If you change your SteemDollar balance now, you will receive your interest

in steem •  8 years ago  (edited)

Let's start at the beginning:

Steem pays you interest on your SteemDollars!

The interest rate is set by the witnesses and is currently 10% (to encourage holding/buying).

When is interest payed?

According to the code

Every time the sbd_balance is updated the sbd_seconds is also updated. If at least STEEMIT_MIN_COMPOUNDING_INTERVAL_SECONDS has past since sbd_last_interest_payment then interest is added to sbd_balance.

Where STEEMIT_MIN_COMPOUNDING_INTERVAL_SECONDS is set to 30 days. These 30 days have now passed.

That means:

If you change your SteemDollar balance today, you will receive your interest for the last 30 days!

I simply moved 1SBD to one of my other accounts and my interest was added to my account:

If you don't have another account, you are free to send 0.001 SteemDollar to me (or anyone else) :D

Update 1

@ash made me aware of the fact that initial interst payments have happend on different times. That means that you might not yet be able to retrieve your own interest just yet.
However, the first 30 days have probably past for many Steemians already so it's worth a try. If it doesn't work for you, just wait another day or so and try again.

Update 2

Since this post has received quite some response, I added a corresponding call to piston. It looks like this:

$ piston interest xeroc
+---------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+
| Account | Last Interest Payment |        Next Payment | Interest rate |  Interest |
+---------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+
|   xeroc |   2016-08-03 08:04:00 | 2016-09-02 08:04:00 |         10.0% | 1.046 SBD |
+---------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+

piston.web now also shows some data about the interest payments:

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Hey Xeroc. Useful post. But not for newbies lol (as in nothing to collect yet, but when the tiems comes i will use the advice) )

Doubt if you remember me from the bitshares forum (bitsharesrussia on there), i used to be quite active there, unfortunatly i havent been for the past 2 years.
Now im back thought, and its absolutly amazing to see peopel that you somehow know! How small is the crypto community! Its great to see that you are now helpeing out in steem, just as you do with bitshraes.

Keep it up! Hoping to see more posts from you!

I thought the same . Useful but I need to read 10x to understand 😜

Interesting. To be honest, I thought that interest will be applied every 3 sec similarly as STEEM Power grows.

Is that mean, that there is a monthly capitalisation, but only if you touch your balance once a month?
If I will not touch my balance for a year, I will have 1 year capitalisation?

If my calculation are correct, in case of 10% interest, this give:

  • 10% with yearly capitalisation
  • 10,47% with monthly capitalisation

(assumptions ahead) If you want compound interest, you should "change" your SteemDollar balance once after every 30 days. Otherwise you will just get the (currently) 10% apr

  ·  8 years ago (edited)

If you are active on the site then you will probably change your SD balance at least one a month by earning rewards (for example the comment to which I'm replying is currently earning $2.48, a portion of which will be paid in SD). That will trigger the interest payment.

I have been asking this ofa lot of people. Will my sbd on bittrex earn interest? It seems like they should on any wallet if it done through the blockchain. Does this mean bittrex is keeping the interest ( like a bank) . Any help appreciated.

I wonder what will happen when the Bitcoin crowd finds out they could ride out dumps like the Bitfinex hack in SD and collect 10% interest....

The interest payments on STEEM Dollars need to be more transparent. Despite holding thousands of STEEM Dollars in my account for a few weeks, I don't recall collecting any interest. Not saying I haven't. Just I haven't seen it nor is there an easy way of checking whether I have or not.

If STEEM Dollar interest was more visible it would incentivise people to hold it for longer. It's certainly an area that could do with improvement IMO.

(NB: Changed my SBD balance just now... no interest added)

  ·  8 years ago (edited)

I totally agree with you. Technically, it is possible to derive the amount of interest you could get if it was payed out to you today by looking into the account details:
interest = interest_rate * sbd_seconds / seconds_per_year

I am not 100% positive on this, but I would say that it evaluates to this in your case:

>>> int(0.1 * 6524189830497 / (60*60*24*356)) * 10 ** -3
21.211

10**-3 is used to get from the "satoshi" values to the actualy SBD amount (precision 3)

Please let me know if you get something around that value. I am curious to know.

I did a happy dance when you first mis-typed 2000+ SBD interest!

21 SBD seems more realistic. Will let you know if anything comes through.

Received interest of 20.704 SBD, so you were pretty much spot on.

How did you work out the sbd seconds? (6524189830497 )

That number is returned by the Steem API node. It's derived internally by the protocol and provided when calling get_account <accountname>

Thanks - I've been following your piston/ python updates... I guess I'm going to have to find the time to get my hands dirty and have a look under the hood of Steem!

If you are awarded for posting is that " a change to sbd balance"? Or do I need to do something manually?

It seems any change in any of your balances triggers the interest payment

Do you recieve interest if sbd are held at bittrex? Why not. Seems like you should. Merchants would likely like to hold sbd somewhere they could easily cash out.

That's a question you need to ask bittrex. I personally never hold funds on an exchange for longer than absolutely necessary (except for a decentralized exchange, of course)

Thanks for the reply but bittrex was an example. Will I recieve interest at a non Steem walket? Seems like I should?

Technically, the blockchain cannot know the SBD belong to you, that's why you would need to find an agreement with bittrex .. or not leave your SBD there

"A few weeks" is not long enough. Has to be 30 days.

Do the SBD need to be in the account for 30 days before it attracts interest?
Or do I have to wait 30 days for the interest payout to happen?

NB: I've seen SBD interest payments paid on my wife's account when she sold SBD for STEEM in the internal market

This was only a few days after the July 4th payout....

Either way it's all very confusing.

Didn't seems to work for me, thanks anyway :)

you last interest payment was made on"2016-07-05T14:40:48", .. that means that you need to wait a little longer before you can obtain your interest.
Hope we can get a nice gui feature for this sooner than later.

Thank you for the date! Where did you find it by the way? It is not on Steemd..

You can get that number by using the cli_wallet and get_account..
Next release of piston will have an interest command that looks like this:

+---------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+
| Account | Last Interest Payment |        Next Payment | Interest rate |  Interest |
+---------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+
| clement |   2016-07-05 14:40:48 | 2016-08-04 14:40:48 |         10.0% | 0.872 SBD |
+---------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+

Awesome tip! Another little known tip is that if you send all your SteemDollars to @random-potato he will buy a yacht and move to Mexico!

@xeroc. How do we find the last interest pay date for our accounts? Steemd.com?

Are you saying that even if SteemDollar balance is growing from activity, interest is not represented in that number? Are you recommending that Steemians trigger the payout every 30 days?

Learned something new! Would interest be triggered by convert SD to STEEM in the same account?

The interest pay day is at least 30 days after the last pay day. You can't find the last payout on steemd currently. If you have the cli_wallet running, you can get it with get_account cryptobro. The parameter is called sbd_last_interest_payment ... add 30 days and that is your payout date.

You don't need to manually move funds, to get your interest, but the SBD balance needs to change somehow. You could also receive a payout in SBD .. that's as good as moving your funds. A conversion probably works aswell .. can't tell for sure

I can't give investment advice, but if you think about compound interest, it seems reasonable to trigger a payout every 30 days.

Woah! thats crazy ! I don't have another account and i've converted all my Steem dollars to steem power. BUT

you are more than welcome to send Steemdollars to this account for me to check it out ;)

Very cool , how about steem power? I hope some interest for steem power too .

"interest" in steem power is quite a different beast, especially if you denote it in STEEM and not the internal unit VESTS. Let's just say it's a combination of "interest" payed to offset the dilution of STEEM minus the rewards payed to users of the platform. Technically, if you (as a SteemPower investor) don't participate on the platform and just let your SteemPower sit there, you would not make any profits (besides capital gains/losses) because all rewards are ultimately payed by the investors. The bigger an investor you are, the more you would need to participate in order to not lose more than you gain. Of course there is also the capital gains from speculation.

In the end, doing the actual numbers on SteemPower is quite not so easy.

Really good info. Thx

Excellent post, thank you; I'm still discovering the complexities of steem!! This is good to know, thank you for sharing.

So I'm also assuming that receiving SBD from author rewards also causes this to trigger?

Also since my accounts only 22 days old, I'll have to wait until late next week to be able to do this :)

| Account | Last Interest Payment |        Next Payment | Interest rate |  Interest |
+---------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+
|   jesta |   2016-07-18 16:43:24 | 2016-08-17 16:43:24 |         10.0% | 7.320 SBD |
+---------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+

Strange that it paid out once already... I'm a bit confused as to how that happened.

Looks like I have a new topic to go dig around and research.

I was looking for this question through the whole comment section.

This is awesome thanks for spreading the word about this! :D

This must be done, or SBD in the market will continue to fall, because people will continue to throw and never buy. or perhaps if hold is as stake in the wallet? and it will continue to grow?

TBH, I don't think the interest rate should be at 10% for too much longer. It's insanely high and I hope the witnesses reduce it sooner, than later. Otherwise, people might rather find confirmation and Steem being a Ponzi (which it IMHO is not) .. an interest rate of 3-5% should be sufficient to incentivize people holding it.

(no investment advice)

I would consider this as an bug. Thanks for made it public.

It's not a bug .. it's a feature that has been stated in the whitepaper already. Not even new.
It compares to other POS crypto currencies where you can 'mint' new coins.

Awesome, getting interest on SteemDollars.. Fine for me, let's do it bro

Thank you so much for sharing.

Never stop learning . For now I have nearly nothing but it's a good time to get familiar with all this info . Thanks much !

Looks like a little life hack :)
I want to try it, thank you @xeroc!

life hack is to keep your money away from traditional banking system ;)

I told about Little life hack. So "to keep your money away from traditional banking system" is a real Big lifehack.
And a LifeHack words have here a real sense. Because crypto-entusiasts can hack and destroy this system of commisions, unfair rules of life, whic was impose to us by banking system.
We are all in a sense of resistance fighters :) He-he ...

  ·  8 years ago (edited)

Do you only get interest on holding Steem Dollars? I have been trading them in for Steem and then powering the Steem up to Steem Power. Is interest earned on Steem and Steem Power as well? I read one of your replies up above, but not sure I understood the answer :)

No interest on STEEM .. SteemPower is quite a different beast. Not so easy to give a single number as it has a time-variant "interest" that depends on many factors. SteemDollar is way easier here but you don't really obtain capital gains here .. in contrast to Power and plain Steem

Did not work for me... I will try again in a couple of days.

|      Account | Last Interest Payment |        Next Payment | Interest rate |  Interest |
+--------------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+
| nenad-ristic |   2016-07-05 10:10:03 | 2016-08-04 10:10:03 |         10.0% | 6.240 SBD |
+--------------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+

Strange, I still do not see it in my wallet... Either way, thanks for the tip!

But when I get reward in SD, it means that balance has changed, but nothing happens. Or only cashout is counted?

| Account | Last Interest Payment |        Next Payment | Interest rate |  Interest |
+---------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+
|  busser |   2016-07-18 14:46:09 | 2016-08-17 14:46:09 |         10.0% | 0.021 SBD |
+---------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+

Your 30 day window has not yet passed ...

If you didnt transfer any amount of sbd from the time your account was created, then youre eligible for interest if you made a transfer 30 days after your account is active. And only if, your sbd is high enough to materialize a concrete interest.

Hey xeroc,
thanks for the post. Again something I didn't know and learned. Does the interest only increase when I don't move my SBD?
Thanks!

  ·  8 years ago (edited)

According to the code (from what I understand), the interest is calculated from the time-weighted amount of SteemDollar: (time_1 * amount_1 + time_2 * amount_2 ...)
That means if you change your balance, the interest will properly ajust.

If you can read code, here is the corresponding block

Thank you much for the code! You are right, luckily I understand the code now. What does this tell me? Invest in Steem and SBD

Thanks for sharing. Anyone knows interest based last day balance or average of last month?

Neither, nor.
The interest is a time-weighted sum of the amounts you had since the last payout. If you doubled up your amounts in the middle of the 30 day period. You would get the "full interest" on the initial amount and half the interest on the amount you topped up.

haha
i say these kind of transfers of 0.001 SD, i didn t know why!
now after your post, i realise.

Yeap I noticed this yesterday when I received some money from polo...

Interest...ing. I couldn't resist

nice info, thank you for share it with the community

strange, just sent you 0.01 SD to trigger the interest payout but nothing happened?

My fault. I didn't realize that interest payout times can vary for quite a bit. In your case, your last interest payment was done on block 2904540 .. that is 29.5 days ago ..
Not quite there yet ..

👍nice information... @xeroc

@xeroc again you amaze me with more valuable information:) Thanks!!!

@xeroc I sent 0.001 SBD to your account, unfortunately I didn't gain any interest. If possible please check my account to see when my interest is due so I can repeat the process. Thanks.

|     Account | Last Interest Payment |        Next Payment | Interest rate |  Interest |
+-------------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+
| b4bb4r-5h3r |   2016-07-04 16:15:54 | 2016-08-03 16:15:54 |         10.0% | 1.232 SBD |
+-------------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+

the time should be UTC .. so try again in a few hours ..

Thanks a lot, ​I've received the interest and the little amount of SBD I sent you. Appreciate your help.

To be honest, I really enjoy using the Steemit blockchain! It's full of surprises! First, I never knew that there was a referral thing and now, they have interest! Amazing!

Thanks for doing this post. I'm still trying to understand how steemit works.

I have a question, @xeroc - can this be "gamed" so that you can send SBD back and forth between two accounts and "milk" the system?

Not to my knowledge .. the interest is a time-weighted amount .. the longer you hold .. the higher the interest .. no back and forth gains

If you don't have another account, you are free to send 0.001 SteemDollar to me (or anyone else) :D

What if we have 2 account, one for posting and another one to save our sbd or to trade :D
At least if we get problem on one account we still have another account

You get the interest for any sbd you hold in any of your accounts ... to its fair share

ok, thank you very much for your information, getting interest from our sbd saving is a really good feature on steemit..cheers

Thanks for the info

thanks for sharing

Я тоже многого не понимаю как это работает

what is my day? how i can see it? i send for you 0.01 SD. :D

  ·  8 years ago (edited)
| Account | Last Interest Payment |        Next Payment | Interest rate |  Interest |
+---------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+
|  falzxx |   2016-07-10 21:20:18 | 2016-08-09 21:20:18 |         10.0% | 0.000 SBD |
+---------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+

To me that seems that you haven't yet accumulated interest

  ·  8 years ago (edited)

where this "interest" coming, i mean what i have to do that i get more interest?

I sent 0.01 to your account and accumulated no interest

In your case, you need to wait to more days:

| Account | Last Interest Payment |        Next Payment | Interest rate |  Interest |
+---------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+
|   azaan |   2016-07-07 09:59:30 | 2016-08-06 09:59:30 |         10.0% | 0.006 SBD |
+---------+-----------------------+---------------------+---------------+-----------+

Thanks!