'll never figure out how to fix the problem and leaves the impression they don't care.

Suppose I'll get another flag, oh well, those are the breaks. Have a good one.

Sincerely, Onno.

my mom cant even use a smart phone. most of my social contacts have no interest in a social network where they need to keep passwords safe, do extra work like blogging, commenting, curating, or creating process things. facebook and twitter gained popularity because interacting is quick and easy. Peeps are already so used to hearing about how politicians cheat and lie that FB selling their info doesnt phase them; so what?

why dont people get in to steemit? its too brain taxing, and unknown, therefore they dont trust it. "real life" keeps them so engaged in worrying about money and bills that they don't have time for things like investing, or how to effectively communicate to people outside their dunbar number circle. if issues don't affect them personally in the present time, most people be like, shrug... not saying this to be negative, just believe these are the hard realities.

crypto may be something we need to gear towards a younger generation, and it may take years of public outreach and education for people to understand how it might be used without "inconvenience". there's too much of a learning curve for little gain.

the way i see more involvement happening? provide people with something that they want that they aren't getting now. it used to be monetary incentive, but i think that's a bad draw, because it just pulls in the con artists and quick money grabbers. they tweak the system to find loopholes, grab and go.

what do kids pay for? gaming is a good draw, music, shared passions. many kids today are fed up with the government. good place to tap into. any kind of app that caters to their interests will draw them in. in other words, stop selling steem as an investment. I know that's counter intuitive. the draw has to be a good or service that they want to purchase. i know that this is maybe not what people want to hear. but its not your normal run of the mill person who comes to steemit and stays. find the common denominator. imho...

Who is going to pay the bill? We are distributing large amounts of Steem but don't have people lining up to buy large amounts of Steem.

Only one answer for me - commerce, business. We need them to want advertise their products/services on steem and the income has to be distributed to content creators. You want to advertise on STEEM -> you buy STEEM token -> you make it valuable.

If Steem went to .07 I would buy more.
Steem does need to be easier for my mom and others. Facebook is the competition. The end. We wanna be more like Facebook and less like a computer science degree.
I wanna buy a pecan pie with Steem one day. Hopefully one day soon.

I think we have to give up the idea that producing quality posts is the raison être of the steem block chain. Certainly it is nice when it happens and that is always my intent but it is not necessarily what the block chain needs to succeed.

What we need is engagement, first and foremost. I have said before that we should junk the rep scores. They mean nothing and everyone knows it and instead institute an engagement score. We can get cute and call it a quotient (EQ). A perfect EQ is 1 and it is maintained through upvoting mulitple accounts (far too many to fake) and making unique and mulitiple comments. Everytime you upvote yourself, your EQ shrinks. So if you have a score less than 1, you will not receive the full payout of any post or curation. The difference returns to the pool.

In this scenario, the use of bid bots serves to better the community. Because obtaining a bit bot upvote only gets a steemian half way to payout. Now he must engage with the platform meaningfully. Perhaps there would still be room for a steemian to upvote say one of their own posts a day, but then he would have to engage and upvote, in the very least, with those that left comments on his post.

Community would be sustained and built. There would be more eyes on the page and ad revenue would grow and so the price of steem. So maybe I would make less money on posts ( It will probably be the opposite) but now one steem is worth whole a lot more. Forget about altruism and do the math. 100 000 steem at 10 dollars a steem is worth a hell of a lot more than 300 000 at 30 cents.

So I make money for less work. One would assume that making a post is more work than reading and commenting and I let the system do the work for me instead.

To bringing people on initially. Allow newbies to join and upvote and comment without having to open a wallet. Once they see others making money that they have no access to, they will educate themselves and might even pay a nominal fee to obtain a wallet.

#teamsteem

Just because the code allows it doesn't make it right, good, or fair.

Your black list that you are so proud of is a good example of this.

I would totally buy more Steem if it were easy to buy on Coinbase or something like it. Having to buy other coin and then convert it is definitely slowing down my buying options.

Beyond that, you raise a lot of good questions that I don't have the answers to. Hopefully we can figure them out, and soon...

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I think Netcoins has the option to buy STEEM straight with fiat.

Yes, but if you're in the United States like me, you have to do the online trading route. That requires you spend a minimum of $500. I wish I had that kind of money.

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Ah, right.

Seven cents? I'd be buying for sure. I don't really have the money right now, but I will find it. I really think we are only about one fantastic dapp away from more mass adoption of Steem. When that comes, I don't think anyone can say. You have some other great points, it would take a book to cover them all. I don't want to do that to people though :)

To me one of the most important things is ease of use. Like you said, “explain Steem in 20 seconds” “Would your mother understand how to use Steem On not lose their tokens?” In order to get mass adoption things need to be simplified. How does that happen.... I have no f-ing clue... I am just a Lineman and know just enough about tech stuff to get me in trouble. Lol

when it comes to rewarding users financially and trying to make it as fair as possible, I think things have to be somewhat complicated. With this complication, comes security. Hence the multiple keys to perform different actions. That makes sense to me... kind of. I think we could get away with 2 keys just like a BTC or any other crypto wallet. One for posting and one for wallet withdrawals and actions that alter the account. Again I am just a High Voltage Lineman here.

I agree, some people are paid a deserving reward, then they post a photo of their dinner and day a couple sentences and get the same reward. Hmmm a zero effort post gets the same as their good, thought out and full of effort post. Hey I guess that is just how it is... right.

Steem is still young in my opinion and we are going to have growing pains and unfortunately every change made isn’t going to work perfectly. It can’t be all rainbows and unicorns. Things like this take time and lots of it. Just like being a Journeyman in a trade, it takes years of f-ing up and learning the hard way.

These are some great thoughts @themarkymark thanks for sharing. Hopefully they get people to think a little like it did me. People who are a little more “techy” than me
Ps. I would buy the crap out of Steem at 0.07. 😉

themarkymark,You not understand it?stream_83935696.gif

I'll answer the easy one:

How do we get the next PewDiePie on Steem?

Pay them a few million dollars. Steemit, Inc could do it right now and it would probably give them a huge ROI.

Keep in mind, they only have about $16M USD worth of Steem right now and the majority is powered up and not immediately available. It also shrinks considerably with their monthly sell to pay for infrastructure, employees, and expenses.

I think that you either have to pay a established creator millions of dollars as you say or wait until steem has millions of usera and it happens by itself.

The op mentioned authors and creators earning too much but i think that if you take a closer look at the payouts you will see that steem doesnt have the reward pool to sustain a single big creator.

I think i get pretty decent rewards in comparisson to many others but the truth is that those 10$ i get on average are not worth the time+effort spent on each of my videos.
I do it because i like doing it and making a 100$-150$ a month is better then i would get anywherr else.

You can have people like.me that are new creators but you cant have a pewdipie here or a big creator because you cant really make a living here or earn any bigger sum as a creator.
If it was possible to earn anything significant here you would have those kind of people. I know i would be making professional level videos myself that could rival anything on youtube in production value. Unfortunately it would cost around 1200$ to make one of those. Hehe.
Maybe steem at 10 dollars can see a pewdipie. Just to figure out how to get there. ☺

How do we get the next PewDiePie on Steem?

Even when the platform does get the next we don’t end up keeping them for one simple reason – they can’t grow an audience here. We as a platform are very short on content consumers and spenders. Which is why even when they show up with access to sponorships, a merch store, patron, affiliate links and other stuff where it would not matter if they earned much from the reward pool or not. They are not driving the number or the sales while being here. They could get the red carpet treatment as best as this platform could and then it die down and they be gone a month or two later once very few people remained.

As a former curator and former community leader there was nothing I could do when I found these people outside of different sizes of upvotes of $1 to $25. I’d put them in my author showcase where they get about zero more views and a couple of more upvotes due to partnerships. I’d share their links to different discords. I’d even beg people to go please comment and engage with this user and see if this is someone’s content you would enjoy.

If that platform could fix that we stop bleeding so many amazing people as well. Thankfully some of those people are still in community discords/following on other social platforms they have just have stopped posting. Hell I’ve even comment on peoples posts who were gone for months and they replay back because they forgot GinaBot was still active and it alerted them.

There is no viable solution I could create and I don’t think “commerce” would work either as there just no audiences to support people like that.

I’ve spent a considerable amount of time trying to understand how to acquire external traffic to my content. I’ve hit the wall as I don’t have metrics that are not getting hit with duplication and the Steemit site itself is not forthcoming in anything to that nature.

The next PewDiePie like equivalent on our platform will be the person who can create their own audience with what tools this platform provides them. They then will use the opportunity of positive cash flow to grow to the next level. That won’t be them buying Steem they are a content creator they have higher priorities for themselves first to grow. This also means they are sacrificing by not having a giant pile of Steem if the price ever skyrockets as creating better, funner, and more engaging content was the priority not being an investor.

If witnesses are the only people getting steem, and they have to sell to pay themselves, who do they sell it to?
The bloggers that left when they stopped getting paid?
New frontends that have to pay rent?
Gambling scams that need rc credits?

If money infinitely inflates, even at a controlled rate, when does its value equal something other than nothing?
Oh yeah, when you get suckers to hold your bags of it.
'They are stupid to be here, they swallow whatever we dish out, but apparently 'good hair' draws 'em like flies.'

We had a chance to set the world on edge, but, well, you know, we will all be happier charging fools rent to use our chain rather than spinning up one of their own from open source software?
Smdh.

I'm out on the first one that uses the steem, steemit, and any other stinc, et al, held accounts to enforce an influence cap, brings back the n2 to encourage max value accounts, and gives proof of brain a chance.
Lets add any large accounts that acted counter to proof of brain.
We know who they are.

  1. I think so, but things as we see them today would change a lot, and it would be more about buying STEEM, power up and then getting the most out of it by upvoting yourself at 100% every fucking day

  2. There it needs to be an strong incentive for that person, not just money, but reputation, personal branding, advertising, etc

Maybe whoever invests his money is not a person, but a foundation, for example, or a company.

There has to be a business model for the investor that goes beyond proof of brain or receives rewards for creating content or curating

I'll think more answers during the day, now I'm on my way to work.

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You got a 42.20% upvote from @ocdb courtesy of @themarkymark! :)

@ocdb is a non-profit bidbot for whitelisted Steemians, current max bid is 40 SBD and the equivalent amount in STEEM.
Check our website https://thegoodwhales.io/ for the whitelist, queue and delegation info. Join our Discord channel for more information.

If you like what @ocd does, consider voting for ocd-witness through SteemConnect or on the Steemit Witnesses page. :)

We need to have an irresistible reason to buy Steem, the more the better!

This.

Well, silly me. I am praying steem goes up with big advertising revenues taken in

If Steem went to $0.07 I'd be buying for sure!

I wouldn't sell my Steem despite a deep down. Steem is a project of the future.

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The comments also get pretty annoying these days btw.

IMHO, the system built has yet to get any traction apart from the existing Steem community starting since 2016 which means that it still doesn’t pose any intrinsic value besides rewarding to stakeholders who are already in the game. This does sound alarming but I still think that there are still hope to experiment on the system with ways that we may not think of. Again, I still take the optimistic stand for Steem and hopefully there is something that could be done by the witnesses and community. Steem on!

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I would be buying for sure. Well, I see an issue with adapting to the platform. While many new authors come but not seeing any response to their posts they leave. The first four months of mine on this platform was dud. Then it hit me that I can make Steem by participating in events. That's what I did and now able to survive. The thing is no one is there to tell you this in the beginning. That's where the issue is.

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Steem mimics society ❤

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I curate manually and enjoy it because I love to stay informed of what is happening here. :)

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I think it should be worth to use RC. Then Steem is more worth in my opinion.

Like Rc Delegation, or other usefull case.

  ·  6 years ago (edited)

It's really damn hard to convince someone to organically curate altruistically when the system is so flawed and abused right in your face. People have developed the mindset of protecting what is left so they can be assured of their fair share (in their minds).

I'd love to see a system implemented, where finding the best content and pushing it up for others to see, is rewarded almost as much as passively selling votes. And so visiting trending would be worthwhile for me, other Steemians and everyone around the world, no matter if they'd be crypto user or not. Is that achievable? Well I'm still here, so I guess I have some hope. At least it seems Steemit Inc is finally ready to at least try and achieve some resemblence of proof of brain. It took 2 years of community outcry for them to acknowledge the problem publicly...

We need to keep figuring out ways to utilize the greed that drives people, so it will benefit more than just the person themselves. Only that way will Steem truly flourish, I think.

@themarkymark Will you support Marketing projects for Steem?

I think we need a lot more of them for sure.

Cool I'll write you soon for a project, regards

It does seem like a insurmountable task getting the right balance on this platform but i think things will find their level eventually...

Who is going to pay the bill? We are distributing large amounts of Steem but don't have people lining up to buy large amounts of Steem. Someone needs to pay the bill or the price will continue to fall. We need to have an irresistible reason to buy Steem, the more the better!

This is true, I think the best distribution that Steem can have is the price increase. When the price was high everyone seemed to be having a good time.

How do we get the next PewDiePie on Steem?

It would just be great if we could bring him here.

Good thoughts

How do we get the next PewDiePie on Steem?

What about the current Pewds. Is he already here? Did I miss the party??

On a serious note though, we really need reasons to buy steem. Right now there are almost none.

More ways to reduce the supply of steem would be great as well, to counter the yearly inflation... We also need to onboard big content creators like Lino and DLive did with pewdiepie. We should probably build some sort of pool to onboard them. The bigger the influencers the better.

wether we agree or not,blochain tecnology is the future.

If Steem went to $0.07 would you be selling or buying?

This last question is underrated as people should ask themselves what is the reason they are buying at 0.07 cents vs. any other time. Might answer a lot of reason why they are here.