How Useful Would a Giant Robot Be as a Military Weapon?

in steemstem •  7 years ago 

After discovering recently that there would be a live action Gundam film adaptation, I began thinking about giant robots. It doesn't take much to nudge my brain in that direction. I've written about the topic at length before:

That Time the Air Force Built a Giant, Nuclear Powered Mech
Before There Was Iron Man, There Was Hardiman: The History of Powered Exoskeletons

...However, while I covered the tactical disadvantages of giant robots due to their height making them an easy target for tanks, there's more wrong with the concept of using giant military robots in a military capacity than that.


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I'm not going to dispute that giant robots are cool. But cool usually equals expensive and impractical, and this is one of those cases. Of course surrounding soldiers in metal armor, under powered mobility, with powerful weapons is a good idea. But if you take that concept and squash it down so it's low profile enough to be defensible, you get a tank.

Tanks already serve the purpose that mechas would, and do a better job of it. Bipedal locomotion and the ability to lift/manipulate heavy objects is not especially useful in a combat scenario when a tank can just climb the fuck over or smash it's way through nearly any obstacle.

But this is all well-worn ground. The bigger issues with giant robots have to do with how material properties change as the scale increases.

Our minds often have trouble accounting for speeds and scales beyond what we experience in every day life. This is why the behavior of particles at the smallest scales we can model so thoroughly baffle us. It's also why the wobbling bridge seen above is so surreal.

After all, a piece of concrete or asphalt small enough for you to pick up is extremely rigid. It's as solid as you can imagine anything being. Yet if you build large enough contiguous masses of concrete and asphalt, on that scale it behaves very differently.

Likewise with metals. Doubly so if whatever you're building has moving parts, and needs to be lightweight. Those demands are all severely at odds with one another. How do you build something out of metal that is light enough to move under it's own power and not collapse under it's own weight, but which is sufficiently armored for combat use?

Nature faces the same constraints. It's why the largest animals are aquatic, not land dwelling. It's why dinosaurs couldn't be much larger than the argentinosaurus. Similar, but not identical principles prevent arthropods much larger than the coconut crab.

Depending what materials you're using and what you want the finished product to be capable of, there's going to be an inflection point beyond which you can't make it any bigger without it being immobile or collapsing under it's own weight.


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This is the unfortunate reason why the beautiful gundam statue in Tokyo can only be a statue. Making it fully mobile would render it too fragile for use as a weapon, unless stronger, lighter materials were discovered. This is to say nothing of the problem of powering it.

Unless you're going to power your mecha with a cable like in Evangelion, you very quickly run into the problem of energy density. How do you carry enough stored energy onboard a giant robot for it to have a useful endurance, without adding too much weight?

The giant Navy robot from the 1960s I wrote about here solved that by basically just being a tank with a vaguely humanoid upper body. It could then support the weight of the onboard nuclear reactor.

Building a compact nuclear reactor into a giant bipedal robot is currently not feasible without significantly reducing the weight of such reactors and increasing their output. The Beetle robot linked above could only move at the snail's pace of 15 feet per minute on electric power, and carried a diesel engine as a supplemental backup.

Kuratas and it's American counterpart which I wrote about here are small enough to be diesel powered. Notice they also do not attempt bipedal locomotion.

The Method-2 mech discussed later on in that article is bipedal, but you'll notice it has no onboard power source. It's powered by a cable running to an external supply. You'll notice in videos that it also can't lift much, as it's already putting a great deal of power just into moving it's own huge, heavy arms around.

If you're still dead set on living in a future where awesome giant mechs do battle then, the main problems that need solving are how to store enough energy in a light weight form, and inventing stronger, lighter materials. That won't make them any less of a gigantic, easily struck bullseye on the battlefield though.


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  ·  7 years ago (edited)

Giant machines, robots or otherwise, would be super cool if - as you pointed out - completely impractical.

As for animals, there's a great little Kurtzgesagt video showing the interesting relationship between animal mass, surface area, and heat dispersion ratios. Very simple and explains why we couldn't, for example, have giant ants that are 20+ feet long, as impressive as that might be riding those into battle!

I think this article is so racist. Robots are racist! And also why there is only a white robot?? You specially picked the white one! You racist!
I wanna more drama, bring me moaaaaar drama!! :DDD

After reading Fahrenheit 451, I'm pretty "No thanks" on military and police robot stuff.

interesting post. I think it's a challenge for the material enggineer to be able to create new material for this problem. And we must be prepared if the fore should be part of our life bro @alexbeyman

I guess its useless to even ask that..

Very good post.
Thank s for you Alexbeyman sir..

Your post is very interesting.
Thank you sir..

whether we are ready if the robot replaces us?. how about the unemployment that exists in this world ?. the utilization of technology is very good but only for positive things. problem material for robot i think there must be a solution. very interesting info

Very good info and photo mr alex. I like it giant robot. giant robot for war ?. it seems like the future of war is like in a fiction movie. but hopefully there is no war. let the robot who replaces us as a maid only

Very good info and photo mr alex. I like it giant robot.

A giant robot uses a lot of energy, is a huge target to hit, has no stealth, cannot camouflage or take cover, has a very high maintenance cost compared to anything else, covers less area by itself than multiple smaller ones, is a real problem to transport anywhere, cannot be used effectively in urban or forest settings, and sinks in wet terrain.

A better option is to go small and efficient. Armoured exoskeletons for infantry and the like, RC helicopters armed with machine guns and rockets, small armoured vehicles with guided missiles and anti-missile defenses, stealth jets with very powerful yet fairly small bombs... There is no tactical need for giant robots. While powerful, they have few uses, and are made redundant by other components of the military.

Giant robots could be very useful. While a stealth bomber definitely seems more efficient in hindsight, the tactic of "blow the out of everything" doesnt work very well when situations require a bit of tact. Yes they're hard to maintain, cost alot and we wont have the technology to make them work well in a long time; but one day I could see small elite units of mechs (not huge bipedal castles, but small maneuverable single-pilot fighters) being employed by governments.

I really agree with you on this point tonight, giant robot with big shape might find it difficult to be mobile so easily.

Nature faces the same constraints. It's why the largest animals are aquatic, not land dwelling.

I agree with you too on this the largest animals are set live inside water, never get to think of that for once, but thanks to you I really get the picture. Getting a moderate military robots in height will be more better and work perfectly well and ain't it purpose well enough. I can't wait for your decision on this

I'd say we could have fully automated or remote controlled tanks right now if the government wanted to invest in them, but there is really no need right now, as a person can do the job just as well without all that extra equipment (money and the weight of it being the 2 man factors). Aircraft will undoubtedly become more mechanized in the future.

Very helpful. Thanks

I think they would be very expensive, complex and inefficient if we are talking about humanlike robots.

@alexbeyman it sounds like an aawfully expensive fantasy. I don't think giant robots make a lot of economic or operationAl sense when smaller bots do the job much better

Yeah it doesn't make a lot of sense to build a giant robot to fight other things, that sounds more like something Ultron would do.

How do you carry enough stored energy onboard a giant robot for it to have a useful endurance, without adding too much weight?

This is a major problem I see it your way, no wonder robots in the movies are much cooler, because it is actually the movies . See the likes of giant robots in the movie transformer, the pacific rim.
The best way is what the old navy had done to the robot , a Diesel engine and a tank in locomotion.

Watching that bridge wobble
makes me very uncomfortable
with being indoors right now.
I can't imagine who I would react,
if my house started wobbling like that.

I think you're right, the cost of developing giant robot doesn't make sense given the challenges you have stated, and I am sure there are many more problems that could arise that we wouldn't think to consider.

I would certainly be cool, but it is more practical to have a tank.

Endeavors to check one of my latest post brother, I have a package for you on it. I want your response concerning it.

A giant robot will surely find it difficult to be mobile enough killing the enemy it is only if it want to get stuck in one place and fire from just one directions. I agreed with you, the height and weight should be reduced in order to shape it well enough to be more mobile and active.

Thanks for shearing your robotics information post.This is interesting post.
Very nice video share.@alexbeyman

Very good post, when discussing the problem of this robot is very influential on the form Sometimes too big Sometimes there is a small according to each function. But when used to fight it must be made with thicker and heavy steel, this is where the problem, because the weight of a robot is very difficult to move and spend more energy. Some time ago in Japan have been introduced robots that are not too big and too small and can be a lot of benefits to use.

I think they can be pretty useful. This thought can to my mind a few months earlier, why don't they make giant robots to fight in the battlefields ?
Why so much bloodshed ? Never got an answer though.

The first obstacle would be to get approval to build a giant robot without having a complete explanation for all those doubts that until the least studied would be made, the joints would be the most difficult to get a correct and accurate movement at the time of an attack on any objective, it is a safe target only could be used only to protect some weak point, but only for that to attack will be like a giant armed tortoise without much movement.

the main problems that need solving are how to store enough energy in a light weight form, and inventing stronger, lighter materials.

I agree! But let’s be realistic. It’s only matter of time when this becomes reality. Just not so long ago we were only talking about drones used in military. Today, it’s one of the most used spy planes as well as weapons.

While I'm sure it's becoming possible, that doesn't mean it will be useful in a military sense. We already have tanks. They do not need to be human shaped. By the same token, drones are basically just autonomous airplanes. It would not improve them to make them mimic the shape and movements of a large bird, or dragon, just because it's cool.

@alexbeyman,
I think the whole world weaponry systems are now working on these projects! I thin Japan is leading in this module, but no idea what China do! Anyway, personally I like this idea, but one hack can cost a huge!

Cheers~

Alex - Like Pacific Rim / Transformers... The world with Robots... Oh Alex, it's a very bad idea...

+W+

You seem to know a lot about robots which is cool. Maybe humans are frightened of them in large forms? Larger than normal human being.. I don't know. If robots become soldiers, wars will be easier to fight that's for sure.

All excellent points. Also, we have to factor space combat in something like Gundam, which is where the humanoid design could potentially thrive, and even scale up, though it might be unnecesary. Smaller mobile infantry would be effectively challenging to hit, but larger Gundam-esque craft would be able to load as much armor as their inertia-to-thrust ratio would allow. The ability to grapple and dexterously propel would serve a purpose against larger craft, assuming it could catch them.

There is still an issue of fuel and propulsion, however, because as a species we haven't publicly mastered any viable technology for something more extreme than clunky NASA travel methods.