I've been seeing clashes between Trump Protestors for a month or more now. It was inevitable it would happen. The anti-Trump people in their bandanas were being destructive and mostly going unchallenged. It wasn't that the Trump supporters were afraid of them. It was that for the most part they were not present, and were trying to have some restraint.
Before I continue with my observations. I am neither a Trump or a Hillary supporter. I will be honest and say I prefer Trump over Hillary but I promised to never do the Lesser of Two Evils false dichotomy again. I kept my word.
It was obvious that the clashes were going to occur as the Trump Supporters were speaking up and finally tired of these black bandana clad Antifa thugs assaulting people, destroying things, and being anti-free speech.
I don't normally write posts like this, but today a friend and fellow steemit user @kidsysco shared the following video in a slack he and I have been part of since before steemit.
Skip to 1:25 in this video
It should be noted that I wasn't seeing too much mainstream media coverage over the last month of this topic. Most of it was from youtubers and places like Infowars.
This video showed some interesting things to me. Things that the news may not clue into, but if you've watched enough of these protests you get an idea.
Law Enforcement had created a divide between Pro-Trump and Anti-Trump protestors. This video then shows an M80 or something being set off at about the 2:00 minute mark and a black hoodie (hoodie down) person walking away. Minus the bandana this is not how a typical Pro-Trump supporter dresses, though it is how the Antifa dresses. That does not mean it is such a person. This is me sharing my observations.
2:06 shows an Antifa type spraying a camo decked out person and that looks legit. The spray is likely pepper spray or something similar.
2:20 is where things got particularly interesting to me. The video is talking about how police confiscated weapons, formed a line, and that worked for about an hour until people jumped the line.
Watch that video. Notice how both sides have bandanas though not all have them lifted? I honestly don't know that I've ever seen Trump supporters wearing bandanas and trying to conceal who they are and I've watched a number of these conflicts.
If that is enough watch how those two bandana groups go at it and how a lot of the punches and other things seem PULLED. It looks pretty staged in that particular case. To me this looks like a Provocateur type event where it was staged to cause escalation.
I have zero doubt it would have gotten more violent, but this particular clash looks staged at this point as though it was engineered to cause an eruption of conflict. It was also one of the few times I've seen Mainstream media conveniently positioned at the right place. Perhaps there was some yelling back and forth between these factions (real or actors... difficult to know) that managed to clue the news in. Perhaps the news was told they needed to check out this one really heated group. It is hard to know and all speculation.
All I know is that after watching a number of these that part of the video looked FAKED and STAGED to me. It actually looks like Antifa on Antifa.
I am not saying I am right here. It is pretty sad and stupid regardless.
I am sharing this as I'd like to see if you think I'm onto something here or not. I'll go look up some older example videos to compare and contrast between.
Also notice the wounded Trump supporters the news does tend to focus on. None of them have bandanas, and U.S. flag colors are a pretty common type of clothing, but not always the case. I also haven't heard of Trump supporters using pepper spray. That doesn't mean they are not. Again this is just me sharing observations and speculating.
1 Month ago
I don't see any Trump supporters with bandanas there. Quite a few Biker type Trump supporters though.
this one is sensationalized and not a very good example - shows you a biased approach from the other direction
Here is CNN's same coverage of the same Berkeley fights in the first video in this post
And yes, it did get pretty violent and REAL - but did it start this way?
That's enough... It seems pretty dicey to me. Yes, it is a powder keg. Am I wrong in thinking it looks like the match may have been lit intentionally?
A lot of the Antifa follow the works of revolutionaries that really only see violence as a solution. It is via inciting violence that they can bring more onto their side. Staged events are legit, and any technique that can achieve their goals is acceptable. I've known there are some in the movement that believe this. This does bias my views on a lot of what I am seeing here.
Confession
I am not a Pro-Trump or Anti-Trump person. I do find myself very opposed to the Antifa movement. I believe these people have a serious lack of understanding about history and truly they are an ignorant mass manipulated weapon aimed with a purpose. The things they claim to support are the opposite of their actions and the things they state.
They claim to be anti-fascist. Some will claim to be anti-nazi.
Yet they dress in almost a uniform, and they are sponsored by people like George Soros. They are attempting to force their will upon everyone by force, and shouting with no debate or listening. In reality, they claim to be anti-fascist, yet their actions are those of fascists.
They obviously didn't study the history of World War II era very closely and what lead up to it. They may have a familiarity with the actual war as there are a lot of movies and shows on that. Yet, they clearly know almost nothing about the rise of Fascisim, National Socialism (aka Nazi), etc.
They may be wearing black... That's a color. The Nazis chose to inflame the youth and dress them in brown.
They called such people brown shirts...
They chant over and over again "No KKK, no Fascists USA" Ignoring anyone that tries to discuss with them. In fact when one of them does start to talk you'll usually see some "controller" show up and shake their head and say don't talk to them.
KKK is an organization founded upon intolerance. Yes, it is a specific racial intolerance, but it is still intolerance.
Now let me share some definitions from different sources. Do you notice how they differ?
Now you can read up on it in Wikipedia and it is worth following some of its links.
I have a personal thing I like to say "You cannot defeat racism, by being racist, you cannot defeat bigotry, by being a bigot".
I want to rephrase this for Antifa "You cannot defeat fascism by being fascists".
Fighting against free speech, being intolerant, unable to engage in dialog, and only able to answer challenges with chants and violence is not anti-fascist. It is embracing the concept hook, line, and sinker.
EDIT: I've used "Hook, Line, and sinker" before and not everyone may have heard or understood the idiom. Essentially it is referring to fishing. You have a hook at the end of the line that you typically want your fish to bite. The line extends out from there and often will have some weights attached to it to help it sink and be below the surface. These are called sinkers. So "hook, line, and sinker" is indicating that the target fish was so excited not only did it bite the hook. It also swallowed the line and the sinker that were beyond the hook.
Steem On!
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
I did not think of it being staged, although I do see your point. I thought it seemed pretty clear that some folks were only there to fight. Dressing up like that and getting so rowdy just seems very planned. Not many folks just get lost in the moment, and then somehow find a bandana to put on.
Good info here, I had to lookup antifa. So I was glad to see you explain the term later on. Interesting input on facism too.
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
Antifa has been at the heart of virtually all the violent exchanges. The Berkeley one with the riots that turned destructive and burned things down a couple of months ago to stop Milo Yonapolis from speaking at Berkeley. There were protestors but they were not violent. Antifa showed up packing a generator and they are the ones that perpetrated all of the destruction.
The majority of the violence and extreme protests from the Anti-Trump side rest squarely with that group.
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
The Berkeley one is it the one where it is said the violence started with the known Neonazi that was the "bodyguard" of Yonapolis?
So you have a someone who's mind is firmly rooted in the stone age coming to Berkeley of all Universities to vomit his hate against things Berkeley was often a core point, together with such a man.
Whatever happened I would call this provocation. Like running with an Antifa flag carried by a black into a KKK meeting.
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
This is false...
I watched a local news... had nothing to do with Infowars.
The protest was large but peaceful... until a number of black clad with black bandana people showed up and brought their own portable generator. They initiated the violence and if you watch videos from any source it is difficult to find cases where the person doing the violence was not one of these people. They were not the majority of the people there, but the majority of people parted as they pushed their way to the front and then started destroying things.
I did refer to this as Provocateurs in my POST you responded to.
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
Again I didn't even mention infowars here.
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
Deflection?
You did on the other reply I answered right before this one which you clearly told me I needed to look at other sources besides Infowars.
This is another reply to the same post so I assume your thoughts in that other apply still here.
You STILL are zeroing in on Infowars. So obviously you did not read and comprehend my other response.
EDIT: As the INFOWARS comment here was just to make sure you didn't waste time talking about infowars like you did on the other one. I obviously failed in that goal.
Edit 2: and there is no "Again". You haven't said anything about not mentioning Infowars until now, as you did mention it and spent some time telling me where I should get my news and how in the other reply.
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
Yes, I mentioned infowars ONCE in the first reply, an din the others only to say that I didn't talked about you getting this video from infowars or that I didn't mention infowars - except when saying that I didn't talk about infowars. As here again.
In short. The only time I sayed infowars from my side was ONCE. Everything else a reaction on you saying I said infowars too much.
So infowars infowars infowars.
Can we stop it now? It was never my intention to talk about infowars after all.
How about we talk about the weather? I had morning frost, burning sun, snow and... sleet? several times each in a timeframe of 6 hours today. I think thats quite remarkable
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
Well we can meet in a middle ground.
You clearly know I know Infowars is biased... as is pretty much every other "news" source these days. So the best way to get a clear picture is to research from as many perspectives as you can find. I've actually written posts about this before, but you may have missed them.
You just wanted to make sure I knew it was biased. It surprised me after our interactions in the past that you'd even need to ask. :)
So we agree on that.
EDIT: Unlike most of my posts I did put [Opinion/Observation] in the title. So I was clearly stating it was an opinion and thus for someone like you and I that means it may not be FACT but is how I CURRENTLY see things.
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
meep
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
I upvoted. I'll read it later.
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
A lot of things are staged, police likes to do it, interestingly (here) almost exclusively against against the left. Can't say about the US.
But Dwinblood, I think you got some things wrong here.
First: Yes, parts of he Antifa are very violent. Their reasoning is that if the people have fought (as in violent) against Hitler instead of "it's not me so I won't risk anything", then he would not have killed millions of people.
But of course you have to act before the gun points at you. Shoot first basically.
And that is the problem. When is it really the time to shoot first? You only know afterwards. If you know it, it is too late.
In this I can understand the violent Antifa. As I wrote before, Trump acts very much like Hitler. Just without the good speeches. So for the Antifa: "Shoot" now or wait until the Muslims are killed?
And don't say that cannot happen. It does, just with other means then gas chambers. The EU intentionally let's refugees die by moving away ships from the most used routes and - contrary to Sea Law - not reacting to their SOSes.
For example letting the Anti-Muslim groups "take care" of that is what Hitler did, too. Incite hate, look away from the bullying and in the end you can kill them under cheers.
Second if you get your "info" from infowars, then you at least have to read some Antifa website, too. Both are very biased, just to different sides.
Generally speaking it is also possible that those were just people out for a fight, as it often happens at football (for you: soccer) games. Those "fans" also clad themselves in black and hide their faces.
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
I get my information from MANY sources. And many of the Antifa videos I have watched have not been on Infowars. I've watched them speak and they often have no idea what they are talking about. In addition those chanting when they do attempt to try to speak to someone engaging them (often not even an opponent) you'll invariably see someone walk up to them whisper to them and they'll go silent and/or go back to chanting.
People call Trump like "Hitler" on many things but they are also VERY selective, for Hillary has also done Hitler like things, as did Obama. It depends on WHICH Hitler like things you refer to. It is also popular to wield Hitler like a weapon against any politician someone finds unfavorable.
I am not on anyone's side I have been using observation for many months. I believe this may be my first saying something against Antifa, and if you notice the video that inspired me had NOTHING to do with Infowars.
It really does piss me off when someone will see a source and have conditioned themselves to POUNCE upon that source as though it delegitamizes the person's entire points. Whether it is someone on the left attacking "Oh, it is Fox" or someone on the right saying "Oh it is CNN" or someone like you zeroing in on Infowars because SOME of the videos I showed were from there.
You sir do me a disservice. You've read enough of my works you know I put a lot of thought into what I say. I have my own mind and it is not programmed by Infowars or any one source.
I did not form ANY of these opinions about Antifa based upon Infowars. I formed them based upon my observations of months (even before Trump won) of listening to them speak, and watching their actions.
I have visited their website.
So kindly next time... you've read enough of my works that you should do me the service of not looking for SOFT SPOTS due to a source I chose to use and telling me to look at others. I don't follow ANY ideology, choose any side, and I certainly don't look at just one source, or sources leaning only in one direction.
I know Infowars is biased as hell. Yet often they are one of the few places talking about certain issues. So that means sometimes they are what you have to show for examples. I haven't liked Alex Jones for quite a number of years now. Though there are often stories on Infowars that are about things no one else mentions. I take them with a grain of salt and go research them myself.
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
You whole rant is pointless since I never said this video is from infowars ;)
Good that you know this, thats all I wanted.
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
Your first point was good then you started comparing the president to hitler, don't blame Donald Trump for creating refugees, it's false, we all know who did that...
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
First: A point is either valid or not, the name of the president has nothing to do with it.
Second: I never said Trump created refugees.
He does hate them or at least uses the Muslim ones as a scapegoat, exactly as Hitler did with the Jews. Make Germany great again, crush the Communists and Liberals, Work for Germans etc. all the same.
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
DJT is protecting muslims and USA from ISIS
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
In the first clip when they cross to the on zite journalist, he seemed a little eager and almost over the top in his delivery to convince the audience of the events that transpired. Is that a normal technique in the US?
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
From the mainstream it indeed is a technique that is common. Generally the public just accepts it as truth.
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
We live in a strange world.
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit
Trump is a mascot
Downvoting a post can decrease pending rewards and make it less visible. Common reasons:
Submit