retweeted Gummi Bear's Vaccine Passport thread

This is a Great thread. read the original here from @ gummibear737 on Twitter
https://twitter.com/gummibear737/status/1378084272783949831

Vaccine Passport - Deep Dive 🚨

There’s a lot of talk about the morality of C-19 vaccine passports
I want to focus on the issue of whether they make sense from a public health perspective
Not only don’t they make sense, they’re actually counterproductive
Here’s why

Thread
1

First, let’s establish some facts

C-19 is here to stay...we’ll never eradicate it
Everybody will eventually be infected
Viral respiratory infections are usually asymptomatic
Vaccines protect against disease, not infection
Common CVs still kill the elderly
2

Most people don’t realize that the deadly 1918 Spanish Flu (H1N1) and its variants are is still with us today
No effective H1N1 vaccine have ever been developed so why doesn’t it kill loads of people?
While it still kills some people, we’ve collectively become immune to it
3

This has happened with every single pandemic
Because it is new, it kills off the susceptible in 2-3 waves and then fades into the background of the hundreds of respiratory viruses that commonly circulate
These viruses still sometimes kill but it is elderly/sick people
4

So the question health experts should be asking is how do we get to the point where C19 becomes a common respiratory virus?
Before I answer this I want to explain what the vaccine does
It greatly decreases the chances that an infection will proceed to symptomatic disease
5

And it almost eliminates chance that exposure will lead to severe disease or death
On the other hand, immunity to coronaviruses tends to decrease in time
Also, being vaccinated does not offer more efficient immunity than being infected with the actual SARS-CoV-2 virus
6

So ideally you want to ensure that you have some pre-existing immunity to C19 and then let it circulate freely
Why? Reinfection serves as a booster shot
Vaccines ensure that high risk individuals have sufficient pre-existing immunity that they won’t die if exposed
7

But the clock is ticking
Immunity starts decreasing as time passes
If the idea is to achieve a level of balance with the virus then having it circulate is how you ensure that immunity doesn’t decrease below a threshold where the virus is deadly
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If I have just completed my vaccine schedule for C19, I want to go out into a world where C19 circulates!
Why? Re-exposure, will allow my immune system to see the entire virus and all its epitopes, and will keep me up to date with new variants
9

Paradoxically, vaccinated people should not want restrictions
They should want life back to normal because re-exposure is actually beneficial
But the longer it takes to be re-exposed, the weaker your immune response
10

For a vaccinated person, freely circulating C19 is not a bad thing
Now, if you choose not to get the vaccine then you believe your pre-existing immunity is a better bet than the risks of the vaccine
I got vaccinated because I think the vax gives you better odds
11

People who don’t get vaccinated know full well that they will eventually have to deal with an infection by SARS-CoV-2
It is not vaccinated people who are at risk from non-vaccinated people, but rather the other way around
If we segregate for 2 years then it will flip!
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The unvaccinated will probably have already been exposed while the segregated vaccinated people’s immunity has waned and are now more susceptible because of a lack of circulating virus in their ranks
I hope this is not too confusing
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The ideal solution is to get to a point where everybody who wants a vaccine has gotten one
Then reopen completely and let the virus circulate normally
That’s how C19 becomes just another respiratory virus
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This will lead to deaths in unvaccinated people, but this is their choice to make
And they have enough information to make decisions based on their level of risk
You can’t force vax because it doesn’t endanger vaccinated people!
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Now I’m going to explain why you can’t force people to take a vaccine for a respiratory virus
Respiratory viruses do not go away
Our common defense against respiratory viruses is to let them circulate freely so that our immune systems are constantly adapting to new variants
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You can’t compare respiratory viruses to other diseases where mass vaccination (polio) or segregation (leprosy) actually makes sense

I see a lot of intelligent people making dumb statements on this subject
Its a respiratory virus FFS!
It’s not aerosolsized ebola!
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There is a natural balace between humans and respiratory viruses
The pandemic stage sucks, as susceptible people people die
But then the virus starts to circulate freely and our immune systems do the rest
Yes, a vaccine helps but not in terms of eradicating the resp virus
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If we ever want to get back to normal, then once everbody who wants it has been vaccinated, we need to return to normal
Current policy on passports makes no sense
Segregating vax’d people from non-vax’d is detrimental to vax’d people’s immune health against C19/variants
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jlariviere (25) · 4 years ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuremberg_Code#The_ten_points_of_the_Nuremberg_Code

The voluntary consent of the human subject is absolutely essential.
The experiment should be such as to yield fruitful results for the good of society, unprocurable by other methods or means of study, and not random and unnecessary in nature.
The experiment should be so designed and based on the results of animal experimentation and a knowledge of the natural history of the disease or other problem under study that the anticipated results will justify the performance of the experiment.
The experiment should be so conducted as to avoid all unnecessary physical and mental suffering and injury.
No experiment should be conducted where there is an a priori reason to believe that death or disabling injury will occur; except, perhaps, in those experiments where the experimental physicians also serve as subjects.
The degree of risk to be taken should never exceed that determined by the humanitarian importance of the problem to be solved by the experiment.
Proper preparations should be made and adequate facilities provided to protect the experimental subject against even remote possibilities of injury, disability, or death.
The experiment should be conducted only by scientifically qualified persons. The highest degree of skill and care should be required through all stages of the experiment of those who conduct or engage in the experiment.
During the course of the experiment the human subject should be at liberty to bring the experiment to an end if he has reached the physical or mental state where continuation of the experiment seems to him to be impossible.
During the course of the experiment the scientist in charge must be prepared to terminate the experiment at any stage, if he has probable cause to believe, in the exercise of the good faith, superior skill and careful judgment required of him that a continuation of the experiment is likely to result in injury, disability, or death to the experimental subject.

$0.00

jlariviere (25) · 4 years ago (edited)

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejm199711133372006

This means that the person involved should have legal capacity to give consent; should be so situated as to be able to exercise free power of choice, without the intervention of any element of force, fraud, deceit, duress, overreaching, or other ulterior form of constraint or coercion; and should have sufficient knowledge and comprehension of the elements of the subject matter involved...