Chinese Pseudoscience: Is there any proof of Qi Energy?

in steemstem •  6 years ago  (edited)

Somehow 3 weeks have passed since my last episode on this series, so once again a recap is in order.


pxhere

Recap

All previous episodes have looked into specific medical practices that have come about in history from Traditional Chinese Medicine. By no means did I cover everything, since local villages in the most obscure places make up their own nonsense that becomes mainstream practice, from poo tea to ___.

I decided to tackle the core elements of the philosophy behind it all (since it's clearly not science), first looking into the Meridian Pathways that mysteriously line almost every inch of our bodies and minds, and though are undetectable, were detected by a North Korean some decades ago and then never replicated. The North Korean mysteriously vanished shortly after and that was the end of that until a recent scientist decided to commit to more non-replicable science with a paper so complex and convoluted that it seems to contradict itself and prove nothing more than putting dye in ones system makes the dye colour present in the system.

Every 'proof' of concept seems to arise from the same South Korean author/researcher, so it's fairly fair to say we can dismiss it. But we get the idea, these pathways are meant to be highways for mysterious life energy that pumps through us, and we all need a yin-yang balance in order to stay healthy. But what is that energy?

In China, they call it Qi. in HInduism it's called Prana, and other parts of the world have similar ideas and names. I call it Bullshit but let's look into my personal claim.


Traditional Chinese Character Qi Public Domain

Qi

History

Confucius - Public Domain

Around 2,500 years ago, the philosopher Confucius Released a book of ideas and idioms called The Analects. Inside this collection of ideas presumably brought together by his followers, was what many considered later to be little more than a commentary on the Five Classics, a collection of books of poetry, speeches, songs, historical records and more.

The earliest written concept within the Analects that seems to be ascribed to the development of qi is as follows:

The [morally] noble man guards himself against 3 things. When he is young, his xue–qi has not yet stabilized, so he guards himself against sexual passion. When he reaches his prime, his xue–qi is not easily subdued, so he guards himself against combativeness. When he reaches old age, his xue–qi is already depleted, so he guards himself against acquisitiveness.

Much like qi, this is speaking of balance in one's body, but it was Mencius a generation or so later that associated the word Qi with energy. He was looking for a physiological explanation for why people can go through moral failure. His theory stated that the failure to develop 'heart-mind' - or xin - was the reason, as a result of some kind of 'vital energy' that was kind of vapourey, fluidy stuff found within your body and throughout the universe. To Mencius, this Aether-type substance regulates your cognitive and physical wellbeing. He went on to conclude that if you do right, and you do work, your xi and your xin will make you attractive and healthy.

If you're wondering what evidence made him conclude this, you're looking at it. Besides, evidence wasn't necessary 2,400 years ago.

Now

Which is why it's stunning that, based on some philosophers whimsical daydream solutions, people thousands of years later insist it's legit.

When it comes to Chinese medicine, whenever a person is sick, a rebalancing of Qi is all that's needed to find a cure, apparently. In practice, this means a Chinese doctor will typically address the balance of Qi as the core of the illness, and dismisses real medicine as only treating the symptoms. As stated before, if you are suffering heartburn, you might try something red like a strawberry because the colour red is associated with the heart which is a Yin organ. There's too much Yin making things off-balance, so bringing it back will cure your heartburn.

It's often more complicated than that - People wouldn't believe it this long if it was too simple - -but that's the general gist. Let's stick with the Fire Heart example.

I came across a paper on SciencDirect of all places that discusses this concept, the symptoms and treatments. I strongly suggest you read at least a little bit, it's short and simplistically written, and any paragraph just sounds like the imagination of an adult who never grew up.

This Beijing University published paper for the journal of traditional Chinese medicine states that the heart governs the blood and vessels - ok sure... - but it also governs shen which governs mental activities according to 'modern psychology', and thus the heart is directly connected to cognitive function.

The kidney is directly connected to the heart through meridian pathways and together have a yin-yang balance. But that balance can be skewed in three different ways:

  • Heart Fire Hyperactivity. This apparently causes insomnia, palpitations, bad dreams and vexation.
  • Kidney Yin Deficiency. This causes dizziness, weakness in the knees, tinnitus and other stuff
  • Kidney Yang Deficiency. This causes cold pain, numbness, tingling and impotence among others.

These three manifestations go a long way to explain, for example, anxiety disorder and menopausal syndrome. The treatment for such imbalance? I thought you'd never ask. Read this fully... it's bizarre:

Based on the causes and pathogenesis of this pattern mentioned above, the guiding treatment principle should be clearing hyperactive heart fire and supplementing kidney yin/yang so as to restore harmonious coordination between the heart and kidney.8 Specifically, for the sub-pattern with hyperactive heart fire and deficient kidney yin, the treatment principle should be nourishing kidney yin and clearing heart fire; for the sub-pattern with hyperactive heart fire and deficient kidney yang, the treatment principle should be clearing heart fire and directing heart yang downward to warm the kidney yang or directly supplementing kidney yang. Clinically, when treating these two sub-patterns with Chinese medicines, Coptis and Donkey-Hide Gelatin Decoction (Huánglián Ējiāo Tāng) and Grand Communication Pill (Jiāotài Wán) are often chosen and used with modifications according to the actual conditions.Source

For the curious of you, the Grand Communication Pill consists of Saigon Cinnamon and a generic chinese plant coptis rhizome. Funny how Asian plants are perfectly evolved to cure global ailments when mixed with jelly made from donkey skin.

The Research

So let's jump to more in-depth research into this matter. Can we actually detect qi? Even if the theories from Chinese history are way off, and donkey skin just doesn't cut it no matter how long you keep it refrigerated in a mold, perhaps there is something to the actual core element of the belief that we can refine.


pxhere

Putting aside that Qi is inherently unverifiable and unfalsifiable, like God, Fairies and @trumpman's dignity, researchers went ahead anyway. For example, in 2000, a group of Japanese researchers - You can already guess their results - looked at 'phagocytic activity of human polymorphonuclear leukocytes' when using saline 'buffered' with phosphates and 'treated' with Qi energy.

In translation, they were to observe the activity of some immune cells when treated with an electrolyte drink when treated with Qi energy.

To be clear:

Qi treatment was externally applied under monitoring to newly purchased unopened 100 ml bottles of PBSSource

What they found was that the bottles treated by Qi masters were more effective than those treated by Qi trainees under heavily controlled environments, and this was highly reproducible.

To make it seem more legit, they also point out that microwave or infrared laser pulse treatment mimics the effect of Qi energy... So what is Qi treatment that is so effective by the Qi masters?

The preliminary methodology seemed somewhat legit. They incubated this and centrifuged that, washed everything twice and double checked precise measurements and so forth. Then the Qi master comes in.

Ironically, the 60 year old master simply known as M. M. seems to suffer from a whole plethora of sickness, presumably because he can't apply his own virtuoso prowess to himself:

He gradually lost his sight after secondary glaucoma due to repeated operations following a traffic accident. He suffered myocardial infarction in 1994 and has diabetes mellitus, hyperglycemia, hyperlipidemia, and impaired renal function

Even so, his brain waves were slower than normal after a 30 minute electroencephalogram, as was one of the trainees. The Qi doctors got to work:

The Qi-gong master (M.M.) and/or each trainee (S.M., Y.C. and M.K.) sat down on tatami-mats and concentrated
their minds but didn’t meditate or sleep.

At 10am (time itself is also relative to Yin & Yang), the master took a glass test tube in one hand, and an aluminium rod specifically designed for qi-transduction in the other hand. The master then pointed his metal stick at the bottle filled with Phosphate Buffered Saline (PBS) - the electrolyte drink - without touching it. The master then unified his conscious and subconscious mind, which is different from meditation and a self-description (no electroencephalogram required, apparently). Two hours of 'concentrating' later, the deed was done.

Interestingly, the paper ends with its positive results, without any discussion or acknowledgement of potential flaws to the data or methodology, which can only mean is was the perfect experiment. Our of 10 experiments, only 2 failed giving the Qi master and its correlation with the trainees an accuracy and success rate of 80%!

This is what passes as real science in the new millenium.

Admittedly this paper is 18 years old. But doctors are usually 3-4 times that age and swear by what they learnt in school over 18 years ago. And this was the cutting edge research in Japan, a country famously known for how perfect and futuristic and technologically advanced it is, leaving us westerners in the dust... with their metal rods and focussed, elderly, blind men.

But let's push to more recent times anyway.

On the Epoch Times, a website that looks like this:

They point out as recently as 2017 that Qi has once again been proven, only under the 'tongue-tying, scientific jargon' term: bioelectromagnetism.

Ahh, it's almost like Creationists hiding under their new disguise 'Intelligent Design'.

Bioelectromagnetism seems to magnetically raise my biological eyebrow - wasn't Qi present in all things across the Universe? Is everything thus biological in nature? Hmm.

Chrisitopher Dow, the guy who came up with this brilliant revelation, states:

Chi itself does not flow down the nerve … but instead surrounds the electrical flow with an intangible field that can be manipulated to some degree.

Makes sense.

Most of their sources come from 'heartmath.org', a website that, in its about me section states:

The mission of the HeartMath Institute is to help people bring their physical, mental and emotional systems into balanced alignment with their heart’s intuitive guidance. This unfolds the path for becoming heart-empowered individuals who choose the way of love

Yet it's made to sound proudly legit:

Researchers, including Stanford University Professor Emeritus Dr. William Tiller and Dr. Rollin McCraty at the HeartMath Institute...

The rest of their claims come from real scientists talking about things outside of the context of Qi energy, but similar enough to sound relevant, such as the mystery of phantom limb pain.

It's hard to actually read without cringing, but the source is below if you want.

The reason I added this modern 'research' at the end is to emphasise that it's still going on. There are 'Scientific' journals dedicated to 'alternative medicine' and 'Chinese tradition' chock full of bizarre spiritual gibberish written in a way that makes it hard for people to question and boring enough to prevent people from trying.

Then the media sources with their dedicated audience can freely spin those results however they please and it can spread to the audience which then preaches the word that their beliefs have been proven by SCIENCE. If in doubt, the doubters can be forwarded to 'heartmath', where stanford professors can back your claim right up the arse.

So no, there is no evidence of Qi energy. But don't let that stop the 3-4 billion people who believe in it (counting the equivalents in other countries around the world).

References:

Mencius | The Analects | The History of Qi | Pattern of disharmony between the heart and kidney: Theoretical basis, identification and treatment | Evidence of Qi-gong energy and its biological effect on the enhancement of the phagocytic activity of human polymorphonuclear leukocytes. | TheEpochTimes




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Hello @mobbs

my people indeed perish for lack of knowledge. I really wonder how this practice of traditional Chinese medicine came to be accepted globally despite the fact that its efficacy has no logical Justification or scientific premises. Damn.

He went on to conclude that if you do right, and you do work, your xi and your xin will make you attractive and healthy.

This is complete nonsense! How naive can a people be!

...the 60 year old master simply known as M. M. seems to suffer from a whole plethora of sickness, presumably because he can't apply his own virtuoso prowess to himself

Look at this! I can't help but laugh 😂. What keeps me in perpetual wonderment over all this is the fact that people will see this and still act as though they didn't see it. Imagine morons.

All the same, it's been a good read.

Regards

@eurogee of @euronation and @steemstem communities

People are wonderfully fascinating... things. Seeing what we want to see is one of our greatest strengths!

Exactly!

Explain to me how skinny shaolin monks can break bricks and press sharp objects on their skin without taking any damage? Qi power! Granted, there are old misconceptions in TCM, nevertheless it has working applications that modern medicine can't treat (and vice versa). I don't think alternative medicine should be dismissed, but complement it with modern medicine to provide the best treatment for patients.

You can wait for your doctor's appointment, pay a lump of money for him to tell you to take an aspirin, or immediately visit your TCM doctor (cheaply) for a willow bark prescription. Either way, it's the same molecule relieving your headache.

There's a lot that science can't prove or understand, doesn't mean it isn't there.

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Electricity didn't exist before 1752 when Benjamin Franklin came along with his kite. It was pseudoscience because no one could measure it but a lot of damn fools believed in it.

  ·  6 years ago (edited)

Again I can't tell if this is a joke but just in case:

Electricity did exist... One of the fundamental forces of the Universe is electromegnetism, and we've known and been able to see (and sometimes feel) lightning - pure electricity. It's a tangible thing we just took time to understand and control.

What's tangible about Qi? Nothing. And even if we put that aside, an old man with a stick is not a scientific approach to 'prove' anything.

给你一点,你就可以飞升上神!长生不老

目前人类的科学还没有发达到发现“Qi”的程度,但我相信它的存在。
“Qi”这个说法好别扭……我想要吃点黄芪补补“Qi”!气血不足,请用黄芪当归汤补补,哈哈O(∩_∩)O哈哈~另外,我正在学中医。我们要相信科学。

有时候,真正的科学和传统医学的混合物可能是有益的。 祝你学习顺利!

谢谢!

chock full of bizarre spiritual gibberish written in a way that makes it hard for people to question and boring enough to prevent people from trying.
This is so accurate ! It's way better to spend research time on actual treatements than to spend it checking for bizarre claims. Personally i think when people lose hope to be cured with modern medicine, they turn to alternatives . Rumors+lies+manipulations+false hopes+poor education = believing in anything. It's very good to enlighten people from time to time, Impressive article :)

Many indeed feel if they have nothing else to lose, why not try ALL options. This, I suppose, is fair enough - it's the ones that try alternative medicine first and then end up dead because it was then too late for real treatment, they are the issue.

That being said, if fake doctors stopped wasting billions on false hopes and put it towards real science, those 'nothing else to lose' patients might stand a better chance by now... sigh.

Thanks for stopping by =)

  ·  6 years ago (edited)

Yes! The wonders of chemotherapy, xanax, and proloft is really something to be proud of!

Treating the symptoms, and not understanding the underlying cause of disease, is a fantastic development in modern medicine!

Ah, materialist reductionist science. How Westerners should be proud of all their cancer, heart disease, type 2 diabetes, anxiety, and depression in the wake of modern medicine!

It really is awe inspiring.

Chi, qi, prana, whatever you want to call it, is electromagnetic energy, and it is very real. Scientific tests have been done on the likes of Mantak Chia and sceptics tried to 'debunk' John Chang (see below) to no avail.

Instead of limiting yourself to a reductionist materialist worldview, you should actually try practising some of the meditation techniques involved in Taoism. Maybe when you've actually directly experienced something as profound as a kundalini awakening, and felt this electrical energy moving throughout your own body, you'll see just how closed and narrow-minded you were in your 'scientific' research.

This is a pretty poor argument. You're saying the burden of proof isn't on you, but me, to explain how magic is real. Generally speaking, people who post YouTube videos as evidence are crackpot conspiracy nuts. Not to offend but I just mean I can't use this as some legitimacy while you quote 'scientific research' with nothing to back up yourr claims other than 'I said so and you should actually try it yourself'.

I'm sure you feel many things but people see UFO's dozens of times a day around the world too. Mostly in the USA, oddly.

Anyway come back with an actual argument perhaps

bioelectromagnetism? And I was thinking they'll group it under metaphysics though.
It's so amazing how people have so much believed in Qi. I once read of a Shaolin monk that was said to be able to master mind over matter; and could focus his Qi to influence his surroundings - like controlling temperatures and forming shields against attacks.

you can take a look at this video. Qi was demonstrated in a controlled environment by a Shoalin master in Fight Science and was able to form a shield against spear just by Qi (though it defied the laws of science)

PS: Jump to 20:00mins of the video. That's where it was featured

Unrelated question: Between "Qi" and "Chi", which one is correct?

Wow that guy was amazing! Well consider me a convert and get me a bottle of QI!

I suppose it is metaphysics to some degree, but more... metapseudophysics

Lol. Qi now comes in bottles? 😵

One has proven this, just one doesn't have test to give you so it can be proven to you.

You have to do your own research and experiments and results.

I also have another human that has already done thus to confirm ones findings and that is at best I can explain in such a short comment, and there is not enough space im this ssection to fully explain.

So you're saying... what, exactly? There is proof but you can't be bothered to share it with me and it's up to me to do your work for you? Cheers but I'm a busy guy!

Haha, that is not what I am saying at all. One is stating that, I can tell you but that will not prove it to you and that it could take years of research before even experiencing what one is stating.

What you speak about I use in every moment, I have also completely healed with vibration alone. This energy which is all energy, is in all things. It is equal always with itself. No energy is greater than any other energy, just different levels of magnitude.

The fact that you thought I wouldn't share has to do more with you then it does the stranger you are currently speaking to. All one does is share this info and on my page pretty much everything I have posted is about the connections one has made. Which this energy is one of many things one has proven.

Safe it to say as a fact that this is a brainwashed society of thousands of years, and thus this is the reason why there is a debate at all on this subject or any subject really as all subjects easily connect and agree with all other subjects.

One has proven this, stating this doesn't prove it to you.

Likewise if you are looking for the truth and thought you already had an idea when you started, then you only fell into a deeper pit of lies.

I could type for hours about how that energy you think doesn't existence does and how that energy is actually you. The consciousness that you are which is spirit which is energy. The human body is an illusion created to experience what we know to be reality.

I hope this explanation is enough to prove that I will never want to with hold information, one just knows you still have to do your own research as I can not just guve you my experience that has allowed me to prove these things.

Also the system that is will never want me in a position of to much influence as I am currently destroying the reality we have all agreed to be put into.

Until ones accept that this is a slave race and has been our whole existence and it is a mental slavery that leads to the seemingly physical enslavement.

I hope this is a better explanation, and one that still doesn't even scratch the surface of what the truth is.

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In medicine, whenever a person is sick, a rebalancing of Qi is all that's needed to find a cure. In practice, this means a Chinese doctor will typically address the balance of Qi as the core of the illness, and dismisses real medicine as only treating the symptoms. As stated before, if you are suffering heartburn, you might try something red like a strawberry because the colour red is associated with the heart which is a Yin organ. There's too much Yin making things off-balance, so bringing it back will cure your heartburn.

Hmm never knew this before. Probably one reason why the China have good doctors. I know medicine is not a thing for all, how about balancing Qi energy?

Can't tell if you're joking or genuine...

Lol @eurogee, you're laughing at what ain't funny. I probably maybe a comedian

What's funny is subjective. To me, it's very funny. Hence, I laughter my heart out. Lol

Good to know of your feelings of a sense of humour in my facts, even if i never meant it.

你去修炼一下,估计可以长生不老!

It sounds funny?

Kinda comparing the study of medicine to that of Qi. It isn't like general medicine which is everywhere.
I mean the Chinese treatment of illnesses is unique, using the Qi energy balancing technique.

This whole article is explaining how Qi energy doesn't exist and is nonsense - I changed the sentence you quoted to clarify that I'm not stating that as a fact, but as a supposition

练气入体是练气的关键,是在于气的质量和如何练气入体,最简单的方法就是呼吸,但很多人的呼吸都不均匀,而最均匀的呼吸就是在睡眠状态下,所以此时人的身体能得到休息,精神能变得强大,而一个专注于练气的人不论是白天或者黑夜都是可以进入最佳状态,并且不同的练气方法也会有不同效果,练气的环境也有不同影响。练气就是练习不同的呼吸,并且节奏的掌控,和在呼吸的同时必须气随心走,并且心无杂念,这是最重要的,练气之后的效果很多人可能觉得应该是很神奇,其实不是的,就和普通人一样,不过是在身体健康,力气,跑步时比较强大,没有传说中飞天,反正我目前没见到,但不代表没有,也许是气的质量不同,这倾向于科研方面,也许呼吸另一种人类可以接受的气,又或者空气的配比和古代时候不一样,当然,这都只是猜测,有能力的话可以尝试在不同环境进行一种有节奏的呼吸方式,假以时日,会有意想不到的效果!

  ·  6 years ago (edited)

Sorry my Chinese isn't good enough to go through all of this!

这太难了!

Can you understand what I'm saying?

Only little bits of the Chinese I'm afraid

I'm not good at English, so it's a little hard to translate.

Richard Nixon reportedly witnessed open-heart surgery being performed in Asia without anesthetics. Acupuncture is used effectively in modern times and that's all that really matters. Pain relief effects are generally attributed to endorphin production though we don't really know for sure how it works. We do know that major insurance companies cover acupuncture treatments, and they don't throw money around lightly. If we study the process scientifically, we're sure to discover the 'qi' eventually.

Lmao 😂

I'm not sure if Nixon was the most trustworthy source...

We have studied it... extensively. In fact after 3,000 large and in depth studies on acupuncture , groups started to call for the research to be stopped because after so many thousands, not a single strip of eviidence reliably concludes it's more than just a placebo. I'dd say 3,000 is plenty...

Anyone who calls for research to be stopped has issues. There are tens of thousands of practitioners in this country alone - never mind in China. Your Big Pharma buddies are the ones doing the 'research'. No wonder it was inconclusive

  ·  6 years ago (edited)

Eh... Before you start defending your already established position before you even read this, perhaps you should read this post, but also make sure to read the entire series that this is only the most recent episode on. I've delved into the research and the practices for months now in great depth. It's not inconclusive.

Groups are calling research to be stopped because its a literal waste of financial resources. Would you want research to continue on how many eyes humans have? I assume not, because it's already pretty well establishedd that a regular healthy human has 2 eyes. Or maybe you're a proponent of the third, mind's eye and suggest we research that, too.

To be helpful, I'll start you off:

Adding the mysticism of Qi doesn't justify the mass and constant failings of their medical practices, I'm afraid. Saying we just can't detect it yet doesn't negate any of the above, all of which are built entirely on the philosophy of Qi

I can see your point, but you have to admit that health insurance companies paying for acupuncture says a great deal about whether or not it works in practice.

An excellent book on this subject is called Spark in the Machine, written by a western practitioner who also does acupuncture. After successfully treating ER patients with needles he was asked by his superiors to stop because they were afraid he'd undermine confidence in the western treatments.

I have been treated with needles, both successfully and not. I was impressed how well it worked, so I started borrowing books from my practitioner to find out why it worked. Most of them were a joke, but Spark in the Machine discusses the piezoelectric properties of the collagen component of the organic fascia tissue. It's a breakthrough idea that deserves more attention. It even explains why our facial bones (and others) develop the way they do, and it explains why motion therapy can be so beneficial.

The book also mentions how Mao decided to lump acupuncture in with TCM where it had been a separate discipline in the past. TCM is an institution now and you're right - it shouldn't be blindly trusted because it's managed for profit.

Nor should it be coarsely dismissed. All the really effective drugs we have are analogs of naturally occurring treatments. Aspririn, SSRIs and opiates wouldn't exist without Willow trees, St. John's Wart and poppy flowers.

Spark in the Machine follows the course of a single human ovum cell dividing into two, then four cells before eventually producing cells that distinguish themselves (bone cells vs skin cells vs muscle cells) from each other in order to shed light on the unseen aspects of our biology as an introduction to Qi.

The piezoelectric quality of collagen, which is a major component of the organic fascia tissue is likely affected by the needles in a way that stimulates healthy cell functions, and that's the best explanation I've seen for why acupuncture works. If research scientists can't corroborate this effect - its because they don't really want to

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I think it's popular here now because the waiting rooms are just so damned crowded all day every day, and you can move people through quicker whilst making a tidy profit if you can prescribe insect dick rather than taking the time to accurately diagnose and heal someone.

That's literally how and why Mao brought it back into the mainstream - not enough real doctors for the people so if they can mix their own shit with tea leaves and paprika to fix their epilepsy, more power to them!

The North Korean mysteriously vanished shortly after

I smell a conspiracy.

But it's probably just the poo tea.


I think it's good when scientists study claims that would appear to be ridiculous, cos that shows that science cares about the truth and is not ideologically predisposed. Examples of such scientists would be western scientists who study ESP etc. (at least after Randi taught them how not to get fooled).

However, the scientists you mention don't seem to be of that ilk, but rather seem like converts who don't consider all possible confounding explanations.

I wish there were more Randis.

I sometimes wonder if scientists are paid to give up their dignity and just go along way it. I bet there are some. It must be hard being trained for so many years and still have the blindfolds on... There are plenty of randi replacements I can think of!

Are there? To me he was like Carl Sagan. There's yet anyone to fill his shoes, though poor-men's sagans and randis exist.

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  ·  6 years ago Reveal Comment