Don&#x27;t Wait for SMTs to Start Building Your Steem App

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ats-david (74) · 6 years ago

No one else believes in decentralized token rewards (a/k/a Proof-of-Brain) like we do. But the most important reason we’re developing them is that no one else is.

No one else is trying to solve these problems...

One question that a businessman should ask himself is, "What problem am I trying to solve?"

I think the question to ask here may be, "Why does nobody else see this problem?" or, "Why is nobody else trying to solve it?"

I know a lot of time and other resources has gone into SMTs. But...what are we trying to solve and does anyone else care?

If nobody sees the unique "problem" here as an actual problem, then what makes it so attractive for potential investors to sink their money into a project that's working on "resolving" it? Would it not be better or more useful to find the things that the market is demanding and then fill that need? The token-creation and ICO craze has pretty much bottomed-out over the past year. It can be done on other platforms by competent developers and they still don't garner much attention or sustain any long-term hype and investment. So why would a "turn-key" solution that's available to any schmo running a blog site suddenly be more attractive to potential investors?

I think what's lost in all of the internal Steem hype about SMTs is the fact that there is practically nobody outside of Steem interested in creating this "solution" and seemingly no interest in Steem itself for being "the only" blockchain attempting it. In the investment world, if this were truly a revolutionary and/or highly-demanded thing, there would be tons of speculative hype surrounding it.

But there is none.

If this continues to be the case, then it will likely just turn into an albatross for the Steem blockchain. And it will be an albatross that we can't simply roll back. I think there needs to be much more careful consideration about the impact on the Steem blockchain that this will have - on both resources/performance and perception.

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11 votes

zammie (60) · 6 years ago

Nobody needed oil, nobody needed cars, nobody needed highways, nobody needed computers, nobody needed internet, nobody needed smartphones, nobody needed bitcoin and now we can´t live without them. Do you see a pattern here??

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ats-david (74) · 6 years ago

lol...no

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mckeever (62) · 6 years ago (edited)

He's right. Did you know you needed Steem before it hit the marketplace? How about the internet? No, you didn't.

You don't seem to understand how entrepreneurship and innovation works.

Low quality comment from a high reputation user.

You seem to lack vision and imagination.

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ats-david (74) · 6 years ago

You seem to lack vision and imagination.

Excellent! Maybe I’ll be STINC’s next hire!

Fingers crossed! :)

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hiroyamagishi (68) · 6 years ago

like it 😁

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andrarchy (72) · 6 years ago

Haha, well put. No one "needed" Steem either. It's funny that apparently having the foresight to build Steem apparently gives us zero cred with respect to the decisions we make with our next products ... even one that everyone agrees has widespread support within the community! LOL

ats-david (74) · 6 years ago

...even one that everyone agrees has widespread support within the community! LOL

Well...lol...everyone doesn’t agree. LOL

And...lol...who built Steem? You? Ned? Who was the brainchild behind it and where is he now? LOL

Also...lol...you know what else is funny? LOL

The fact that you have made four replies on my thread...lol...but not one of them was actually made to me in response to my concerns/criticism. LOL

Are you that scared to talk to me? LOL

Some “community liaison” you are. LOL. Amirite? LOL

One last thing:

LOL

JFC...

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ocrdu (71) · 6 years ago (edited)

I wouldn't bother with this community liaison/content director if I were you; there will be no to-the-point and intelligent discourse or discussing of problems coming from this guy ever.

In my opinion, he's full of shit and as slippery as an eel in a bucket of snot. He makes a living ignoring or diverting criticism and encouraging those who agree with the party line. A paid shill best muted, LOL.

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kryptik (63) · 6 years ago (edited)

“LOL” means “lots of love” right?

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tuck-fheman (74) · 6 years ago

having the foresight to build Steem

I thought Dan built it cuz we were splashing Qora all in his face. You mean, Dan and Ned were already building Steemit prior to spamming Qora all over the BitShares forum and going on and on about "decentralized blogging" to the point Dan said he could do it better?

Dammit, my entire life is a lie!

even one that everyone agrees has widespread support within the community

Do you have polling data supporting this claim? And were factors like : most people would rather not get involved in such discussions, nor have the ability to understand the discussion in detail, and therefore do not participate in such "polling", thereby skewing the data in the favor of those who approve of the decision, for they are the most vocal in most all cases.

;)

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kryptik (63) · 6 years ago

Get out of here College Boy!

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tabris (62) · 6 years ago

Actually, I know few others.
One was: https://www.ttc.eco
Forgot the names of others.. 😝

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andrarchy (72) · 6 years ago (edited)

Thanks for sharing a potential competitor! But unless I'm missing something, there is no mention of giving people the ability to launch their own token, let alone one with the properties we are referring to. It's still good to see the progress (or lack of progress) other teams are making with respect to doing what did 2 years ago. Of course, as the original commenter points out, the fact that no one else is building this is obviously not a good reason to do something. This is why this was not even considered when making the decision.

Our goal with SMTs is to fill a niche we know for a fact exists from dealing with entrepreneurs and developers from outside the community who shared why they were refraining from adopting Steem. Most reasonable people would conclude that the fact that the community has bought into the idea so completely supports the claim that it is the right path, though obviously nothing in this world is certain. But interpreting overwhelming support from the community as a bad thing is certainly an interesting approach. If anyone looks back at before SMTs were announced, you'll find hardly any mention of adding a token launching protocol. The fact that so many Steemians are excited about the protocol is clear evidence that it's just a good idea. Everybody loves the Beatles for a reason, some things are just obviously awesome :). Discounting the opinion of the user base, especially in a system that is designed around stake holding, is certainly one way to go, but not an approach we believe to be productive. But by all means, people are free to argue that the stakeholders should not pursue what they believe to be good ideas.

When making the decision to pursue SMTs we made our decision based on what everyone who matters wanted: entrepreneurs, developers, and existing Steem stakeholders (everyone with any amount of Steem Power). We then looked at the landscape and saw that no one else is doing this, and no one else is better suited to do this. So we decided to do it and then the community rallied behind the idea. That sounds like consensus to me.

I think a quote from billionaire venture capitalist Peter Thiel sums it up nicely: The perfect target market for a start-up is a small group of particular people concentrated together and served by few or no competitors. Once you create and dominate a niche market, then you should gradually expand into related and slightly broader markets.

stellabelle (75) · 6 years ago

Peter Thiel just invested in Block.one. No one knows how this all will shakeout. The only thing I now for sure is that users go where they feel the best and where their needs are met. The fact is that 90%+ of users on here feel like beggars. The only app that has made a difference in User happiness is Partiko. They are the ones paying attention to the importance of activity points. I hope SMTs go well but you missed the boat on communities, as profit was prioritized over people. Let’s see what happens in 2019.

Posted using Partiko iOS

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tomekkk (61) · 6 years ago

But unless I'm missing something, there is no mention of giving people the ability to launch their own token.

There is a reason for that, there is no problem to solve.

Our goal with SMTs is to fill a niche we know for a fact exists from dealing with entrepreneurs and developers from outside the community who shared why they were refraining from adopting Steem.

Who in their right mind would invest in ~~shitcoins~~ SMT's, while STEEM is getting noticed everyday by people walking their dogs in STEEM Park.

And why did they refraining from using STEEM, don't want any associations or too embarrassed?

andrarchy (72) · 6 years ago (edited)

Because they can't customize STEEM to their business logic. There are two arguments: 1. It's a bad idea, 2. No one else is doing it. 1. Most Steemians agree that it's a good idea, if you don't agree with them, that's cool, it's your opinion. 2. No one has presented any proof anyone else is doing it.

tomekkk (61) · 6 years ago (edited)

Thanks for the reply.
I wouldn't say that it's a bad idea, more like that this feature shouldn't have top priority over other 2016 roadmap features such as Communities, I'll even say that implementing 2f authentication for security reasons should be more important along with proper marketing as @ats-david stated numerous times.

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andrarchy (72) · 6 years ago (edited)

Thanks for sharing your opinion. Hivemind (communities) is being developed in parallel to SMTs. They are equally high priorities.

mckeever (62) · 6 years ago (edited)

@ats-david The 'problem' is that time and attention is not being rewarded on 99.9 percent of websites, and time and attention are the two most important spiritual currencies in the world.

Why should users not be rewarded for their time and attention, for liking, commenting , and upvoting posts? That's why Steemit was created in the first place, to reward users for their time and attention on the internet.

Smart Media Tokens take that same reward system and enable potentially thousands of other entrepreneurs to incorporate it into their product and website.

So, the problem is that, right now, while I post on other forums on the internet, I am not being rewarded for my time. I make my own comments and posts, upvote and 'like' other comments and posts, but receive nothing in return. SMTs change that.

No offense, but you seem to lack entrepreneurial vision. At the time Steve Jobs launched iTunes, there was no demand for having 'thousands of songs in your pocket'. He CREATED the demand. The best entrepreneurs create things that people don't even know they want, who don't even realize that there is a 'problem' in the marketplace to begin with.

SMTs have the potential to 'steemify' the internet, allowing publishers to reward their audience for their time and attention (comments, posts, and likes) as well as authors and journalists. I think it's obvious why so many in the Steem community are excited about this project.

99 percent of the users of Steem didn't know they needed Steem before it was introduced. It is the job of entrepreneurs and visionaries to create demand where no previous demand existed.

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ats-david (74) · 6 years ago

99 percent of the users of Steem didn't know they needed Steem before it was introduced.

Correction:

About 6% of sign-ups think they need Steem in its current form. Of those 6% of users, half or more are likely bots. So perhaps 3% of the million+ who signed up on Steem find it useful...mostly to shitpost, beg, whine, and then cash out.

Outside of that small number, nobody cares. Hundreds of millions of people use Facebook regularly. They don’t get paid and probably don’t even give it any thought. Why do you assume that a) these people are looking for money when they interact there and b) why should they be receiving any?

We know why people come to Steem/Steemit - for the money. That’s how it’s “advertised.” But what exactly has that gotten us? If there wasn’t the possibility to make money for shitposting on any of the Steem apps/interfaces, how many people would actually use them for their regular social media interaction?

I get the allure of “Steemifying the internet.” I don’t get why everyone assumes that giving away tokens for what most people do on social media is somehow going to make everyone rich. The simple fact that you can earn money doing this makes people skeptical in the first place, including in the crypto world. Steem is still not taken seriously. How does an extra layer of shittoken creation change that perception?

mckeever (62) · 6 years ago (edited)

Obviously, you and I have vastly different perceptions of Steem. There are no 'shitposts', as you refer to them, on my feed. I see good quality material, on a daily basis, from journalists, writers, artists, and activists - mostly all of whom have a positive outlook about Steem.

Renowned alternative media reporters and journalists are ditching YouTube and Facebook for Steem and DTube because A) They are making much more money on Steem and B) Their work can not be censored. This is a good thing. Public trust in the likes of Facebook and YouTube is also at an all-time low as their mass censorship campaign continues to accelerate.

Honestly, there's obviously no point in continuing because your mind has already been made and I find your attitude terrible, especially from a high-rep user.

Which really begs the question, why are you even here?

Create your own product if you feel you can do better. I won't hold my breath.

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ats-david (74) · 6 years ago

You catch on to the toxic culture quickly. Congrats.

I’ll go back to ignoring nobodies like you again.

Good day.

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mckeever (62) · 6 years ago

You're projecting.

Goodbye.

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markkujantunen (74) · 6 years ago (edited)

I get the allure of “Steemifying the internet.” I don’t get why everyone assumes that giving away tokens for what most people do on social media is somehow going to make everyone rich.

You're right, that's a really stupid assumption. But I don't think most people here think what they're doing is going to make them rich. Some money, yes, but rich, not.

The simple fact that you can earn money doing this makes people skeptical in the first place, including in the crypto world. Steem is still not taken seriously. How does an extra layer of shittoken creation change that perception?

People underestimate the value of their time and attention. Social media use is but one example of an activity that could be tokenized on the Steem platform as we have already seen. Little streams of income tend to add up. In the current centralized model, all of the profits go to a small number of very rich shareholders. On Steem, the inflation mechanism causes ownership of the platform to spread out gradually over time. A lot of people continue to use Facebook and are very sceptical of decentralized alternatives simply because they have been conditioned to accept the status quo. It takes time for the crowds to get their heads around any new ideas. The vast majority of people simply never consider anything from alternative points of view. Not even reasonably smart people. We all tend to take the vast majority of things surrounding us as given.

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tomekkk (61) · 6 years ago (edited)

Life is so unfair, I'm taking a shit on my own and no one is paying me for it :(

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https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/sep/12/total-monster-concrete-fatberg-blocks-london-sewage-system

markkujantunen (74) · 6 years ago

Actually, it's great that you brought up taking a shit!

Did you know that there is some value in never flushing anything but the real McCoy down the toilet? That is, only number one and two and toilet paper? Water works all over the world pay pretty penny every year to keep the sewers clear of waste that has no business being there.

Check this out:

I think with some development you could build a system that used sensor fusion (infrared etc. to detect the temperature and consistency etc. of things flushed down the toilet) to detect contraband. (You wouldn't believe the stuff some idiots flush down.) You could implement a token system where each legit flushing would be rewarded with tokens held on an escrow account. Each time you flush, say, turkey fat left over from preparing your Christmas meal, you'd be penalized by losing some amount of tokens. (Fat flushed down the toilet feeds rats and other vermin in the sewer network that cost real money to exterminate.) That would be an actual shitcoin!

Now, what's important here is the concept. I don't know if that concept would be technologically or economically quite feasible, yet. That would depend on if it were possible to reliably identify the most common types of materials and items flushed down the toilet that cause problems using sensor fusion and machine learning. The economics of the system would depend on how cheap the sensors installed in the toilet seat would be. Anyway, this is but one illustration of the near-limitless potential for the tokenization of life.

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tcpolymath (68) · 6 years ago

This is an excellent post. The big thing on my wishlist would be a central repository for resources available to Steem entrepreneurs, not just support from Steem Inc. but basic information on working with projects like Utopian, Fundition, and so on that would be accessible to someone coming freshly to Steem.

Also I would recommend the @steempytutorials account to anyone who wants to learn to develop on Steem using Python, the lessons there are very well-written and make it easy to learn.

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6 votes

zipporah (64) · 6 years ago

And this is a wonderful suggestion. ⭐️ Thanks for mentioning that tutorial account — I may just be crazy enough to look into this whole developer side of things.

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cambridgeport90 (52) · 6 years ago

Not only python. We also need first class support for the simile millions of other languages out there. I'm probably exaggerating, but it is true that there are many, many different programming languages and each developer should be able to create Solutions within the language of their choice. It seems that right now we favor one over all the rest. I'm actually speaking from minor experience.

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therealwolf (75) · 6 years ago (edited)

Exactly. I'm 100% behind this message. Right now is the perfect time to start and develop your SMT idea!

And if anyone has troubles or needs some help interacting with Steem via Javascript (dsteem & steem-js) then fear not.

I've developed multiple projects on Steem and I know how difficult everything seems at first. So I'm very happy to help. Just hit me up on discord or steem.chat.

Discord: therealwolf#2442
Steem.chat: therealwolf

Additionally, there is an amazing community called SteemDevs on discord, with very experienced Steemians including Steemit Inc. Staff & Steem Witnesses.

SteemDevs Discord: https://discord.gg/kqMPyBc

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4 votes

itstime (60) · 6 years ago

Suggestion : can you/someone make a dashboard similar to Dappradar showcasing the STEEM apps?

Currently none of the STEEM apps are listed here.

https://dappradar.com/

https://steemprojects.com/

timcliff (73) · 6 years ago

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itstime (60) · 6 years ago (edited)

Thanks Tim , I am aware of steemprojects but it seems very static , something dynamic with user numbers/accounts will be more useful for investors to evaluate the adoption metric.

edit : example below , do we know who is the owner of steemprojects ?

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noisy (67) · 6 years ago

Creator of SteemProjects here. I think your idea is very good. The problem is, that it is not easy to get such data. On ethereum it is much easier to count transactions... on Steem apps are integrated with Steem in so many different ways...

But actually, I was thinking about creating SteemProjects more dynamic.. like for example by showing a countdown: "New Steem App will be revealed in 4:23:52...".

itstime (60) · 6 years ago

Tks for the consideration.

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overkillcoin (69) · 6 years ago

How's it going Wolf?

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therealwolf (75) · 6 years ago

This image describes the last months pretty good. :)

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andrarchy (72) · 6 years ago

We appreciate everything you do to support Steem development!

therealwolf (75) · 6 years ago

Thank you @andrarchy! Means a lot to hear that.

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akomoajong (66) · 6 years ago

Thanks man, will hit you up on discord!

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franciferrer (52) · 6 years ago (edited)

wait, you are saying that, if i have an idea on steem based apps. then i can have a go with my idea at devs or you? thanks @therealwolf

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marc99 (55) · 6 years ago

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Reveal Comment

justtryme90 (71) · 6 years ago

Build an APP that NEEDS a SMT. Don't build a SMT and try to fumble an app. Right on steemit inc.

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andrarchy (72) · 6 years ago

I am totally stealing that!!!

justtryme90 (71) · 6 years ago

It's all yours :)

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tuck-fheman (74) · 6 years ago

Man, I should build something for this community ... one day. I bet it would get lots of support!

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tomekkk (61) · 6 years ago

One day T, one day.

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disregardfiat (59) · 6 years ago (edited)

I'm not waiting!

There's a lot of stuff going on in my front-end. Would love to see what kind of interest there is in such services.

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amahovac93 (63) · 6 years ago

Alot of people are joining steemit becuse of bloging, and then from that point they discover cryptos.

In May 2018 we broke the 1 Million registred users people dont relazie how big that milestone was and it will keep getting bigger just like Facebook (maybe not in that fast rate but not far behind).

I personally think now it's the best time to accumulate more steem power due to the price decline as you recive more steem per post.

thecryptodrive (70) · 6 years ago

@buildteam has always been passionate about building on Steem, our delegation leasing market for example has facilitated over 15 Million SP in leases in the last year since its inception and we will only be developing it further in the coming months. We also have a BUILDTEAM token on Bitshares which simulates the Steem vesting period with an app layer and we aim to migrate our token across to SMT's.

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compumatrix (46) · 6 years ago

I believe it's best to maintain the tokens on Bitshares ran side by side with the SMT. It's a perfect combination. Anyway, Our developers have created a white-label DEX exclusive for Buildteam which you can opt to host at something like wallet.buildteam.io .. let me know if you're interested.

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btuniverse (71) · 6 years ago

Hi @compumatrix would like to discuss with you further regarding running Bitshares side-by-side with SMT's as well as on the topic of the DEX, would be good to explore. Do you use Discord? If so please join the minnowbooster discord (https://discord.gg/S37bYma) and link to me from there in DM.

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thecryptodrive (70) · 6 years ago

Sorry I was logged in as @btuniverse, please dm thecryptodrive on discord.

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whatsup (75) · 6 years ago

Great communication. It seems you are making progress on many levels.

Keep up the good work.

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donkeypong (75) · 6 years ago

Full Steem ahead!

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steevc (73) · 6 years ago

We already have some great apps and some are creating their own tokens. I know Appics want to use SMTs. It is starting to happen.

BTW How come the Steem team don't promote these posts? They don't even get anywhere on Trending, which is a bit of a crap-hole mostly :(

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protegeaa (61) · 6 years ago

Everyone is excited about SMTs... can't wait to see how they add value to the platform!

Thanks for the reminder here and I've noticed startups like @steemhunt have already been setting up for SMTs via airdrops...

Forget the Steem price and hustle now folks! This chain's going to be 🔥🔥🔥

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dulshika8 (29) · 6 years ago

how to add Resteem button for my blog.

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stevelivingston (64) · 6 years ago

Guys we appreciate these regular updates. Keep it up!

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future24 (75) · 6 years ago (edited)

Unfortunely Im not a programmer, but I have a good technical knowledge and understand that this is a huge opportunity for Dapp developers, to be one if the pioneers of the upcoming SMTs. Im very excited to see many new applications connected with the STEEM blockchain and creative new projects. Keep up the great work Steemit Team, Im looking forward to a bright future of this platform! 👏👍

resteemed

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edicted (72) · 6 years ago

I wish you guys would add some basic Java support for android dapps.

I only need a few commands to make some amazing stuff:

post to blockchain
get content
get content replies
delete would be helpful but not required

These functions used to be covered by @steemj but that project is now dead. So now I have an android app that's currently broken.

public Discussion getContent(AccountName author, Permlink permlink)
public List<Discussion> getContentReplies(AccountName author, Permlink permlink)

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doctorspence (63) · 6 years ago (edited)

I believe code to post and pull info is in Steemit developers sections

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joythewanderer (78) · 6 years ago

Congrats, this post is featured on Joy's daily news (in Chinese :D) today.

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akomoajong (66) · 6 years ago

The right time is always now!

Thanks for the heads up @steemitblog

You can find all of that information and more at https://developers.steem.io. The Quick Start section has information on how to work with nodes and testnets.

Thanks a lot for this, I've actually been in need of something like this for a long long time.

There is to contribute to steemit and I believe anyone with the right mindset can create something good.

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just2random (62) · 6 years ago (edited)

Yes, still moving ahead with my SMT based app, but would like to know a little more information about how the SMT transactions are added to the Steem blockchain which I haven't been able to understand from the whitepaper.

Will sites like steemit.com just replay the SMT data to the Steemit platform?

How hard will the transition from Steem to SMT be? (more than a few lines of code)

Can people add data to my SMT chain manually and not via my app, and hence needing good filtering?

How much Steem will you need to run a SMT? (does it need gas?)

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leotrap (72) · 6 years ago

The moment is now.

I'm agree with that at 100% and because of it In here working to see if my new Dapp can be finished before SF3.... let's see!

Also very motivated with @teelkee cause maybe it will be a game changer for many of us that are far away from the Dev World...

Action Script | was my las time years ago ;)

Anyway, amazing times we are living with this, and the way seems to be clear! and as I read in some place and wrote in my Promo-steem flyers:

Future is not tomorrow, was yesterday!

Peace V!

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asaha (47) · 6 years ago

I guess the odds are lower with this...
Well-done

_{This comment was made from https://ulogs.org}

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melissaofficial (64) · 6 years ago

Kwagh doo je gande orwam @ned, msugh tom 👋👋, U er tom ne je gande, musgh @ned👋👋👋

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dinver (69) · 6 years ago

Wonderful~

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xabi (71) · 6 years ago

Yeah why wait for SMT when we have the base already set...

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jimmygatz (25) · 6 years ago (edited)

Hi guys,

I'm José Macedo, senior analyst at AmaZix (https://www.amazix.com/ // https://www.linkedin.com/in/ze-macedo-15b1b175/). In case you haven't heard of us, we're one the largest community management, consulting and advisory companies in the crypto space, partnered with Bancor, HDAC, Bankex and many others. We've worked with over 100 projects and now have over 100 employees.

We're now working on a forum project with a token to incentivise quality content/curation. We really like the STEEM inflation algorithm for this and are very interested in building on top of STEEM. Our ideal scenario would be to use the SMT protocol, but we realise launch is scheduled for January and we simply cannot wait that long to launch.

We’re curious if we’d be able to chat to someone from the SMT team to discuss our options in the meanwhile. Currently, we’re leaning towards issuing an ERC-20 and then switching to SMT’s once they launch, but we’d love to find a way to build on STEEM from the get-go.

Let us know if you have some time to talk and discuss our use case.

Thanks,

José

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melbookermusic (65) · 6 years ago

@steemitblog
This is great news! I will start looking into this. I am not a dev, but hopefully, in the future, developing Steem based sites will be common knowledge. Thanks!

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moneyminded (62) · 6 years ago

I am a non technical guy, but I have a few ideas in mind for apps. I wanna contribute. How can I start with?

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doctorspence (63) · 6 years ago

Start with Developer section, linked in the above post.

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moneyminded (62) · 6 years ago

Thanks!

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oadissin (73) · 6 years ago

Yes it right to start now the development of apps on steem platform. The community will support the project that provides solutions.

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jasonshick (65) · 6 years ago

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Reveal Comment

kryptik (63) · 6 years ago

I wish there was a solution for people that upvoted their own comments.

Especially ones with personal issues irrelevant to the topic at hand.

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5 votes