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denmarkguy (76) · 5 years ago

Interesting analysis, thank you @crokkon!

I'm still surprised at how few people overall use the tribes for posting and even tags/curation. And I'm even more surprised (this is something I check, occasionally) how many people use tribe tags in their original posts, but when you check their SteemEngine wallets it's quite evident that they have actually NEVER logged into their SteemEngine accounts... or maybe just once when it was brand new.

I think Appics is a bit of a special case (and statistical outlier) because it's a mobile app... it was created to use with your phone, so you'll have high usage because as soon as someone downloads the app, they are likely to use it for posting because... well, it works with your phone. I personally don't use it... feels like the "instagram-spam" of the Steem blockchain.

$0.04

4 votes

enforcer48 (68) · 5 years ago

The only tribe interfaces I use are STEMGeeks and SteemLeo.

Outside of the curation perk, they also automatically post to their respective hives. Since hives aren't exactly user friendly in terms of names, it is somewhat useful.

$0.03

6 votes

crokkon (68) · 5 years ago (edited)

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revisesociology (73) · 5 years ago (edited)

I use @steempeak almost exclusively now - NB they could use a vote for their worker proposal for keeping up with costs! I used to really like Partiko, now only if I'm down the pub, even then I don't really like it.

I use palnet for everything, via SPeak, and sportstalk for my running posts.

I've had a look at communities (Hive) but it seems i have to use steemit, which is just rubbish compared to steempeak so I dunno if I can be arsed.

I'm getting more into all things eco, but i don't think there's actually a community/ tribe for that on communities, if someone sets one up i might dive in, but nothing really interests me that much atm to look at the tribes.

Maybe I should I dunno. i'm not a big content consumer TBH.

!ENGAGE 10

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chekohler (70) · 5 years ago

Well apart from leo that rewards native posts I wasn't suprised that the front ends aren't being used. I think that it would be better if they were recruiting outside steemit and if they showcased their internal promotional services that can only be accessed via their front ends.

Appics I'm pretty surprised about but I think its because its an app based front end though, if they can get their IOS app on the actual app store it could really drive up those numbers

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crokkon (68) · 5 years ago (edited)

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3 votes

chekohler (70) · 5 years ago

I think that it’s too many chiefs and not enough Indians but the idea is still a promising one! Most of us in here are the hard core steemians so we know about cross front ends, esteem should support tribes and communities in their next deploy too

I think that once The RC pool and openseed come out as well as SMTs it will give tribe owners so much more freedom to do what they want and go out and recruit without any limitations! Then it could really get interesting

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lextenebris (62) · 5 years ago

In theory, the Tribes have individualized interfaces in order to allow a reader to slice the content available on the blockchain to just that topically related to the purpose of the Tribe. That would go along with content-appropriate presentation as well as an implicit form of content curation (in the classic sense).

In practice, Tribes generally are rooted in an interface which is exactly like Steemit.com because they use stock Condenser, and have absolutely nothing individualizing them in any real sense. They do manage to try and provide content which is at least somewhat related, for the most part, but that can be hit and miss. Which doesn't at all help sell the underlying idea of Tribes as communities.

And why use several tribes instead of one interface that shows all?

Here is one of the underlying problems with the overall idea in the first place. Why, indeed, would you go to a specific website in order to slice out a community rather than be able to do that slice on one central location where you consume that content?

This is a very interesting question in light of what we had on the Utopian website. As much as I may have had philosophical and personal differences with the organization, the website itself was absolutely amazing in terms of being what should have been the prototype for the Tribe experience. It provided very specific content-related interface affordances. It actually helped drive a specific kind of engagement around open source projects. When that site disappeared with all of the tools and means of presentation that it had for that content, it was a severe loss.

As it stands, as far as I've seen, none of the Tribes provide as much support for the content they intend to specialize in as Utopian did without even mechanical support for an alternate pseudo-token.

APPICS has an essential advantage in being an interface provided by a single mobile application and specifically seeking an audience which isn't really overlapping with the court or traditional Steem blockchain community. The Steem blockchain is not anywhere near the core of their promotion, and as a result a good chunk of their recruitment not only occurs outside of Steemit but outside of the philosophical and cultural bounds of what has traditionally been a Steem blockchain user.

For good or ill.

Ultimately, my suspicion is that, for the most part, Tribe-specific websites will go the way of the dodo when SteemPeak integrates Hivemind Communities into the mainstream interface such that they become very easy to flip through and engage with. Very few standalone websites will be worthwhile because they just don't provide a sufficiently differentiated experience. APPICS probably will because of the inherent law can provided by mobile applications.

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crokkon (68) · 5 years ago (edited)

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3 votes

lextenebris (62) · 5 years ago

True. As long as users can use any tag as they want, the tribe curators will always run behind trying to filter out those posts which don't fit the topic.

That's always been an issue with online communities. Keeping the interactions on topic requires either a very focused and dedicated group of people who are involved in the community or an extremely energetic and attentive moderation team. And even allowing for both, topics wonder, communities engage in personal asides, and all the rest of the fun happens. It is, not put too fine a point on it, "quite hard."

My suspicion is that a number of Communities will be very interested in building a front end which allows them to keep new posts in a corral, not committed to the blockchain, until they can actually be okayed by a moderator. That wouldn't be a new mechanism; pretty much everything in this field has been done at one time or another. And we will see some reimplementations of things which have gone before, like trusted users who can post without going to the corral first, groups which by default have new users not go to the corral until they make a misstep, all the rest of the ways that mailing groups, newsgroups, and forums have found to deal with potential abuse or just misuse.

It might just be a side effect of the places I've been exposed, but I haven't seen a lot of Communities or Tribes talking about these kinds of mechanics or problems out in the open. Maybe those discussions are happening behind closed doors and I would certainly encourage them to happen, but I haven't seen them happening and that makes me a little worried.

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anthonyadavisii (70) · 5 years ago

You did a great job here as usual, @crokkon. My VP is kind of getting on the low end with some programmatic voting I am tested but I couldn't tolerate myself to not vote this 100% when I saw.

I have my apprehensions about APPICS and seeing this data is all the more incentive for me to look into the app activity.

It's probably nothing but worth looking into at least. Thanks for this very useful post.

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3 votes

crokkon (68) · 5 years ago (edited)

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sifondeseltz (46) · 5 years ago

So interesting data, thanx!
!COFFEEA

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nathen007 (68) · 5 years ago

I have an alt account @leedsunited which only posts sports content and actifit and ONLY posts within the tribe except for a few 'visitor' post I made in some of the other tribes to try and encourage more users .

Generally though , I think you're right about people not posting in the tribes , many are just token collecting ...and I include myself in that!

Love the stats posts!

Posted using Partiko Android

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crokkon (68) · 5 years ago (edited)

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dalz (68) · 5 years ago (edited)

Nice job @crokkon!

Only 30% share for Steemit! That is a bit surprising for me.

On the apps side, appics is doing so great couse it is sort of purpose made .... If you want to post on appics, you use their app .... similar as actifit ... quarter of the post from tribes sides, this is a nice share.

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crokkon (68) · 5 years ago (edited)

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bashadow (65) · 5 years ago

I have used the creativecoin tribe page to post from, but then they created a community also so I have posted from there also. Most of my post though are done in steemit unless I use the creativecoin tag, then it's currently a toss up, mostly using the Community page to post those from. I don't go to the page to look at the post from the tag often, but it is something I need to start doing.

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crokkon (68) · 5 years ago (edited)

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gniksivart (67) · 5 years ago

SteemLeo and Steempeak are what i spend most of my time in. I really only use SteemLeo to make some Leo posts and occasionally comment on SteemLeo and it's usually after I spend most of the time on SteemPeak and I'm just looking for some new content to comment/curate.

I think most general communities will struggle to get people using their interface as, why would I post on palnet, unless I have a reason to do so? Not saying that as a negative thing, just saying that if it's going to be almost the same UI as steem why wouldn't I post on Steemit or Steempeak and just use the palnet tribe.

While appics has a completely different customized UI that caters to the niche of users that post on it.

Thanks for all the research and time it probably took to put together this post as it's a very interesting read!

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crokkon (68) · 5 years ago (edited)

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steem.leo (68) · 5 years ago

Awesome analysis. I like seeing the numbers from this macro perspective for the whole chain. We put out a weekly stats post on @leo.stats and one of our main growth metrics and KPIs is to look at the number of unique daily authors posting from our interface. We use the same ad network as Steemit (Coinzilla). We've noticed a very clear (and sharp) increase in ad revenue over time as the number of posts from our interface grows.

latest stats post

Posted via Steemleo | A Decentralized Community for Investors

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c-squared (60) · 5 years ago

This post was shared in the Curation Collective Discord community for curators, and upvoted and resteemed by the @c-squared community account after manual review.
@c-squared runs a community witness. Please consider using one of your witness votes on us here

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abh12345 (76) · 5 years ago

#appics @appics will be pretty happy about this!

I wonder if Communities will pull some of the share back to steemit.com, at least until the likes of steempeak incorporate them?

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crokkon (68) · 5 years ago (edited)

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5 votes

abh12345 (76) · 5 years ago

It shouldn't be long until the beta interface is switched to live, and the feedback I read is positive. This coupled with SMT should help steemit.com in the short term at least. I wonder how the adverts are doing....

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crokkon (68) · 5 years ago (edited)

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abh12345 (76) · 5 years ago

Yes but they are surely coming 'soon'... :)

RE; Rs, my pleasure - this work takes time and should be appreciated more!

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abh12345 (76) · 5 years ago

!ENGAGE 50

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misterengagement (55) · 5 years ago

@crokkon you have received 50 ENGAGE from @abh12345!
View and trade the tokens on Steem Engine.

^{This tip bot is powered by witness untersatz!}

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anthonyadavisii (70) · 5 years ago

Happy about what precisely?

If you mean that they have the most TL posts, not really surprised considering the nature of their content.

It's shortform, many don't have any text, easy to repost / recycle from other sites so no wonder they would be able to smash that metric. (Assuming that is what you are referring)

I am still wary of them after confronting one of their leader / promoters engaging in comment spam w/out apology which makes me question the ethics of the team.

Chief concern is the app could potentially be used as a vote farming front. As you know, our community has been deceived more times than I'd care to admit.

I hope you have a better idea and can assuage my fears. In any case, very glad Crokkon pulled the data as it gives us something to perhaps have situational awareness about.

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8 votes

abh12345 (76) · 5 years ago (edited)

For them, numbers are everything. It's very likely going to be a major headache as far as abuse, but perhaps in the future STEEM rewards will be few and far between and they'll be in control of what content the appics token goes to.

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anthonyadavisii (70) · 5 years ago (edited)

Spent some time reviewing the posts on their tag and seems genuine; albeit, some single image posts appear fairly overvalued due to Rancho / Haejin votes. I did a few reverse image searches w no hits so looks good so far for image plag. / recycling.

Nothing appears to be overt but there was this sponge-bob account had a couple single image posts that had suspect voting but for the most part, it looks clean.

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abh12345 (76) · 5 years ago

!ENGAGE 25

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misterengagement (55) · 5 years ago

@anthonyadavisii you have received 25 ENGAGE from @abh12345!
View and trade the tokens on Steem Engine.

^{This tip bot is powered by witness untersatz!}

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