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omfedor (63) · 8 years ago

That guy was really funny, @rok-sivante! :) Thanks for sharing!

I personally follow a vegetarian diet for several years. And I also confess that a few years ago I was like this guy. Of course I was not as aggressive on the outer level, but inside, perhaps it was so. But at some point I realized that food is not the main thing.

If a person belives that he can become happy only through vegetarianism or organic food, he will be afraid of those who adhere to another diets. Because they threaten his happiness, as it seems to him. It is a fairly simple law of psychology. People are always afraid of losing the source of their happiness, so they always protect it. And if a man believes that the secret of his happiness is in organic food, he will be afraid of those who are against this diet. And this fear will push him to attack on them. This is the mechanism of any fanaticism. At least I see it that way.

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10 votes

bendjmiller222 (64) · 8 years ago

Thanks for turning me on to a brilliant brilliant, hilarious YouTube channel.
"Give me organic, or give me death" and the kick at the end truly made me chuckle out loud. As much as a satire it was, it does bring to light how people don't wish you to push your beliefs on them, even though you may believe you are enlightening/saving them. The simple decency of asking if someone is interested before spouting your beliefs is lost on many health/religious gurus. If someone is generally interested, by all means share with them, but you represent what your belief is and if you rub people the wrong way, they will believe all people within that same group believe that.

An extreme example would be the way the "Westboro Baptist Church" which spews hate toward soldiers and those in the LGBTQ community. Many see they call themselves Christians and associate all Christians harboring some sort of hate towards them. Just like your reputation here on steemit is valuable, your actions towards others and beliefs in everyday life can make someone respect or despise an entire group of people. And as much as I dislike what the "Westboro Baptist Church" does, I am happy that people here in America do have the right to express their beliefs without fear. I'd like to see more people coming together and working together regardless of personal beliefs (I'm talking to you Democrats and Republicans). If as much effort was put into solving important issues as it was toward blocking an opposing parties candidate from gaining office or changing legislations, our country would be in a much greater position. Not really looking to debate politics in this comment section, but I like that Rok is able to share content that while funny, can reflect our own stupidity when we feel we are elite and must bestow all of our knowledge to everyone, whether they wish to lend an ear or we have to shout it at them on a podium.

And I absolutely love the "polar bear of realization/regret." I was almost disappointed because I thought you had completely removed it when you switched the cover photo.

It would be nice to see if some scientists could weigh in on some GMO's and the effect they really have and what may be causing the rise in autism and some other things to occur that don't seem to have been around as prevalently as before.

$1.18

steemrollin (69) · 8 years ago

The video is way exaggerated, but funny. Yes I think the worry can produce more stress than it's worth so it's better to let most of it go. It's tough when you're trying to eat organically and healthy and you go to a friend's or acquaintance's and they offer unhealthy foods. Before I would decline or not eat much, but these days I won't make a big deal of it or try not to cause a scene. I do prefer just eating at home. I try to eat as much organic as possible based on my budget. It's expensive. It seems to taste a whole lot better. Could be psychological, but I notice a difference often. My bet despite some studies that suggest otherwise is that there is a difference. Most of science can't isolate all the thousands of chemicals and various differences in foods anyways. I avoid GMO in general, but haven't delved into the details. I think there is a place for technology and meal replacements, but big agribusiness & Monsanto are using unsustainable practices ... it's really not good for the soil and land to use all these chemicals so I doubt you get the proper minerals and nutrients that you should get. I heard the great dust bowls during the Great Depression was mostly caused by bad agricultural practices and soil management. I think the same thing is happening right now so I'm happy to see the organic and micro-agriculture practices grow. There's so much more variety and tastes with heirloom and organic varieties of food that usually can't be mass-produced and shipped far without going bad. I hope to see more of that. Anyways I digress. I agree with you about all the elitism. These days I just let most of that go.

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logic (67) · 8 years ago

Hahahaha great post! I was myself in all that new-agish, crystal healing, reiki, horoscope, woo energy, "look at me I am so enlightened and sooooo spiritual", mumbo jumbo, bullshit! :D

Then I have learnt how to apply scientific method to my own thought process and the bullshit just ceased to exist within months :-)
It is just impossible to reconcile with logical reasoning :-)

AwakenWithJP is a cool channel. I like many of his videos.

I would also recommend these videos:

And these:

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12 votes

limitless (63) · 8 years ago (edited)

I'm about to lead you down a rabbit hole. The scientific method isn't the end all be all. There are philosophical statistics arguments against GMOs, so the New Agers are right for the wrong reasons. http://www.fooledbyrandomness.com/pp2.pdf

Many scientists are specialized in their own fields, but they have poor understandings of statistics and epistemiology, so they often reach the wrong conclusions. Take a look at this http://bayes.wustl.edu/etj/articles/prob.as.logic.pdf
and also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientism

Also, read this: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/who-will-debunk-the-debunkers/
Sometimes, there's a need for us ultra-skeptics to debunk the debunkers.

$1.16

3 votes

logic (67) · 8 years ago

Unfortunately, there is still a lot of categorical thinking between many "scientists".
Many scientists are not true scientists, because they are not able to apply scientific method to their own thought process. I call them semi-scientists. An example would be a scientist who believes in god and follows religious traditions.
True scientists would also refrain thesmelves from categorical thinking by trying to, generally educate themselvesin many different branches of science (also statistics) , despite their specialization. This would give them more multidisciplinary system approach to the problem they try to solve.

Thank you for the links :-)

$1.31

3 votes

limitless (63) · 8 years ago

Agreed. Although there needs to be a distinction made between serious belief in a personified God and following traditions for perceived personal marginal benefits.
See this: https://www.facebook.com/nntaleb/posts/10152548740888375

I think many people go to churches for the social connections. Also, think about it this way. Imagine that Star Wars fan clubs receive religious funding from the government and the meetings happen every Sunday morning. You have a pastor who analyzes virtues that you can learn from Yoda's words and the life lessons that you can learn from scenes from the movies. Then you meditate on how you can act more like Yoda to live a more fruitful life. To end the meeting, you sing the theme song from the movies. I think that could be a great time and adds marginal value to my life. I think both religious fundamentalists and gnostic atheists are foolish for taking things too seriously. Just chill and have a great time! :D

Bonus if you attend the meetings while on cannabis, MDMA, shrooms, or LSD. There is some evidence that this may in fact be the real origin of Christianity

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rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

lol. your content never fails to entertain, inform, inspire, and boggle my mind, @limitless :-)

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logic (67) · 8 years ago

Well that wouldn't be very sustainable socially, unless these Star Wars fans did not believe in these as factual :-)
Once you start believing in something like this, then it becomes a problem :-)

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limitless (63) · 8 years ago

LOL of course. (replying here to comment below because we have too many nested replies)

I see a problem that I would describe as "daddy issues" among the extreme atheists that the same problem with extreme evangelical vegans. For well adjusted people, we know that God isn't literally real and there exists problems with eating meat, but the people who have been brainwashed one way will overcalibrate their rebelliousness and swing way too far the other way to a different type of crazy.

Also, I think myths are extremely powerful regardless of if people literally believe them to be real. Stories that invoke deep emotional responses are far more memorable than simply memorizing a bland list of facts and virtues.

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logic (67) · 8 years ago

Yes, you are right. People tend to drift from one bullshit to another. From one extreme to another. From frying pan into the fire. In desperate attempt to cling to some sort of identity to give them the illusion of psychological consolation. Particularly, when their previous experiences (usually from childhood) conditioned them to be unable for their ego to survive without such identification.
Atheists, vegans, Christians, Fascists, "Anarchists", and so on. It is all attachment to an illusion of identity. Believing that identity is something real, which they cannot live without.
We can have any identity we like. We define it oursleves. No one can impose it on us, so why desperately get attached to it and look for it, and when they really need some identiy why identifying to identity which is realy dumb, like religious or political.
Self integrity and character does no require self generated belief of who we think we should be and defined by (identity). There is only one true identity, which all humans share. The one defined by nature.
It's called humanity. This is our only true nationality, and our planet is our only true nation.

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limitless (63) · 8 years ago

In reply to your last comment:

100% agreed, awesome conclusions.

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terryrall (51) · 8 years ago

It already takes a shit load of study just to be specialized...I'm not saying multidisciplinary systems don't work... it just takes a literal ton of homework to be proficient in more than one subject! I am supposedly trained in broadcast telecommunications with a BA & computer technology with an AAB...but believe me, I am NO expert because progress moves faster than one can keep up with!

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limitless (63) · 8 years ago (edited)

Hey Rok,

You might want to skim through my post that covers the dangers of GMO from a statistical perspective: https://steemit.com/antifragile/@limitless/preventing-human-extinction-disasters-antifragility-and-externalities-in-politics

Essentially, whatever GMO products in your fridge now probably won't have any negative effects on you, but if something goes wrong with GMOs, there is a tiny chance that it could kill millions of people. So while GMOs are "safe" on an individual level for now, they can eventually lead to worldwide catastrophes when a black swan event occurs. This is the precautionary principle applied to disproportionally high risk at the tail end for large populations. Published paper on this topic: http://www.fooledbyrandomness.com/pp2.pdf

People can be right for the wrong reasons. Life is an experiment and most great discoveries happened accidentally and most inventions were made through trial and error, not applying textbook theories.

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mrgrey (57) · 8 years ago

Awesome post again rok ...personally I try remain out of such politics as long as Im left alone I let them squabble.

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rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

Ha ha, wise move!

Hence, taking no firm stance on either side of the fence - leaving the debate to be left to science - for each person to do their own research and make up their own mind...

Meanwhile, laughing our asses off at a great satire on the extremists... :-)

$1.31

3 votes

mrgrey (57) · 8 years ago

whaha yes exactly like that perhaps sipping on a bear and laughing our asses of as we could be there for quite some some.

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bittrez (46) · 8 years ago

politics as long as Im left alone I let them squabble.
upvote @bittrez

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rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

That's some wisdom right there. ;-)

$1.31

bittrez (46) · 8 years ago

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blow (1) · 8 years ago

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will-zewe (61) · 8 years ago

Yeah I love this guy, absolute genius. Excellent post as always got laughing right off the bat in the morning here.

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fishborne (57) · 8 years ago

I'm not a vegetarian. I also heat the pseudoscience crap. A lot, actually. I have my fights with these people but I'm not a science evangelist also. Science doesn't need evaghelists.
So, my point is: if you give me arguments, studies, numbers, relevsnt people opinions (like scientists ones) I'll change my views.
What am I telling you this ?
I read China Study. It's made over many years over 1 million people. It's against meat overdose (like our current gastronomy). There must be something worth analizyng.
Even so I'm still a meat eater.

Cheers.

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limitless (63) · 8 years ago

Rok,

In reply to your comment. If you like my content, wait until @agm1984 starts posting. He boggles my mind.

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rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago (edited)

I'm looking forward to it :-)

And you'll DEFINITELY want to follow @core

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limitless (63) · 8 years ago

thanks, followed.

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fingolfin (61) · 8 years ago

I'll second the "If meat eaters acted like Vegans" as my personal favorite of his videos. The wife and I went through and watched a bunch more after seeing that one.

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logic (67) · 8 years ago

Actually that is probalby one of few videos I did not like by this guy :-)
It is completely based on false assumptions and accusations about vegans perpetuating the interent.
Seems like he basically copied and impersonated all unsubstantiated and nasty jokes about vegans...
Nothing based in actual facts...
There are some vegans who may be retarded like these but this is minority (like Gary Yourofsky behaviour - although he makes valid points in his videos). From dozens of vegans I have met, non of them have behaved that way.

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rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

Personally, I found the ayahuasca one pushing it too far...

He may definitely not have been showing respect for the medicine & heritage as it deserves. But in the end, I think the point might be not to take it all so seriously.

That one still irks me a bit - but given that many people have abused & defamed the medicine, its not so much JP did it himself as much as made a mockery of those doing it. A very fine line.

There's probably something in every one of his videos that's gonna push somebody's buttons. But then, can we laugh at ourselves for being so uptight at something that's well-intended to be funny and call out the extremists...?

$1.25

logic (67) · 8 years ago (edited)

I wrote a reply about Ayahuasca yesterday but it aappers that user 'turtle' flagged my reply for no reason, so it dissapeared.
I will write it here again.
Yes I agree that Ayahuasca video was a bit too far also. I have personally tried Ayahuasca (also San Pedro and Peyote). This was for personal experience related to mindfulness training and exploration of altered states of consciousness. Mindfulness (or meditation) does not need to be related to woo energies and "spiritual" bullshit :-)
I apply it as a tool for changing my process of thinking and also use it as a way for relaxation. I find it to be a good mind training, as long as we don't imagine in our heads some balls of light or associate it with some woo ghosts or whatever cosmic energies lol

Some interesting about using Ayahuasca in treatment of drug addicts by G. Mate.

Other very interesting presentations/lectures by G. Mate:

"Brain Development & Addiction with Gabor Mate"

Gabor Mate Lecture - "Hold On To Your Kids"

"Dr. Gabor Maté: Consequences of Stressed Parenting"

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rok-sivante (75) · 8 years ago

Nice. Gabor Mate is dope.

If you're into that stuff, you may also want to check out MAPS if you haven't yet...

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logic (67) · 8 years ago

I haven't heard about MAPS. I'm gonna check their YT channel today. Thank you! :-)

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logic (67) · 8 years ago (edited)

Yes Ayahuasca is too far. I have personally tried Ayahuasca (Also San Pedro and Peyote). This was for personal experience related to mindfulness training and exploration of changed states of consciousness.. Mindfulness (or meditation) does not need to be related to woo energies and "spiritual" bullshit :-) It is about changing the process of thinking and way of relaxation. It is good mind training as long as we don't imagine and associate it with some woo ball of lights, ghosts and energies in our heads lol

This is a great video by G. Mate about Ayahuasca.

Also he has other lectures about human behavioral biology and addictions:

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limitless (63) · 8 years ago

I've done plenty of Ayahuasca, and I don't think he went overboard. If you avoid the foods that can mess with the MAOI interactions, you should be fine. As long as you're in a safe room with friends who aren't idiots, you're good to go. You don't need to participate in any superstitious rituals or get a shaman.

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fingolfin (61) · 8 years ago

Well I can't say I know many vegans personally (by many I mean none) so I enjoyed it for the humor, not so much the factual basis. Now my second favorite was the essential oils video, knowing more than my share of those people I can say he was spot on with most of the comparisons.

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terryrall (51) · 8 years ago

I also used to be a Conspiracy Theorist, backing baseless premises with ton of bullshit...then I found out that I was Psychotic & engaging in delusional thinking...if it doesn't have legs, it cannot run...But something is killing off the bee population...if it isn't GMO's then we have to do yet more research & find out what really is causing the problem...I have more fear of salmonella & e. coli than GMO's...as they actually do make you sick...but I find most food to be safe...unless some vegetable picker took a shit on your lettuce because some greed out farmer refused to provide a chemical toilet...this was indeed a good post!

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limitless (63) · 8 years ago

I recommend reading Thinking Fast and Slow. Best book ever on getting rid of delusional thinking. There's a nuanced view where you can entertain ideas that you are conscious of to be delusional for the sake of devil's advocate critique or humor, without believing them when making rational decisions that affect your life directly in real life. This is the zoom in, zoom out, zoom in approach to exercising creativity. There are situations where system 1 thinking is more important system 2 thinking and vice versa.

$0.51

10 votes

turtler (40) · 8 years ago

hmm interesting, I haven't encountered many of those extremist types personally, but most people I know (normal, average people) generally prefer organic produce and turn their noses up at GMO.

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