...

alyssas (60) · 8 years ago

The person you mention only gets lots of rewards because a) people vote for him and b) people do not vote for other people.

b) is as important as a). I notice you have a lot of steempower but don't do much curating. By yourself you could make a lot of difference to a lot of good authors, while diminishing the share the person-who-shall-not-be-named gets. But you don't...

Basically this site is in the hands of the members (and not just the whales), and voting plays a big part in regulating it. The problem is people want others to vote for them but can't be bothered to vote themselves.

$4.63

piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago (edited)

I'm pretty sure his criticism was directed at the very small number of top-tier whales that control the trending page, not the rest of us that don't make much difference with our penny votes.

$0.38

alyssas (60) · 8 years ago (edited)

What the front page gets is a percentage of the fixed amount of steem generated in a 24 hour period, therefore voting for other stuff dimishes what the front page gets.

Things are skewed at present because most people don't bother to vote at all, believing wrongly that it is just about the whales. It is not. And moaning about not getting votes while not bothering to vote yourself is a bit cheeky, especially as OP isn't a minnow with 10 SP.

You should vote more too - you have 15 x my steempower but you earned less curation awards than me in the last week, because you don't bother.

piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago (edited)

True story. I vote when I see good stuff in my feed but I don't have the time to go gem hunting since I actually have a business to run that takes priority over this nifty little experiment (which is all it is to me, at this point). My approach has always been posting, not curating, since I have the ability to post quality content but not the time to be a good curator. Everyone should play to their strengths to contribute as much value as they personally can.

$0.41

alyssas (60) · 8 years ago (edited)

My approach has always been posting, not curating

But you want others to vote for you?!!

Everyone should do some voting every day even if it is just for half an hour. Otherwise we end up with these rants from people who refuse to vote but are annoyed that the 33 whales who do vote haven't had time to get around to them...

officialfuzzy (75) · 8 years ago (edited)

Some of us whales are actually spending quite a bit to fund solutions to help with the problems on this beta level platform.

I understand the frustration, but steem gives power to people so they can change the balance over time by voting. I feel like its necessary to vote and it honestly feels like rok-sivante is just getting a bit frustrated and in the panic phase of this.

piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago (edited)

There are a lot of people on here that can't write well but still want to make some money so they go with the curation strategy... good for them. As I already explained, I don't have the time for that and my talents suit me better for creation. That's how I can contribute the most value per minute that I'm on here... also, I don't think Rok is complaining about not getting votes... and I sure as hell am not. I treat this as a hobby project in the background. My business is real estate development.

randr10 (62) · 8 years ago

People vote for good content, not in return for good curation. That's why the founders tried to build in an incentive system that rewards curators, so that reciprocity in voting wouldn't be necessary.

Personally, I'm indifferent to how people should vote. They should do whatever their gut tells them IMO. I think ultimately that's what's going to drive the site anyway, and ultimately what will make it palatable for your average person.

While I think it's admirable that people like yourself want to be good curators for their vision of how the site should look, the gut reactions of people are ultimately what will determine the curation if and when this site gains mass adoption. People who won't or can't contribute desirable content (read most future users) will only come here if they see what they want to see, nothing more, nothing less, regardless of how any of us here now feel about that.

$0.00

rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago (edited)

"SHOULD" is the word in the idealism here that sways the whole outlook.

not everyone has the same talents/values to contribute. not everyone chooses to contribute the same type of value.

(and maybe there's another point of hypocriticism highlighted from my own case, having some unconscious presupposition that the site's dynamics and people on it "should" be different than what they are.)

...

and thanks, @officialfuzzy for the input. short, but appreciated. (and is more disillusionment than panic. :-) )

$0.00

sponge-bob (71) · 8 years ago

If the Steem price goes down, I will just generate more Steem. Or, buy more. Either way :)

razvanelulmarin (72) · 8 years ago

haaaaaaa, just wrote the exact SAMETHING! Damn it, man. Have my upvote :)

$0.00

mammasitta (70) · 8 years ago (edited)

I missed out on a lot of BS since I stopped posting and even reading
I am glad I met all of you I value so much. I never say never and probably will publish again . I just have better things to do for now than to be a part of an experiament of a few cons.
My enthusiasm vanished.

$0.00

ibringawareness (63) · 8 years ago

Three excellent responses. Well said.

$0.00

jamesbrown (62) · 8 years ago

Well put.

$0.00

luzcypher (74) · 8 years ago

Agreed 100%

$0.00

rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

this particular post got over 214 votes and raked in $12 in rewards.

my votes are worth about $0.20.

do the math.

$0.00

shizz77 (26) · 8 years ago

Round and Round... Round we goooooooo. The votes that is!

$0.00

kyriacos (71) · 8 years ago (edited)

@rok-sivante

No shame in saying who he is. No shame to show that the oil of what we call "Steemit" is powered by the countless sheeple of

the Great,

the glorious

Tinfoiled Vigilante

it is the sad, sour truth. We want to call it decentralised, anarchic or whatever else but right now a fraud is running the game and he has the founders on his feet because there is no Steemit without him. I am not even going to touch the Silk Road guy. (the things i saw being sold on that page makes my skin crawl).

I don't think it can get more pathetic than that. I expose the Tinfoiled Vigilante with every single chance I get. I never upvoted him and even if he flagged me some times, costing me massive reputation, i still went mongolian on his ass. Check my page and early posts. Life is about kicking ass, not kissing it like a whore.

Also, shame on you as well. You should have stood your ground and not bail as soon as the money machine run out. Many followed the same milking stradegy, including the tinfoiled vigilante. I can't understand why the whales put on trail people that fuck them over and ignore consistent members that offer so much to the community. This makes a lot of us frustrated but I am still allowing them some more room for evaluation.

Your stance doesn't make you any beter than him. The Tinfoiled Vigilante, upon leaving will say the exact same things as you; "Steemit was just a phase".

..please.

Truth is, you both made massive amounts of money without really deserving it while most of us stood ground and defended this shithole as best as we could for pennies—and we still do because we believe we can make it better.

also..no more 5K sensational posts huh? a..the bullshit easy money make us say....

$3.89

16 votes

whatsup (75) · 8 years ago

He has a huge following on Twitter and FB. Now, I personally am not a huge fan. I question much more the impact of the guy who just got out of prison and is suddenly a witness and makes money on every post.

$0.00

kyriacos (71) · 8 years ago

both of them are shady as fuck.

$0.00

faddat (66) · 8 years ago

You've got to be kidding me.

DV, whatever, yeah he's way too sensationalist. Shady, I don't think so.

Charlie Sherm, is NOT shady. As you'll learn moving through crypto-land, the gov kinda crucifies people from time to time to satisfy demands for blood and slaughter. His number was up, poor bastard.

$0.00

rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

honestly expressing disillusionment after investing a shitload of time and energy into something you believed in and "bailing" are two completely different things.

and frankly, if it was my call, no one would be earning $5k/post (myself included). as much of a blessing that might have been at the time, such disparity in rewards is NOT serving the site's best long-term interest.

Perhaps you were one of the ones that had posted about the 'TV's' track record I'd seen way back. Respect for having called it out, and continuing to do so.

$0.00

razvanelulmarin (72) · 8 years ago

Rok, I sort of know you from a while back so I understand when you're coming from.
Still, you seem to miss the most important part of steemit: CURATION. That is: you vote on what YOU like and in doing so [ maybe even re-steem? ] you influence where the money goes. That's one of the biggest thing you can do for the community.
IVoting power 100.0000% [ <--- that's yours.
Sorry, but you are not being truthful here imho. Instead of denouncing a guy for getting money that you no longer get, and arguing that you are right because your views are being confirmed by other person in the same situation, how about you use your upvotes and actually do something with all that SP you worked so hard for?

$3.38

18 votes

anotherjoe (66) · 8 years ago

Yeah, I can understand. rok could make a difference by allocating votes. At the very least, let Curie or one of the other curation guilds use it to help the lower paying posts. IMO, even if he's leaving, that would be a good idea, to help level the field a bit.

rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago (edited)

there was a point in time where I was stoked on being able to throw some voting power behind posts I found value in.

at this point, when a vote is worth like $0.15, the novelty has worn off.

I wasn't arguing I was "right" here, just being honest about my feelings on it all.

and frankly, I don't feel like throwing $0.15 at any post is really going to make that significant of a difference at this point.

If I had an excess of time on my hands and took pleasure in curation, I might be game to spend my time curating. Yet, there's the ideal and reality - and I've got other commitment that demand my time and energy, after which my enthusiasm levels for working for pennies on this site have significantly dropped, and my capacity to take in an excess of content is pretty much maxed out.

simplifying the matter, it comes down to two words: OPPORTUNITY COST.

yes, I could "exert some influence" by throwing $0.15 at a good post. though truthfully, I don't feel this is where my time is best invested at this point.

$0.00

razvanelulmarin (72) · 8 years ago

tl;dr I am selfish, ungrateful and fuck you, new people, that might need my support that I had so generously received when I was new.
See ya, rok!

$0.00

rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

"tl;dr"...

easy to come to own conclusions when don't even bother to invest in seeing different viewpoints.

and clearly no point in expending effort trying to explain if someone not willing to listen/read.

$0.00

shaka (72) · 8 years ago (edited)

@rok-sivante, do you think that you have made sufficient use of your own voting power, to support the kind of content that you would like to see flourishing on this platform? If you are unsure, check your all-time curation rewards on steemwhales.

$3.05

9 votes

rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

to be honest, I really don't feel that throwing $0.20 (or however little it is at this point) at any article really makes much of a difference at all at this point.

two words: OPPORTUNITY COST.

all the hours spent to read tons of content to throw a few dollars of curation rewards at are hours that could be invested elsewhere.

$0.00

shaka (72) · 8 years ago

Dear Rok, I´d like to convince you, that you are strongly underestimating the power of your vote.

Let´s start with the obvious:

If you don´t find the time at all for manual curation you can dedicate your voting power to the different curation guilds, like @curie, @robinhoodwhale or @steemtrail. A voting trail of these guilds results in significant rewards in the range of 10$ to 100$. Without these guilds most of my posts would have remained largely unnoticed.
As the rewards are not growing linear with incoming votes, your vote does not result in 20 ct but dollars (!) if added to already trending posts.

Now here comes the biggest impact you can have with your vote:

If you identify good posts in the 30 minutes window of the news tab with zero or close-to-zero rewards, your 20ct would put a strong mark on these posts that would be seen by many other curators, prompting them to inspect this post, too! Your initial 20 ct (in particular as they are related with your name) would massively increase the chances for that post to make dollars afterwards.

Even if you are still committed to not contribute your content anymore, a huge stack of SP will remain on the platform. Please don´t leave it unused. Go in the news tab 3-4 times per day for 5 min each. You don´t need long to assess whether a post deserves a reward. It´s often a matter of less than a minute to decide.
You earned tens of thousands USD here, so dedicating a bit of time helping others to earn at least something is a fair expectation, I guess.

And it´s not just altruistic, since you would get significant curation rewards if you are good in spotting posts that others will support too. With a quarter of your SP I´m meanwhile at ~80 SP curation rewards peer week. So do the math to estimate what would be in for you (especially, as you can leverage your votes with your huge following).

I hope my arguments will let you reconsider your perspective on the value of your vote.

If your still not convinced, I´m offering you to do one week of curation on your behalf! Reach out to me on steemit.chat, provide me your posting key and I will demonstrate you what can be achieved with the voting power that you have at your disposal.

Thanks!

13 votes

xanoxt (61) · 8 years ago

Yeah, but how about participating in one of the curation guilds? Pick the one that votes for the type of content that you like. That way the cost is zero, you provide value, you get some returns.
Also, for a lot of people those $0.20 could make a lot of difference. Oh, and there is the thing that those $0.20 are actually a lot in SP tokens, especially if (or rather when) the price goes up.

$0.00

knozaki2015 (79) · 8 years ago

70K sp makes a hell of a difference once a post has hit 5-10$...

$0.00

knozaki2015 (79) · 8 years ago

Well, you have 70K SP. Let's put this to a good use. Please contact me, I already dropped you a message in Steemit Chat.

$0.00

georgedonnelly (59) · 8 years ago

I've lost my enthusiasm for the site too but don't consider your reasoning very sound -- despite the fact that I agree with your appraisal of the person in question.

I'm just bored with it.

It's really weird but just paying people is not enough to differentiate the site from its competitors and make you want to use it. They need something more than just a plain white medium-clone with 2005-era posting tech.

The power imbalance between the whales and the rest of us is also more disconcerting than I originally thought it would be.

Best wishes.

$0.70

12 votes

tinfoilfedora (63) · 8 years ago

They need something more than just a plain white medium-clone with 2005-era posting tech.

Good point.

bitcoinmeister (68) · 8 years ago

I am glad to see @georgedonnelly saw this post. @rok-sivante glad to see you survived the "Shemitah". Oh wait everyone survived it. Oh wait again... it was total BS and most clear thinking people could have seen that! https://steemit.com/conspiracy/@bitcoinmeister/debunking-shemitah-silliness-and-the-irony-behind-so-called-free-speech-conspiracy-sites-censoring-critics

anotherjoe (66) · 8 years ago

B-E-T-A
I can understand getting bored. But it seems like folks expect too much of a beta product. Anyone remember what fb looked like the first year? How much did anyone get paid for posting on it? #justsayin'...

piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago

Yup. Great point that I bring up ALL THE TIME lol :)
I think what people are starting to realize is that the money is the only thing attractive about the platform. It is enough to attract people now, when it's the only game in town, but as competitors come onto the scene, we're gonna see a serious exodus. Fortunately, Ned has mentioned that there are a lot of new social features coming soon so we can cross our fingers and see what those are.

steemsmart (60) · 8 years ago (edited)

Totally irrelevant, I'am afraid. This is 2016. The market has moved on. Expectations have changed. The costs of producing quality have decreased.

This makes about as much sense as saying Steemit is better than the clay tablets the Code of Hammurabi were chiseled into. Yeah, sure, but it's not competing for my attention against clay tablets.

Not that I spend loads of time on any social media, for that matter. Social media exhausts me. I'm searching for deep work that is meaningful to me and pays enough to cover my lentil bill.

-- George (damnit, I was certain I'd logged into my personal account.)

$0.00

anotherjoe (66) · 8 years ago

Not irrelevant at all. Your reply indicates that perhaps the point of the comment was missed? @piedpiper obviously got it.

$0.00

georgedonnelly (59) · 8 years ago

You: Expect less. See, here, Facebook 2004/5.
Me: This is 2016, brah. Apples and oranges.
You: You've misunderstood my point but I'm not actually going to attempt to clarify it.
Me: :rolleyes: It's up to the communicator to make his point, not throw a couple words and a screenshot down and blame the listener for failing to exercise ESP.

$0.00

anotherjoe (66) · 8 years ago

Sigh.... The problem isn't misunderstanding, it's being rude about it. But maybe it helps that Gabe and I are connected telepathically. Of course, you upvoted his comment... lol.

$0.00

mindhunter (72) · 8 years ago

Quick everyone buy Golos....to the next crypto shit-coin we go!!...I've not made a single crypto-profit since Mazacoin...and baby wipes were eventually needed there too to clean up the mess! LOL!

$0.00

radioactivities (61) · 8 years ago

have you stopped doing steemsmart?

$0.00

piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago

We took a break but but will get back into it with a new format soon. Easy to burn out when you're trying to put out an episode per day while juggling everyone's jobs, business schedules, etc. Gotta just take it down a notch and keep it fun, I think.

$0.00

piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago (edited)

At times like this, it's important to take stock of the non-monetary value that has come from the experience and focus on that. In my case, steemit enabled my buddy @jakevanderark to move to Chile and start collaborating with me on screenplays and that one thing alone made it all worthwhile. It also helped one of our Fort Galt members, @onceuponatime to come and visit us down here (he introduced me to the platform in the first place, which was pretty awesome). Even as I watch the value of steem fall and the platform itself devolve into the Doom Porn Infomercial Channel, I can always focus on the good things and thank the founders for what they've created. As you said, it's absolutely an experiment and I still say it's a great one but there's a long way to go before it's the sort of thing that I can stand behind and vouch for as a finished product. I was here for the crazy days in the beginning too, and of course we all knew that things would balance out over time, and they have... but as @mindhunter alluded to, the founders still retain the power to mold the community according to their whims and in principle, this is not a good thing. Decentralization is a key principle that is touted in the whitepaper and it's part of why many of us believe in steemit.

Having said all that, I'm happy to keep helping out around here as much as I can with the caveat that it's very much an experimental work-in-progress. I think of it as a fun little hobby project that may or may not develop into something really worth championing some day. At the very least, it has demonstrated a model for other developers to learn from and with a little luck, we'll one day have a whole bunch of alternatives to choose from.

In the mean time, I'm seriously re-evaluating my quiet, gentlemanly approach to certain matters... I'd gladly sacrifice my reputation points and future earnings in order to help clean things up for everyone else and give Steemit a better chance for mass adoption and success.

$0.30

16 votes

brianphobos (70) · 8 years ago

I'm glad you said "I'd gladly sacrifice my reputation points and future earnings in order to help clean things up for everyone else and give Steemit a better chance for mass adoption and success."
I have been biting my tongue about a lot of things on here and unfortunately for guys like me the payouts have been extremely frustrating. Only an extremely stubborn person would still be on here working for $0.50 / hour. Steemit has hemoraged so many good content creators it isn't even funny. Eventually there won't be any new people who have the crypto skills and exchange accounts to join this platform. Steemit needed us to create content and help create a bridge for people outside the crypto world. By upvoting sock puppet accounts everyday they have alienated a very important demographic off of this platform. Would anyone really expect a guy like me to spend my time creating on here when I can spend 5 hours on a post and not even be able to buy a candy bar with the payout?

ibringawareness (63) · 8 years ago

Re: "At the very least, it has demonstrated a model for other developers to learn from..."
Good point (not your only one, haha, but) Yes, Steemit Inc and all of us need to remain aware that if not kept "in tip-top shape" its model will be copied and/or improved upon. As said I just spend $200 on BTC to convert to Steem, and have been somewhat all-in to date, but I've also signed up for Akasha to see what it offers. Steemit has broken ground yes, but keeping the top position even in the market you created is a whole different ballgame. "Tom" at MySpace knows this all too well, so hopefully we'll find ourselves emulating "Jeff" at Amazon.com more than anyone. He basically invented (or popularized?) the concept of an online affiliate program for instance, and stayed on top even after Books-a-Million , Walenbooks, and other bookstores came online as his early "competitors". I know Steemit has an affiliate program in the background - it might be time to rev it up in order to dominate marketshare before other competitors arise?

ats-david (74) · 8 years ago

$0.00

piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago

Sad but true... wanna start a kamikaze squad? lol

$0.00

ats-david (74) · 8 years ago

$0.00

richardjuckes (65) · 8 years ago

That badge of honour again!

$0.00

brianphobos (70) · 8 years ago

What happened with your posts was really upsetting. You made the sacrifice and to be honest with you I also bit my toungue because I really needed the money consider how much time I have spent on this platform.

At this point Steemit is at a major pivot point and all the good content creators are going to end up leaving if some of these issues aren't addressed.

Steemit is such an amazing thing and it is seriously sad that it might be completely ruined by a few early adopters who ended up with an enormous amount of power.

$0.00

thecryptofiend (74) · 8 years ago

There are a lot of people in this community. The presence of one person is not a reason to leave or stay away. I hope you reconsider.

$0.27

12 votes

kyriacos (71) · 8 years ago

He is not going anywhere. he is just whining because there are no more 5k and 6k posts like before. He is trying some attention whoring.

$0.15

thecryptofiend (74) · 8 years ago

Lol you never hold back:)

$0.00

rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

of course not.

perhaps the article came across as misbalanced, given I've been holding it in for so long - though the person/issue in question has been just one contributing factor. the main reason for considering taking a break: OPPORTUNITY COST.

$0.00

thecryptofiend (74) · 8 years ago

OK.

$0.00

brianphobos (70) · 8 years ago

I agree that the presence of one person isn't a reason to leave or stay. While I don't agree with the persons views he is talking about I have never been too overly concerned with that persons payouts. There are far worse problems going on with Steemit than just that. It is a damn shame. Steem / Steemit is one of the greatest invovations the Internet has ever seen and it might not survive. :-(

$0.00

piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago

The concept will survive, even if this first platform doesn't. It's still a great idea, no matter what cancers happen to taint the first iteration. I'm still optimistic and will stick around for the long game, even if it takes longer than I hoped to get the kinks ironed out :)

$0.15

brianphobos (70) · 8 years ago

I agree with you. The concept will survive for sure.
But ask yourself this. If your payouts get as low as mine for the amount of time I have put in would you still post here?
Good content creators are leaving in droves.

$0.00

piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago

I'll still post when inspiration strikes but I won't set time aside in my daily routine for it, that's for sure.

$0.00

brianphobos (70) · 8 years ago

Yeah it isn't worth my time especially when I see sock puppets consistently making mad cash. I started my power down last night and will likely turn my account into a curration bot to upvote good content creators like yourself who I know are real and make good content and that way I won't really spend time on here except in a few situations where I want to get on and post something.

piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago

@brianphobos - That's a serious compliment. Thanks :)

$0.00

https://steemit.com/steemit/@radioactivities/rock-the-witness-vote-together-our-voice-matters

radioactivities (61) · 8 years ago

I'm trying to get a campaign to vote for the same witnesses. Your opinion is appreciated!

$0.00

piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago

@radioactivities - Cool. I already vote. @pharesim did a great job of explaining the world of witnessing to us on the steem smart podcast and I check-in every once in a while. I wish I could downvote/flag witnesses too but I guess we can't have everything ;)

$0.00

thecryptofiend (74) · 8 years ago

Only time will tell.

$0.00

donkeypong (75) · 8 years ago

Take some time off. I hope you'll be back. It's easy to get depressed when the price and rewards are low, but this is the very beginning of a much, much bigger set of projects in the Steem ecosystem. All your SP will be worth something someday!

$0.20

brianphobos (70) · 8 years ago

"It's easy to get depressed when the price and rewards are low"
REALLY? The rewards for your posts have never been low. Your Yellowstone National Park post just made over $1,000 and your Tide Pooling post made over $1,300. Both those posts had no original pictures or anything. Were they worth something? Sure. But look at my recent posts for Canyonlands, Mesa Verde, and Petrified Forest. Original content, great pictures, great story......etc..

I can't even buy lunch with the payouts despite having over 300 followers and people who love my stuff? How much longer do you think good content creators are going to stick around on this platform when the payout differencial is that skewed?

Steemit needed good content creators that know enough about crypto to not be intimidated by this platform. Once we are gone who is going to replace us? There aren't that many people in the crypto world that can produce content like this and are willing to take the gamble of spending 5 hours on a post and getting paid $0.36. It is a damn shame but Steemit is one of the most amazing invovations the Internet has ever seen but I'm giving it a 50/50 chance to survive.

$0.00

wingz (65) · 8 years ago (edited)

@brianphobos - I think you've really directed that at the wrong person. @donkeypong has helped to set up curie , was instrumental in helping steemSTEM get off the ground and now recently announced Steem Guild...

Also, you have some pretty cool posts, I'm following :)

brianphobos (70) · 8 years ago

Thank you for following and the kind words but It doesn't change the fact that the reward system is so skewed. How do you think I feel when I'm trying my hardest to put good content out there and can't make it. I'm not saying he hasn't done anything and that his posts aren't worth anything but his Yellowstone National Park post just made over $1,000 and his Tide Pooling post made over $1,300.
If I could make $100 / day on here liquid. (SBD and STEEM) I could devote full time to this platform and really crank out some super high quality stuff. Hardly any pure content creators can do this because the rewards are so skewed. It is going to cause all the good content creators to leave. It is already been happening.

$0.00

lukestokes (75) · 8 years ago

It appears this site has not become what I had envisioned it to be.

What did you envision it to be? I'm not sure that was clearly outlined in your post here. Your expectations aren't being met, so you want to quit. But what are your expectations?

Do you expect a platform which only rewards posts you agree with and not ones you don't? Are you upset that people with influence on this network like the reporting that's being done by the person in question even if, as you said, it could be called B.S. from another perspective? I like some of their posts (because they legitimately let me know about events going on that I wasn't previously aware of), and I call others out as ridiculous.

Your post here has a lot of back and forth in it. On one hand you're saying you're upset about a post which didn't earn as much as you expect, on the other you're saying you'd rather post somewhere for free. You're saying someone else is earning too much money, while also saying you didn't really care about the money. Is the problem with others or your own expectations?

If someone really is a con artist and scammer, why not bring forward evidence and call them out to protect the community you love so much? If they are not, then why leave?

$0.19

kyriacos (71) · 8 years ago

he envisioned it to be 5-6k posts like before....how the fuck do the admins promote degenerates like him is beyond me

$0.00

freedomengineer (58) · 8 years ago

great questions @lukestokes I would like to read @rok-sivante answers.

$0.00

lukestokes (75) · 8 years ago

Sadly, I think they will not come. If that's the case, then hopefully new writers will take his place and show genuine, long term love for this community.

$0.00

rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

the person isn't question isn't THE reason I've been feeling ready to leave - and it's not the person in question, just a contributing factor.

others have brought forth evidence, and it's been ignored. I don't feel it my personal mission to call anyone out. because I have valued the principle of an uncensored platform and level playing field, I've kept my mouth shut (fingers restrained) the whole time. this one issue in particular might seem blown out of proportion, relative to where I actually stand on it because it's been bottled up. and any "back and forth" is likely intentional, because I'm not holding to one extreme position or another - but both are worthy of acknowledgement, and the truth always lies somewhere in the middle. and as I said - just cuz people do shady shit in their past doesn't mean they aren't worthy of forgiveness - and there's always another side to every story. I may have needed to vent some frustration on the matter, but that doesn't mean I'm going to outright disrespect anybody and bring up allegations and issues others have experienced with them, when there are others in the community who do value some of their contributions, regardless of my personal opinions.

the bigger reason I've been questioning stepping away, summed up in two words: OPPORTUNITY COST.

maybe that didn't come through clearly in the writing, as it was written fast and perhaps emotionally-influenced. perhaps I did have some expectations of sorts - in which case the disillusionment is my own fault. and I never intended to outline my vision for the community in this piece because that was not the focus, and was stuff I'd been writing about months ago.

$0.00

lukestokes (75) · 8 years ago (edited)

If you're truly leaving because of "OPPORTUNITY COST" then please be honest enough with yourself and others to say that up front. Don't use an emotional rant about someone else or how the values of the platform are out of alignment. Say it plainly like this:

You, the Steemit community, are not worth my time anymore. I have more important and more valuable things to do.

That would have been honest. You could have also just slipped out the back door becuase you're busy with other things. To instead post an emotional rant / rage quit and call to question the values of the platform is disrespectful to those of us who do think it's worth our time and are working to shape those values daily.

I've voiced my respect for the raw honesty you've shown in the past. That created an expectation for me which wasn't met here.

I wish you well, sir.

$0.00

rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago (edited)

I'm not sure if its your misunderstanding or my miscommunication at root of the conflict here.

as I've said, there are multiple factors contributing my disillusionment with the site, (and I don't appreciate having words put in my mouth as you've attempted here.)

frame it as "an emotional rant" if you want - the point is, this community has been throwing money at - making an investment in - a person whose track record is a threat to the integrity of the community. I held in my viewpoint for two months - and finally, there came the breaking point where I needed to be honest about matter. perhaps, it stirred up more trouble than it was worth, without having gone into extensive detail trying to point out to people the subtle details in the dynamics of the matter that most do not see. (and perhaps I had other expectations at play of others to read between the lines.)

some things can't be spelled out directly - and it's a fine like to walk with a degree of uncertainty, determining whether to keep quiet altogether or drop a few breadcrumbs for those to follow who feel compelled to dig and find out for themselves.

based on both your comments, you're trying to paint things out as though they're clear black or white. you seem to be getting hung up on specific points and getting defensive rather than viewing the larger context as a whole - maybe that's a consequence of my not having written things more clearly. but then again, regardless of how clearly they could be written, maybe I should have expected such responses by honestly putting forth a viewpoint that challenged the culture - classic group psychology.

$0.00

lukestokes (75) · 8 years ago (edited)

I don't appreciate having words put in my mouth as you've attempted here

I apologize. My intention was not to offend you but to (hopefully) help you understand how the words you are using here can be interpreted (and are being interpreted by me).

it was written fast and perhaps emotionally-influenced

Maybe "emotional rant" went too far, but whether or not something is a "rant", to me, is subjective. This post fit what I consider a rant and as you are an important member of this community to date, I called you out on it.

some things can't be spelled out directly

In communication, all we have to go on is the words we use.

you seem to be getting hung up on specific points

I based my reply on what you indicated was the primary reason: OPPORTUNITY COST. You not only put it in all caps, but you replied to others with the same answer. How else should I interpret that but with the words you say I put in your mouth?

Opportunity Costs:
the loss of potential gain from other alternatives when one alternative is chosen.

Maybe it's impolite to say, "Steemit is no longer valuable enough to me to continue. My time and attention are more valuable elsewhere." but how else should I have interpreted your main point? I also dislike when people put words in my mouth, but I further dislike when I (or anyone else) uses language which portrays true feelings even if I (or they) don't currently recognize it. I prefer people who care about me point out the meanings of the words I'm using and, hopefully, reveal a part of my subconscious I wasn't ware of (and often don't like).

I'm fine with opportunity cost being part of your reasoning. Surely there are many more, but as you said, it's very nuanced and hard to communicate. I'm fine with Steemit not being as valuable to you now as it once might have been. The reason for my defensiveness is that I'm defending something I value (this community), specifically when the values of this community or put on trial instead of what you yourself said is a more accurate reason: Opportunity Cost.

When it comes to tribal loyalties and community involvement, it's not uncommon to devalue the community in our own minds before being able to leave it. It's quite common, actually. If you have other uses of your time that are more valuable to you, then by all means, pursue them. I hope, as you said, you'll also come back here from time to time and provide some value to us as well. I'm glad you communicated emotions you had bottled up for months. Unfortunately, when we bottle up emotions for too long, often their expression is misunderstood.

$0.00

rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

thanks for this last clarification.

it has been a wild ride here, from the highs to the lows, all the investment I put into the community, to being disillusioned (perhaps just by my own expectations), and gaining different perspectives on it all along the way.

and granted, I got defensive at your comments, also. odd loops. it felt weird to be called disrespectful by questioning the community values, when I've been supporting the community from the start - and the reasoning for bringing up the issue is because it stands to reason having a person with a history as a shuckster being the top ambassor might not be in the best long-term interest in solidifying the site's reputation outside its own circle jerk. also got defensive at the suggestion any of this was less than raw honest - as honestly was the whole point. though yeah - backed up emotion may not have translated clearly, and I may still have my moments where an aggressiveness overrides the diplomacy.

I appreciate this last articulation/reply of yours. :-)

$0.00

james-show (58) · 8 years ago

wow ...you went total stellabelle on Steemit!

$0.16

thebluepanda (66) · 8 years ago

too funny not to upvote your comment hahahahahahahahahhahaha

james-show (58) · 8 years ago (edited)

I am happy that at least one person got it!
Up-voting for totally selfish (non financial) purposes!
[edit] ohh now the good old "Dannie the lion" apparently got it too! Well, he is kind of whaley now, will survive me not up-voting him :)

$0.00

jrcornel (84) · 8 years ago

This can all be changed by making a decision that you will not vote for this person any longer. If enough people do this, his reward pool will be cut off. I know who you are talking about... I don't agree with a lot of what you have written here but I do feel some of your frustrations with the site... Instead of leaving and complaining about it though, we should proactively try to do something about. I got involved with SG as my part to helping improve the site. Our first post was today: https://steemit.com/steemit/@donkeypong/announcing-steem-guild-a-second-stage-project-to-continue-supporting-good-authors-after-project-curie#@dragosroua/re-jrcornel-re-dragosroua-re-donkeypong-announcing-steem-guild-a-second-stage-project-to-continue-supporting-good-authors-after-project-curie-20161010t173752857z

$0.15

10 votes

piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago (edited)

Agreed. Unfortunately, the curation rewards appear to take priority. The founders started a bandwagon effect that a bunch of bots have latched on to and their controllers don't want to detach them as long as the money is flowing. Thanks for joining SG, by the way! Great initiative :)

$0.00

fat-like-buddha (58) · 8 years ago (edited)

I was the very first person to call out who you are talking about the very first day in his introduction post and I have paid dearly for it ever since. I called BS on the payout for that worthless POS post that generated something close to 5 thousand dollars. I strongly believe a turning point for the worse is when this person joined the platform. I am not suggesting this one person is the cause but it was about the time things here started to change in a negative way.

I am almost positive I have been blacklisted on my account because of it too. I haven't had a payout worth any amount for the time I put into a post since that day. I have had a few Ned and Dan votes but with a devalued % in payout.

Go look at his introduction post and you will see my post in there calling out the system and him defending it as well. Since then I accepted I won't grow a following here because of that, which is ok. I had and still have several other outlets for my work that I am guaranteed to get paid on.

Now I will admit my posts are probably not worth thousands of dollars that I have released here on Steemit. I purposely didn't share the work that I put a great deal of time and effort into until the platform proved to me first it was worth doing so. I believe Steemit needs to prove to quality content creators first and foremost before we commit great deals of time and energy.

I forged ahead with releasing content here with a very cautiously optimistic attitude, and obviously up to this point, my gut instinct has been right. I have only given to Steemit so far and have taken nothing from it. What you see in my wallet is what I have earned but have left it there.

For some time now I have had the thought that Steemit just might be a 2-year long experiment where a select few will benefit greatly from it. And if for some reason it took off they benefit even more. There really doesn't seem to be a lose lose situation for a handful of them.

From how the mining started to the sock puppet accounts today, it is very hard to convincingly say Steemit is going to succeed.

If there is anything that I take away from Steemit as it currently sits, is that a platform like this could never be successful when real monetary value is attached to it (money). It seems nearly impossible to create a fail proof system where the "gamers" won't find a way to game the system to their advantage leaving everyone else SOL.

$0.13

7 votes

rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

RESPECT.

$0.00

richardjuckes (65) · 8 years ago

I think it is just possible that "a certain party" is not a scam, but part of a controlled opposition. If he shouts "look up", look down, and so on. There might be some usefulness.

$0.00

brianphobos (70) · 8 years ago

@rok-sivante Thank you for writting this post. A lot of people have been biting their tongue about the issues around here. Steemit is one of the most amazing platforms and concepts the Internet has ever seen. Sadly it might not survive. It is hemoraging great content creators like yourself who understand crypto. The crypto community isn't that big and it is an issue once everyone has taken a look at this and determined it to be an unfair system. A lot of times when crypto coins die they don't recover. Mintcoin, Feathercoin, Quark....etc. The people with the voting power might figure that we are lower level than them but when all the good content creators who the hell is going to replace them? Your general person out in society isn't technical enough to deal with the crypto and exchange it out. We already have the exchange accounts. We were already ready for this.
Do the people with voting power really think that we are going to stick around and work on this platform for $0.12 / hour while sock puppet accounts are upvoted consistently?
Steemit is 80% the way there but suddenly it has a 50/50 chance to survive. It is alienating almost all the good content creators who know enough about crypto to exist on this platform.
My predicition is that STEEM is going to $0.05 and at that time if the whales don't stop powering down then there is a good chance the platform is finished. It is extremely sad that this amazing platform could become a flash in crypto history.

mindhunter (72) · 8 years ago (edited)

My monthly chart Parabolic SAR dots are extrapolating a predicted price of $0.15 by November's Steemfest. Your $0.05 prediction is around late December.

$0.00

brianphobos (70) · 8 years ago

Yep, that is exactly what I was thinking. $0.05 in a couple of months. Some of these whales are wreckless enough to just drive the price in the ground at that point. Suddenly it will be like Auroracoin and all the good content creators will have left because the only accounts getting upvoted will be sockpuppets with plagiarized posts.

$0.00

mindhunter (72) · 8 years ago

Auroracoin and whales + Iceland - I'm sure there's a link there somewhere??? sockpuppets with plagiarized posts - I like that line ;)

$0.00

mindhunter (72) · 8 years ago

$10 million has fallen out of STEEM's market cap in 24 hours! OUCH!!!

$0.00

tinfoilfedora (63) · 8 years ago

Good Points.
The only real maneuver left to save it is to pull a Synereo style burning of the ninjamine.
https://blog.synereo.com/2016/09/16/synereo-burns-half-of-all-amps-in-existence/
That is how you strengthen your crypto, brand, and reputation all in one shot. If something similar doesn't happen before Steem drops below a nickle, I don't see much chance for recovery.

$0.00

brianphobos (70) · 8 years ago

It is an interesting strategy. It certainly will be hard for Steem to recover if it drops below a nickle. It becomes way to risky for people to power up because they can't overcome the wave of power downs. New user retention is way too low to make up for the power downs.
If everyone in the top 25 especially @ned and @dantheman would stop their power downs that would at least send a very positive message to the remaining content creators.
I almost think that they know STEEM is going to $0.05 or less but instead of taking action at this point they probably figure that they will stop their power downs at that level. Unfortunately at that point it will probably be too late.

$0.00

tinfoilfedora (63) · 8 years ago (edited)

If you have watched bitshares, the constant drain by the founding\witness crew never stops. Every projects minings\earnings is sold hand over fist as fast as possible until it is worthless, investors be damned.
There is only one chance to keep Steem in the pocket change range, by burning the unfair ninjamined coin advantage, and I have not seen anything indicating they have the character to actually do it.

$0.00

ibringawareness (63) · 8 years ago

So glad you said that. As much as I've said today on this, I'm a newbie still and Steem is my main intro to Crypto (bought $10 BTC in January, and that's my whole whole crypto history). I might make one more purchase at 5cents if that happens (!) but am keeping my eye on other crypto now, and Akasha as well. Your sock puppet and 50/50 chance comments rang true with me. Upvoted this as well, Thank you.

$0.00

themagus (68) · 8 years ago

In my mind the best reply ....

$0.00

rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

respect for this comment. wins my vote for best reply yet.

$0.00

ats-david (74) · 8 years ago

$0.00

whatsup (75) · 8 years ago

I have said over and over again that I came here to invest. As in real money. I am still investing time, but I just can't find a reason to purchase Steem. To improve my voting power would take too big of an investment for the return.

I love to write, but I don't have an awesome story every day. I think to date I have made a few cents from curation, because I try to avoid voting for the exact accounts which have been referenced.

I don't care that people are talking about Doom and Gloom, I do care the curation motivations are very low.

Those who have talked about the "issues" get flagged and chewed out by whales.

I was an early adopter of Facebook, back when Mark Z. was your first friend. He wasn't rich and powerful yet either. There was a lot of talk and comparisons to MySpace.com. You didn't see mark running around and telling everyone to stop saying anything bad. In fact he interviewed people who were negative and built their suggestions into the platform.

We shall see what the future of Steem/Steemit holds.

piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago

Yeah, I don't like thinking of it as a job or anything serious like that. When you have something to contribute, just go for it and don't worry about the pay. Likewise, when you read something you like, go ahead and upvote it but don't feel obligated to vote on a certain number of posts per day or anything like that. Unless it's fun, it'll die.

$0.00

brianphobos (70) · 8 years ago

I have thought about it from that standpoint as well. I asked myself. How much would it take for people to "Whale UP?" The number is too great for sure to make their vote worth anything. I have been here for over 3 months cranking out content and my vote is worth $0.01. I can only earn about 5 Steem Power each week from curation. So let's say I don't have the money to Whale UP the question is would others?
The answer seems to be just like what you are saying. The investment is too big for the return at this point. And it is too big of a risk. The investment could just erode away as the biggest accounts continue to power down.

You are so right about the correct course of action being to interview people who have been on this platform to really figure out how to address some of the issues.

To be fair some of the feedback has been taken into consideration for sure. Hopefully somehow some way we can save Steem / Steemit.

$0.00

james-show (58) · 8 years ago

Several guys from this group https://steemit.chat/group/steeminvestors (me included) hold exactly the same thinking.
Actually when I read this I thought it was written by me:

What we need are actual long-term investors who actually care about the success of the platform and the success of content creators - and who also care about the reputation of Steemit as a social media and content creation community. Right now, I'm not seeing many investors who want to touch this. They really don't have a reason to. Something will need to change soon

ats-david (74) · 8 years ago

$0.00

james-show (58) · 8 years ago (edited)

Contact@twinner (by private message) - tell him you are a perfect candidate "per my estimation" especially if you do not meet the general criteria - which is "SP less than 50% of author rewards."
Actually I did that for you. Just if your chat handle is not 'ats-david' in the chat, tell him what it actually is.

$0.00

bendjmiller222 (64) · 8 years ago

It will be a shame to loose your voice from this platform @rok-sivante - I consider you a good friend and regardless of where you decide to go, I feel you will make a big impact.

You have a lot of wisdom to impart, and even if you decide to no longer post on steemit, I hope you will continue to mentor others you feel deserve the valuable time you have to offer.

While not everyone will agree with your post and the content it contains, nobody will ever be able to claim you are fake or wrote from anywhere other than your heart.

There are not even mainstream celebrities on steemit yet, and I feel Steemfest will reinvigorate the platform as the most influential and serious steemians that are willing to attend will have the chance to meet face to face and work alongside one another.

I'm always happy to hear from you, and will remain a friend no matter where you go. Blessing to you and your wife and whatever the future holds for you!

$0.07

rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

thanks, brotha.

I haven't totally declared a departure. Though if it turns out to be such - could always be like my Black Album. (reference Jay-Z's retirement. lol.)

I did find it kinda funny to be called "shady" somewhere in these comments alongside the scam artist - being one of the few here not to be hiding behind a fake avatar name, and having received the best responses to my writings from being fully transparent and raw. But hey - people will jump to their own conclusions.

and oh ya - what's your Wealth Dynamics profile?

$0.00

bendjmiller222 (64) · 8 years ago

Believe it or not it is on my list to do today. I've had a lot on my plate from my grandmother passing away, putting together memorial pictures, helping friends with steemit and trying to have a social life, but it truly is the very next thing. Thank you so much for thinking of me. I will give the results you you late tonight or tomorrow!

$0.00

sponge-bob (71) · 8 years ago

I had the same feeling when Bitcoin went to $40 and then to $8
From $1300 back down to $200
It kills me to sell when it's low, so I don't.
The whales here have no problem buying a pizza for 14,000,000 dollars though. That is what they are doing in selling out now.
From the stock market to retiring on my bitcoin mining profits - I am happy to toss a few more bitcoins into Steem and the platform - if it pans out, great! If not, it was all free money anyway.

$0.05

thylbom (55) · 8 years ago (edited)

Steemit is still in Beta release. Whether or not it's worth while of any particular person is a decision each will make. Seems @rok-sivante has been doing quite well, despite his concerns. The platform is paying people for content. The market for Steem currency is still immature and will be for quite some time into the future. It is what it is...

7 votes

sponge-bob (71) · 8 years ago

Well, I have not gotten noticed for content and I don't want to be noticed as my real identity - Lybia did that and when they found out that Lybia doesn't want to use the dollar any longer (like me), Lybia got a can of whoop ass from the same government I grew up under.
I'm not very good at blogging, so I invested my money and votes here. I retired at an early age so I can read your posts and rate them - lovin' it. Well as long as there is an internet connection.

$0.00

rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

" It is what it is..."

perfect summary. :-)

$0.00

ibringawareness (63) · 8 years ago (edited)

Sorry to double post (but your article is very content-rich!) but in reply to :
"Nonetheless, Steemit’s reputation in the broader crypto community has been on shaky ground. And cases like this don’t strengthen Steemit’s position."
Both are possibly true statements, but speaking as someone who is not part of the broader crypto-community, that view may not ultimately matter, because so much of Steemit's early success to date is because it appeals to non-crypto users like me (i.e. Steemit is attracting the so-called "mainstream") and looks like it will continue to do so. The opinions of the crypto-community just might have to adjust in time, if Steemit continues to succeed (despite currently falling prices I mean).
But my thanks still for talking openly about a factor you believe is hurting its chances at success!

jeff-kubitz (69) · 8 years ago

Writers get tired and need a break. People who live in their own little world and we all do, end up seeing more of the world than they thought they would ever see and sometimes, they don't like it. As for conspiracy, there always was, always is, and always will be. That's just the way life is on planet Earth. Freedom and liberty are not free, they cost an awful, tremendously high price. Take a break. Put away the computer screen. See the planet and people. I bet you will know why you are here after a while.

rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

wise words right there. :-)

$0.00

ash (73) · 8 years ago

tuck-fheman (74) · 8 years ago

Who needs charts when you can hear the bottom oozing from post. The time to buy is oh so near.

What's a little humorous about this post is, it's a complaint against TDV and his core business model, yet the content of this post is doom-porn for Steem conspiracy theorist. ;)

piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago (edited)

"I'm not happy with this and don't want to play anymore" is quite a bit different than "the world economy is going to crash this October because mystical jew date." One is a statement of personal preference while the other is bat-shit insanity used to scare suckers into paying for passports that they never receive.

7 votes

tuck-fheman (74) · 8 years ago

lolz.

So much emotion is contained within those few sentences. :)

Regardless of how humorous your blockchain "bitch slap" to TDV is, I still see some similarities.

In the most simplistic form, TVD is saying, "I'm not happy with the Federal Reserve printing money out of thin air and I don't want to play anymore". :)

I am not a TDV fanboy, nor a hater. This post caught my eye, and I saw a similarity that could be exploited into humor. I have researched some of the complaints against him, but I don't have enough information or desire to form an opinion about his business dealings; because I have no need to do business with him. ;)

piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago (edited)

lol I know. I've enjoyed your comics in the past so don't mind me.
I have a ton of info (had a front row seat at his biggest clusterfuck ever) so I guess it's time to speak up and stop being such a Canadaian about it. :P

$0.30

anotherjoe (66) · 8 years ago

lol
I have nothing more to contribute... too funny.

onetree (68) · 8 years ago

If nothing else, stay for the SHOW. And judging by the comments, what a SHOW!

nataleeoliver (60) · 8 years ago (edited)

If we follow the evolutionary curve of Bitcoin, silver, gold and Steem now it seems that the Steem be in the penultimate devaluation before departure for stability at a good level value.

I'm not a professional of cryptocurrencies but rather a careful observer and asks you what you think of my reasoning.

However, the only formula I know for a successful continuation of Steemit is :

TELL ALL UP : I BELIEVE IN STEEMIT !
This is called TRUST and nothing can be done without that.

Wait and see.
Steemit is a wonderful experience.

Happy to have read you.

Passionate about travelling and photography.
@nataleeoliver.

eeks (68) · 8 years ago

Maybe it would help if you curated more? This community is what we make of it. If you exit it, we lose out on your influence and impact. I hope you reconsider as we will all lose for it.

fat-like-buddha (58) · 8 years ago

Let's be honest here, the majority of us can vote all we want all day and it doesn't mean a damn thing. It won't fix the "main" problems and issues sorry.

$0.00

rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

$0.20 per post doesn't exert anywhere near as much influence/impact as your reply would suggest.

the bigger issue, really: OPPORTUNITY COST.

$0.00

cynetyc (70) · 8 years ago

I read your post and I seen some lets say bad parts of Steemit site but I do not share the same side.
I am confident that Steemit will grow...I mean I still says beta up in the left corner.. and there are so many people who work on apps and new ideas for the site and curency as well... So all that give me more confidence.
I am sad to hear that you want to leave Steemit but I respect your opinion!

brains (57) · 8 years ago

People are still calling bitcoin a scam. I want to shake the scammer's hand though.

$0.00

piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago

Well, ignorant people are... nobody that understands it is. Apples and oranges, in that regard.

$0.00

ervin-lemark (71) · 8 years ago

Dear @rok-sivante, thank you very much for all your wonderful posts. I enjoyed reading many of them.

I am in no position to judge you, your words, decisions and actions. I don't even expect that you will reply to any of our comments. But you've pushed us to come out. I bet this was one of your intentions with the article.

We can only speak for ourselves, for our actions and beliefs.

I see this platform as a big opportunity for a really successful self-sustainable blogging platform. Never mind the technology behind it. It is the usage that determines the outcome. It is the ethics of it. And this platform, better said the Gods of Steemitverse lack the ethics, lack the empathy towards all the members of the community. Towards each and every one of us, without distinction.

This platform might be decentralised technologically. I disagree on that account too. But it is extremely centralised when it comes to the power distribution. If this doesn't change it will be the end of it.

Recently there are many initiatives forming - curation groups, curator's led benevolent bots, many different tries to make it interesting and engaging, ...

But none, not one, of these initiatives is coming from the Gods of Steemitverse themselves. Sad, very sad.

Will I stick here for a while longer? I will. But at the same time I am investing more and more of my energy and resources into other options which appear to have a much more sounder ground. You can check all my $0.00 posts to see what I am hinting at :)

Rok, good luck to you.

Better and better!

$0.00

sift666 (65) · 8 years ago

Something I'm really curious about is why nobody is mentioning "his" name?

I'll censor myself now and just say JB aka TDV but I have no idea why. He was the guy that got me into Steemit over two months ago.

I agree he overdoes the end is nigh stuff, but he has brought in more new users to Steemit than anyone else and deserves his success.

$0.00

ibringawareness (63) · 8 years ago (edited)

I'm glad you shared this but for now anyways, I'm going to agree with the part where you said essentially "anybody can post anything and the market determines the value..".
I want scams exposed, and I think you gave enough info for a regular user here to figure out whom you're referring to (without naming names), and if I'm right about who he/she, then I'd say he/she is free to post those opinions and time will tell. But I'm reminded of the msgivings fiasco. Scams may prosper here for a bit, but they'll be found out and downvoted/flagged/exposed - hopefully. But if you're not going to name names that just makes it harder actually. I know nothing of that person's background tho, and can't judge without more info/facts. I probably won't judge anyways.
As for me, I just bought $200 worth of BTC via Coinbase that I'm waiting to clear, so I can invest in Steempower. Obviously, I'm not ready to quit, and am vesting/investing in the long term power of this community.

$0.00

powerup (57) · 8 years ago

Patethic.

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bitcoinparadise (67) · 8 years ago

This is unfortunate as by posting this type of content, you help those like myself to see things from a different perspective. I just found you from someone posting your link and I would like it if you would reconsider and stay to provide information from your perspective as it has helped the community to grow. I'm sure you have other things going on but there are those out there that read your words and hear you.
Till next time.

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rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

thank you for this feedback. it is much appreciated. :-)

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bitcoinparadise (67) · 8 years ago

Thanks, It was nice to see a reply from you. It seems like you have a lot of support here.

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pharnal (33) · 8 years ago

As a person who is new to the steemit platform and cryptocurrency in general I appreciate you cador. I don't yet know what I will take away from the post but as someone who has little time and talent to blog I don't know how successful I will be in this community. Can you mention some of the other cryptocurrencues that you are looking into?

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rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

"Can you mention some of the other cryptocurrencues that you are looking into?"

for what purpose?

The bulk of my portfolio is in Bitcoin and Ethereum. Have also put some into Bitland (because I support the cause), ICOO, and then smaller amounts in a few others (Synereo, Heat, DeOS, Waves, PeerPlays, a couple others).

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liondani (69) · 8 years ago

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l0k1 (69) · 8 years ago

I got an odd and similar feeling come over me tonight. I'm going to go to Amsterdam anyway, and I have my SteemFEST ticket but just at the moment the air is not blowing into my sails. I think I'm going to enjoy being out in the unknown again, wandering, not really knowing where I'm going. Sure, I'm going to Amsterdam, and I know that I can scrape by there, even without Steem, but my enthusiasm for it is waning.

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mindhunter (72) · 8 years ago (edited)

@l0k1 - I know how you feel. But for those in the know in cryptos, you can have the BEST community in the world, but a ninja mined / pre-mined crypto will always fail unless the founders disseminate their early gains to the community quickly. Other crypto-coin have done it - but not Steemit. This may be the rock they perish on. Dutch courage must be taken to reverse the price slides of today. URGENTLY!!

l0k1 (69) · 8 years ago (edited)

I'm inclined to think that this is just a transition period. Ya know, it's really weird, the feeling just came over me in this last 12 hours. Like there was something shifting in the world around me. I don't think it will take long, but I don't mind, I'm going to Amsterdam anyway, and I've got my entry, and i'll get 1000SP in my account when I get my wristband. Maybe by then the trouble that has come will be dealt with. By the sounds of what this article talks about, a reckoning is at hand.

Steem has been a quite singular occurance in my life. On my writing I have managed to get by about 6 weeks without doing anything but focusing on it. I'm just going to go on a trip and maybe I won't post much along the way, or when I arrive, for a while. But I don't get the feeling this is the end of it here at all, rather, that this is a necessary phase for the whole enterprise.

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mindhunter (72) · 8 years ago (edited)

Don't lose heart @l0k1 - it can be solved like other cryptos - but it requires swift hands - otherwise it's death by a thousand cuts! Stay strong my fellow watcher!

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l0k1 (69) · 8 years ago

Well, the hands in question are well laden with fundage. I have faith that there is competent minds at the wheel, but it might be a rough ride. You know some 6 weeks ago I was saying, I expect that a realistic bottom for the price before a reversal is about 0.25. Before you get to that there is always gonna be a shakeout. I'm not dropping my hand, I'm just having a holiday, seeing the beautiful road between me and Amsterdam, however that turns out.

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mindhunter (72) · 8 years ago

Happy watching @l0k1 - safe travels ;)

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razvanelulmarin (72) · 8 years ago

see you there!

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voteinterestpool (58) · 8 years ago

I think you are one of the people that are trying to change things for the better. It's going to be a tough journey but with your help we can make how you and others envisioned.

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tinfoilfedora (63) · 8 years ago

I agree, the general vibe and plan has changed quite a lot, and not in a good direction. Allowing the introduction scam artists, the bot wars, and censorship brigades, to become entrenched and prosperous has changed everything.

Before you go. How do you feel about Steem\Steemit getting to keep all your content?

This was not the original deal. They removed the ability to edit and delete posts in response to the hack, and now they get to keep all your content. This will be used for SEO and indexing to attract more customers, but since you cannot add your new homepage to all your articles it will not benefit you unless link back here or duplicate it. Even reddit and facebook allow users to control their content, does this bother you enough to ask about changing it?

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piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago

It was always understood that our content would be saved forever on the blockchain so I don't think that's something that should be alarming... but I don't even believe in the concept of intellectual property anyway so I'm sure plenty of people out there will disagree with me on this :P

tinfoilfedora (63) · 8 years ago (edited)

It was not. The edit and delete features were removed from Steemit.com recently and can easily be put back. Of course you can go digging through the blockchain, which is fine, but the code and logic is already in place to allow people to edit and delete what shows up on a steemit.com search or in your profile. The features were removed for security and seo reasons, and not for the good of the users.

I was asking Rok about this because he has passed the cheerleading phase and posted an honest critique.

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piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago

I see what you mean. You'd just like to be able to modify and delete old post from the interface, right? That sounds reasonable enough. Not something I'd worry about personally but I'd certainly vote in favor of adding that ability if it came up.

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tinfoilfedora (63) · 8 years ago

Yes exactly, like on every other social media service.

There is rarely a response to the user feature requests that get posted here, there have been complaints since it happened and they have been ignored.

Perhaps you could become the Pied Piper for the Social Media User's Bill of Rights? A user friendly campaign like that might get you a bunch more followers.

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piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago

I don't think I would quite go that far. Steemit Inc. is a private company, after all and at the end of the day, they can make it however they wish. I'm looking forward to seeing more competition in the marketplace because, for now, we're stuck in a monopoly and there's little incentive to provide top-not service.

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rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

to be honest, I haven't considered this issue before.

some different responses that come up:

"who would you even ask?" with no central authority, there's not even really such a location to put in such a request.

granted, I wasn't expecting to be changing my content, and anything I've published, I have with the acknowledgement it would be out there permanently. as such, I personally don't feel too attached to the matter - BUT, when you word it like that, I do agree with your stance that it might not be such a bad thing to change back.

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tinfoilfedora (63) · 8 years ago

It is yours, after all. You posted a ton of stuff, that's why I was wondering.

They just made it worse now too, you won't get any replies from any of those posts. https://steemit.com/steem/@tinfoilfedora/comments-are-now-disabled-on-old-posts-new-readers-cannot-even-reply-anymore#

In case you or anyone else wants to try to reason with them, There is a place to contact the developers, 2 actually. The Steem blockchain is developed by Dan and Ned from Bitshares\Graphene, and the Steemit.com website reads\writes to the blockchain is run by another group of developers. The projects can be found on github, and you can post feature requests and bug reports there. It's really the only place they respond to suggestions, because they are filed out in the open with the problem reports.
https://github.com/steemit/steem
https://github.com/steemit/steemit.com

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kafkanarchy84 (74) · 8 years ago

I am fairly sure I know the "scam artist" you are talking about. Where is your hard proof? Otherwise this is just more conjecture, clouding the vision that you claimed to share with the founders.

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rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

it's not my personal mission to defame anyone on this site. if you're interested in digging further into the matter, do your own due diligence - there's at least 3 people who've contributed in these comments with breadcrumb trails to follow.

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mindhunter (72) · 8 years ago

In The Matrix it was referred to as a ""cataclysmic system crash".

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thebluepanda (66) · 8 years ago

i don't believe this. if there is a scam artist or someone who is taking advantage of this community, you should provide evidence and trust me, they will take action against that account.

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piedpiper (70) · 8 years ago (edited)

In this case, the huckster in question has a cult following of sycophantic newsletter subscribers that cheer every fart he cracks... and the steemit founders believe that the exposure he provides is worth supporting him for, even if his previous ventures have ruined people to the tune of 10 million dollars.

willio (35) · 8 years ago

Just call him out no shame in doing that if you have good points.

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rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

not my purpose to put together a case. others have taken on that role (at least two other who've commented on this thread).

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darthnava (71) · 8 years ago

I agree with others sentiments here. Why don't you use your BIG Steem Power to upvote us who are less fortunate around here? Help us become dolphins so we could spread the wealth even more.

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rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

sad to say, my $0.20 votes (or perhaps even less now) really aren't going to do much at all. that's not pessimism - it's being real.

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mindhunter (72) · 8 years ago

A brave post - it also inspired me to bravery today!! Thank you. https://steemit.com/steemit/@mindhunter/a-1-5-pre-mine-of-steem-power-by-the-founders-is-acceptable-an-80-pre-mine-of-steem-power-by-the-founders-is-not-acceptable

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hanamana (60) · 8 years ago

Still trying to figure out what Steemit is all about...lol

Up voted and following. Welcome to follow me after reading my recent posts.

Up voting my contents will be appreciated.

Thanks and good day!

Be Free Always, All Ways!

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titusfrost (73) · 8 years ago

I honestly don't get this post at all. If you have a problem with someone's "conspiracy theory bs" then why not call them out directly and challenge their views? This site I thought was all about free speech, so shouldn't you be free and open to say who you are talking about? I think I know who you are referencing (TDV) if I had to guess. I also disagree with TDV's sensationalist fear mongering nonsense as well, but I am willing to post comments on his articles and challenge him. I think you should keep at it with steemit, you are clearly very valuable to the community and I think you should take down this "conspiracy theory bs" yourself if you feel that way. I am what people would call a "conspiracy theorist" also but I am always open to new ideas and new information when it comes available. Anyone who knows how much we don't know should keep their mind open and be willing to debate. That's just my opinion, hope you stay. Peace.

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rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

"free speech" doesn't mean unrestrained.

the bigger matter at root of my questioning stepping back: OPPORTUNITY COST.

yes, I could engage in challenging others' views all day... what's the point? I have no need to convince/prove others wrong. kind of reminds me of that saying, "don't argue with an idiot, because he'll beat you with experience."

or, "a wise man once said nothing."

perhaps I've bordered on foolishness by even cracking open this far. yet, sometimes one needs to play the fool for reasons not clear on the surface.

not sure I will be leaving - just needed an honest expression to the community of my stance at this point, for a number of different reasons.

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ajaub1962 (59) · 8 years ago (edited)

What can we learn about this? Have to think about these statements ;-)

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mindwheeel (39) · 8 years ago

Why so gloomy? Steemit is still only in beta and has already come a long way. I think Steemit is an amazing site already and it has a LONG way to go. Building something great takes time.

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stellabelle (75) · 8 years ago

Best post and discussion on Steemit yesterday by far. Valuable insights everywhere that prompted me to write a post today that explored new ideas

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ausbitbank (73) · 8 years ago

You right awesome content rok, it would be a shame to lose you but I understand where you're coming from..

Best of luck with whatever you end up doing, and don't make any "final" decisions yet, given how fast this place has evolved things could be different in a few months time.

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andzzz (54) · 8 years ago

So who is the scammer mentioned?

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https://dollarvigilante.com/

sift666 (65) · 8 years ago (edited)

Jeff Berwick aka The Dollar Vigilante - and in this entire thread not a single person dared to utter his name - very odd...

These two links are only one side of the story and they don't mention all the dodgy parts, but there is good reason why he has the most follower's of anyone on Steemit - his bullshit is often pretty entertaining, and sometimes true as well.

https://steemit.com/steem/@albertfall/9-things-you-need-to-know-about-jeff-berwick-aka-dollarvigilante

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rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

not my mission to call him out.

others contributing to this thread have taken that role.

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prufarchy (68) · 8 years ago

I've read your work since July and have enjoyed it. I know you didn't expect some kind of utopia here on Steemit, but it sounds like you're not facing the reality of dynamics here on the platform and choosing to pursue paths of lesser resistance. I wish you the best of luck in all your endeavors. I hope you come back like you say, to vent or say hi.

The content creators who are here still working to share and be in this community will miss you and your vote

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rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

thanks man.

don't really think it's a matter of "not facing the reality of dynamics" - rather I am, and it's just a reality that isn't alignment with who I am or what I'm about at this point in time.

not so much "choosing a path of lesser resistance" - as choosing a path that is really in alignment with my values, priorities, and goals.

I kinda threw myself hard into Steemit, in part because I didn't have anything better to invest my time into - I wasn't clear on what types of opportunities were available or that I wanted to pursue. I knew blockchain was a big key - so followed the next step. And in making those steps, the next have been revealed - and the clarity has come to narrow focus from those broader range of possibilities I knew were available in the blockchain space back down into the intersection with music, where my greater wealth of experience, knowledge, and passion lies.

either path has resistance. though it's more a matter of which will truly lead to the desired destination...

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prufarchy (68) · 8 years ago

I do remember you speaking of this intersection between music and blockchain. Know that I wish the best for you Rok :)

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ats-david (74) · 8 years ago (edited)

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