HF19 SUCKS! MY REWARDS GRADUALLY GO DOWN BY 50+% BEFORE PAYOUT!

snubbermike (59) · 8 years ago

Before HF19 the whales were running an experiment where they were not voting (or not voting as much). When they did vote, other whales were downvoting to counteract them.

The rewards pool was more full than normal, so each vote was worth more than normal.

After HF19, the whales began to vote again, which has resulted in the pool being drained somewhat - which makes everyone's vote worth less...

Now that we are in a phase that the pool is draining, our rewards for the posts that have not paid out yet are falling too - because the votes there are becoming worth less..

Eventually the pool will stabilize at the lower level, and you will see less fluctuation in your rewards..

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5 votes

steemit.nemesis (53) · 8 years ago

In addition, the steem exchange rate went down below 2$.

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msg768 (65) · 8 years ago

Great comment. Makes a lot of sense! Cheers :]

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snubbermike (59) · 8 years ago

Thanks - now lets hope it doesn't stabilize too low! :p

I also had my best rewarded post recently and have been watching the payout drop quickly. Yeeesh!

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thatsweeneyguy (61) · 8 years ago

I learned today that one of the factors that calculates potential payouts is the amount that's in the prize pool, and also the pending rewards. So, people who are now able to spam comment or shit-post and self upvotes every two minutes are raking in thousands of dollars, and hurting everyone's payouts...

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msg768 (65) · 8 years ago (edited)

I just saw a guy who has commented twice on my posts by now and self-upvotes himself without upvoting my post and his upvote was worth 3+ dollars. I checked him out and realized he's been doing that to everyone and some people are even talking about him and have flagged him. But his voting power was down to almost 10% so people like him can't keep on doing what they're doing. No? Because as far as I know the voting power drops by 2% by every upvote. That is a maximum of 50 upvotes in 5 days or 10 upvotes per day because it only recharges 20% per day. I try to maintain mine above 80%.

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thatsweeneyguy (61) · 8 years ago

It still adds up to HUGE abuse of the rewards pool.

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msg768 (65) · 8 years ago

Right. But it should settle down after a week? No? That's what I don't get...

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thatsweeneyguy (61) · 8 years ago

Now that almost everyone can upvotes themselves and actually see the money stack up, it's much more enticing for new users to simply ignore the way the network is meant to be used, and pay themselves for nothing.

Unfortunately, I'd rather go back to the way it was, and build to the point that I'm a whale who earns a legitimate income.

As long as new users can come in and single handedly pay themselves, potential payout will continue to decrease across the board.

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msg768 (65) · 8 years ago (edited)

Self-upvoting isn't something new. It was allowed and happening before HF19 as well. And disabling it isn't gonna fix anything as people can create more accounts and still self-upvote. I don't think there's an easy fix to the problem. The system is designed so that whoever invests more, will be able to earn more. Even the whales that are supporting content creators only do so because they want more traffic so that the price of Steem would go up. I think the system is rigged just like everything else made by men!

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thelifeofbrian (52) · 8 years ago

that comment gets an upvote so true

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thatsweeneyguy (61) · 8 years ago

I see your point... Not sure what the future holds, but i know the reward pool can't handle the type of abuse I've seen since the hardfork

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msg768 (65) · 8 years ago (edited)

The 'abuse' that you're talking about isn't something new. Maybe it has become more visible and transparent after HF19 because even the minnows can now do it, even though what they earn will be nothing compared to what the whales have been earning!

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Show 3 more replies

jeevesix (55) · 8 years ago

Yep, same guy did that on one of my posts...didn't even upvotes my post.

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drakos (70) · 8 years ago

Who is he?

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wthomas (56) · 8 years ago (edited)

My understanding is that with the decline in the value of Steem, so does the payouts you have received thus far. It has been a tough week for the stock. It has gone from 2.30+ to now 1.73 and falling. Another reason that very few people are aware of, the person who resulted in you getting a majority of your payout, their overall voting power could have declined since voting and their power is not as powerful, that could also result in the decline of your payout.

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foodisfree (53) · 8 years ago

Those factors make a lot of sense. Now's a good time to invest in Steem! :)

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msg768 (65) · 8 years ago

I don't think so! The price of STEEM on steemit is fixed during the day. I notice the decline happening just as we speak. As far as I know, the price of STEEM does not constantly change here which is why the CONVERT TO STEEM option takes 3 days so that people would not take advantage of the rate if there is a significant increase or decrease in the value of STEEM in one day!

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iggyg85 (45) · 8 years ago

The FAQ states that it can also go down based on how much the voters on your post are spreading their votes around. It also states the same as stated above, valuation of steem affects it.

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msg768 (65) · 8 years ago

Ahh okay. Thanks :]

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10 votes

iggyg85 (45) · 8 years ago

No problemo, I had the same drops happening to me so I researched it some. Although it does seem like a sharper drop on HF19

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wthomas (56) · 8 years ago

I also just found this post which explains the reason.

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fairbee (44) · 8 years ago (edited)

HF19 update is nothing to do with it but it has impact in other way.. It is the magic of Steem Price which is sliding along with all other Crypto Currencies for the past 3 or 4 days. Steem is currently trading at $1.70 something. And SBD at $1.50. Our rewards are SBD.. so, our rewards has significant drop as per the trading price. Nothing to worry.. I guess you have still some time for your payout. Hope it will bounce back.

And the number of votes really doesn't matter Bro.. their power(Steempower) contribution is also very important in post's rewards. for example if a minnow like me upvotes you, you will get 0.02 increase.. because I have very less steem power. If any member upvotes you with less steempower, it is of no use except to feel happy that we have number of votes..

If one or two whale members upvotes your post with 100% steempower, your reward will be like $80 to $100 just because of their full strength votes..I hope you must using steemd.com/your username. You can check all the upvotes power when some one upvotes...

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thatmemeguy (59) · 8 years ago

Great explanation man ! I was going to write something similar but you nail it!

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fairbee (44) · 8 years ago

Thank you. I have left some as it was getting bigger like post it self.. But we can find @ats-david's and many senior member's explanation right underneath in a link posted by @flipstar.

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chelsea88 (64) · 8 years ago (edited)

MEANWHILE, I've been making posts that would've in theory been hitting $25 or more and I am now getting pennies to the dollar. Very demoralizing

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msg768 (65) · 8 years ago

Sorry to hear that! :[ I wish we could all shit gold, so we didn't have to worry about money so much and instead we would focus on immaterial things!

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chelsea88 (64) · 8 years ago

I enjoy steemit period but lets face it, the monetary aspect is nice so these drops suck. Right now i think its important to proceed as usual, weather the storm, I've read posts of some previous simular fork occurring last year and people recovered so i have hope

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yaanivapeji (65) · 8 years ago

Try no to give up

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chelsea88 (64) · 8 years ago

Nope definitely not giving up. :)
There's no reason to give up

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aaliyahholt (68) · 8 years ago

I used to give people 10 cents when I upvote, now its dropped to 3,4,5 cents. I didn't know what was going on.

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msg768 (65) · 8 years ago

You've been voting too much. That's why.

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ma1neevent (66) · 8 years ago

I had one hit $130 in the first day and now near payout it's down to 72. Still going to be my best post so far, but sad to watch it drop that much

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https://steemit.com/spam/@schattenjaeger/hf19-is-this-what-we-want-spam-self-vote-galore#@ats-david/re-orcainutah-re-rocksg-re-schattenjaeger-hf19-is-this-what-we-want-spam-self-vote-galore-20170630t000339931z

flipstar (71) · 8 years ago (edited)

there is a explonation in this post also.

The more people vote they drain rewards from the reward pool and this decreases your rewards then also.

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ricofm (28) · 8 years ago

Your post depends on the cryptocurrency since it's subject to inflation and prices changes so is your reward. Hope I was of help :D

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builderofcastles (64) · 8 years ago

This in not really HF-19, this is a combination of factors.
Mostly, its the Seven day period, and that most votes are cast on the first day.

So, if you got all of your votes in the first 30 minutes (all by bots, or some such) then you would watch your payout decrease for the next 6 days, 23 hours
as people vote for other content, spreading out, or diluting the reward pool (from your view point)

Or in other words, you had 400 of 100,000 payout at the 30 minute mark
and then at the 7 day, you had 400 of 500,000 payout

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builderofcastles (64) · 8 years ago

I should also add to this that what HF-19 did was make the minnows more powerful.
The whales, if they vote, it was usually early in the post history. And since whales used to set the stage for everything that followed, your payout was set. The minnows really couldn't move the outcome.

Or, in my above examples, the whales voted and you were at 400 of 450,000 payout. The minnows accounting for only 50,000 over 7 days.

Now, the minnows move the outcome all over the place.

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msg768 (65) · 8 years ago

Thanks for your long comment but I really don't think that HF19 has only made the minnows more powerful. It appears to me that it has made everyone equally more powerful!

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foodisfree (53) · 8 years ago

Interesting findings. I've had similar thoughts about some of my posts but that seems like quite a drastic change. I also think the price of Steem going down lately must be the main reason, right?

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msg768 (65) · 8 years ago

No. I don't think so. I tried to explain in a comment above why...

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wthomas (56) · 8 years ago (edited)

I've read by several individuals that the cost of steem also effects payout. I'll see if I can find the link and source it here.

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geordieprepper (53) · 8 years ago

I've noticed this too, it's very disheartening :-(

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msg768 (65) · 8 years ago

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drakos (70) · 8 years ago (edited)

Yeh I was wondering what's up with that. I got very excited some of my posts were getting lots of good upvotes, but when the reward payout came, it was down considerably.

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chelsea88 (64) · 8 years ago (edited)

SAME. SAME. SAME. ugh. I had one that was like $60.32, same votes etc, next day was like $29 something

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msg768 (65) · 8 years ago

Just like mine. 50%+ decline from the peak within less than a week :[

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chelsea88 (64) · 8 years ago

I had one payout of a $390 something post. Thank God it happened DIRECTLY after HF19. My other one was up to $280, by the time HF19 worked it's "magic" decreased to something like $132 by payout.

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chelsea88 (64) · 8 years ago

I'm going resteem this actually because it is a real problem >_<

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msg768 (65) · 8 years ago (edited)

WOW! You've done great then. The maximum post I've had went up to something like $152 (I got about $120 of it and the rest went to curators) but that was before HF19! I haven't been able to beat that yet. Very discouraging to be honest :[

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chelsea88 (64) · 8 years ago

I have had two really high paying posts, for me. Luckily, the one I got paid for like RIGHT after HF19 so I got what I thought I would. The other was days after the fork so I didn't. But thanks though. I'm still thankful for it. It was disheartening and still is to see how things are dropping, but we will weather the storm.

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rosher72 (55) · 8 years ago

Yes Sir. Same sentiment here. Hope it will somehow goes back to the same system of earnings. But I think it will take time for them to find ways how get on track again.

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denmarkguy (77) · 8 years ago

It does seem to be quite a trend these days. A few comments, though...

The suddenly HUGE payouts immediately following HF19 were inflated quite considerably... for 7 days. Now we've passed 7 days since HF we should be closer to "normal."

The biggest problem (just my opinion) is that a lot of people with high voting power are just voting for themselves, and especially upvoting their own comments, which is redistributing the rewards pool. Let's say my 100% upvotes are worth $5.00... if I go around giving all those upvotes to myself instead of to others... others (the would be YOU) will see their relative rewards drop. And some people are abusing the heck out of that system.

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msg768 (65) · 8 years ago

The system is rigged!

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coolbowser (67) · 8 years ago

There was a good post about this that I read. I'm going to see if I can find it and post a link here once I do. But I believe the gist of the article stated that there are 3 or 4 factors that go into the final payouts. And the price of steem is the biggest factor. And because it's dropped so much recently that's why the payouts have dropped too. I'll try and find the article and post it.

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https://steemit.com/steemit/@penguinpablo/here-s-why-your-potential-payouts-are-going-down

coolbowser (67) · 8 years ago (edited)

Here's the link I was taking about. Explains pretty well what factors go into potential payouts and why they are dropping.

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natasmr (52) · 8 years ago

It seems to me that this is happening because of the redistribution pool for tags. One day it is not so noticeable. And a week turns out a lot. Plus the decline on the market=)))

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msg768 (65) · 8 years ago (edited)

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natasmr (52) · 8 years ago

Hahahaha

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screenname (66) · 8 years ago

This post has been ranked within the top 25 most undervalued posts in the second half of Jun 30. We estimate that this post is undervalued by $71.57 as compared to a scenario in which every voter had an equal say.

See the full rankings and details in The Daily Tribune: Jun 30 - Part II. You can also read about some of our methodology, data analysis and technical details in our initial post.

If you are the author and would prefer not to receive these comments, simply reply "Stop" to this comment.

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