Migrating Bitcoin onto the BTS DEX via UIA snapshot/sharedrop?

stan (71) · 7 years ago (edited)

Nice writeup. We are serious about this... unless someone can talk us out of it in the next 24 hours the PR team will be unleashed.

Anyone with solid information about how the other altBTCs will perform in transaction time, transactions per second, governance, and other features please educate us here. I want to make a comparison table.

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15 votes

cm-steem (67) · 7 years ago (edited)

Updated the post to be more accurate & included a brief feature/spec comparison table.

I think that if possible, it's a great idea! If we can improve documentation and procedures for performing this snapshot/sharedrop for an UIA we'll likely begin a trend of cryptocurrencies upgrading their technology in this same manner!

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6 votes

stan (71) · 7 years ago

Awesome work! What a way to dramatize the differences!

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steem360 (40) · 7 years ago

Yes, and assuming that Bitshares 3.0 will run on EOS, each migrated project will benefit from parallel processing and unlimited TX/sec.

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sevenstars (49) · 7 years ago

Exactly my thoughts. EOS tech brings value to Steem and Bitshares. In Dan's talk about EOS he talked about needing to increase the tx per second into the millions range.

I think Bitshares might be the most undervalued crypto on the market right now.

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michaelx (61) · 7 years ago

@cm-steem - @stan and I are ALL over this.

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johnsmith (64) · 7 years ago (edited)

This is the best thing that could happen to Bitcoin and crypto. Solves all scaling, centralization and useability issues instantly. Please, please do this!

If you haven't used Bitshares or the DEX yet I can tell you that if Bitcoin worked like Bitshares it would increase the adoption rate 1000000000% practically overnight. You could send/confirm Bitcoin in three (3) seconds and it would be a very useable currency.

Bitcoin could do 10,000 transactions per second right now, scale to 100,000 TPS in a matter of days if needed and then, when Bitshares migrates to EOS, scale indefinitely.

And then there's the exchange. Never again would anyone be Goxed, no Polo random disabling of token withdrawals. You can keep your coins in your wallet, which is the same as the exchange. It is what crypto is meant to be.

Bitcoin currently wastes millions if not billions of dollars worth of electricity to provide security via POW mining, which is completely unnecessary. A few years ago it was unknown whether DPOS was viable, but at 800,000 operations/transactions per day DPOS is working much, much better than POW. This would allows us to stop polluting and wasting electricity and get rid of the mining cartel!

Instead of wasting billions on electricity, Bitshares collects transaction revenue in a reserve pool and uses it to pay for maintenance and development. This would allow the Bitcoin core developers to be paid a fair wage for their work, directly from the reserve pool (currently worth tens of millions of dollars!). Bitshares would convert Bitcoin's mining waste into productive wages for the community.

And finally, buying HEROs (Honest Economics Reclaiming Our Sovereignty) on the DEX gives you a built in 5% savings account. Just deposit by buying HERO with BTC and your value is safe (no dumping!) and grows at 5%.

Just... yes!

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5 votes

flashbid (42) · 7 years ago

What's the best case scenario for this to happen? What is the least harmful way for us to get away from the present bitcoin situation without getting massacred by the kamikaze's and jihadis running the show with bitcoin right now?

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https://steemit.com/bitcoin/@stan/bitcoin-united-btc-u-offers-3-second-confirmations-and-massive-throughput

stan (71) · 7 years ago (edited)

It is happening now.

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flashbid (42) · 7 years ago

RIght on, thanks

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surpassinggoogle (76) · 7 years ago

How does one get private keys for individual assets and in this case bitcoin from bts dex? And when it said snapshot in the post above, does it mean like a prtscreen or snippet from my own PC?

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dutch (61) · 7 years ago (edited)

I think the idea is fantastic, especially switching from POW to DPOS as it provides a much more fair governance system that can't be controlled with excessive hardware. Better for the planet too!

Would you plan to issue entirely new coins in no way connected to the original chain to prevent replay attacks? If so, scaling to the intended 21 million would be increasingly meaningless as a good proportion of those coins are likely to be lost and there is no tie back to the originals anyway.

The other argument against scaling to 21 million would be the infaltion you mentioned. If people are looking for stability and perceived value in the various post-split chains, this would give the DEX BTC an edge.

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cm-steem (67) · 7 years ago

I think the idea is fantastic, especially switching from POW to DPOS as it provides a much more fair governance system that can't be controlled with excessive hardware.

Indeed, no more centralized dev/mining groups limiting the token.

Better for the planet too!

Yep, a massive reduction in energy footprint (less deaths caused by pollution than traditional BTC).

Would you plan to issue entirely new coins in no way connected to the original chain to prevent replay attacks?

Yeah the idea would be to import your private keys which wouldn't be different between the BTC forks.

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dutch (61) · 7 years ago

Sounds like we should be buying up BTS while it's cheap before things really take off!

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3 votes

flashbid (42) · 7 years ago

Very Interesting and informative. All of it points to a huge setback for mainstream adoption, there are some of us who are already convinced that alt coins will remain a dark web techie nerdy thing and this type of situations is the cause of it. I honestly believe that this is Bitcoins last chance, if they screw this up they will be totally replaced. The fact that there is a consensus mechanism and such weight exerted by those who are heavily invested in mining brings us back to some of the problems we want to avoid with Fiat!!

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cm-steem (67) · 7 years ago

I honestly believe that this is Bitcoins last chance, if they screw this up they will be totally replaced.

It's only a matter of time before Bitcoin is replaced by a superior cryptocurrency at the #1 marketcap spot. Once it loses its #1 place, I don't doubt that there would be an exodus of users to 'alternative' cryptocurrencies, away from BTC.

The fact that there is a consensus mechanism and such weight exerted by those who are heavily invested in mining brings us back to some of the problems we want to avoid with Fiat!!

Indeed, mining is massively centralized now.

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flashbid (42) · 7 years ago

But that's my main concern, Bitcoin has come to represent BlockChain technology. Most people don't even know what blockchain is they just know Bitcoin or have heard of it, this is the reason why I'm dumbfounded by the idiocy of this community at times. It seems like they are willing to loose the whole war in attempt to win an impossible skirmish, are we truly at their mercy? with mining centralized there really isn't much from keeping a "government" entity to exert pressure on a specific mining group that controls x percentage of the block's traffic...

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knowtheropes (37) · 7 years ago

I love it! And think I like the idea of issuing the planned supply. Keep us informed on progress!

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marchesejp (51) · 7 years ago

Amazing! So in the end the BTC fork will have a great outcome, BTC processed with BTS speed not bad!!

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3 votes

ash (73) · 7 years ago (edited)

It's a great idea, but find a way without a hardfork.

would be cool if there was a wizard bot setup, like byteball, that let's you setup an account and you can link btc addresses via signed message.

this would be more centralized, however, Assets need more functions anyways. such as "lock max amount".

here's how I imagine Bot contact:

Hello

One second...
Here's your BitShares Account: Acc - Password
LINKS TO WALLET
Make sure to backup your credentials
Just paste your Bitcoin Address to link

BTC ADR

Please sign a message: kgjltzjhelhi

Signed

Thanks! 5 BTC linked, you received 5 BTCINSTA (BTCi)

$3.14

5 votes

cm-steem (67) · 7 years ago (edited)

It's a great idea, but find a way without a hardfork.

Graphene based cryptos are far more capable of implementing hardfork/mandatory changes than BTC is, we already have several other hardfork worthy changes in BTS' roadmap, we could throw in the change during one of these upgrade periods.

Take Steem for example, they've performed 19 HFs successfully thus far!

would be cool if there was a wizard bot setup, like byteball, that let's you setup an account and you can link btc addresses via signed message.
this would be more centralized, however, Assets need more functions anyways. such as "lock max amount".

This would be centralized though with a counterparty/middleman risk & we would need to monitor signed transactions on one or many Bitcoin split blockchains for a long period of time (unless there was a limited period of time to claim the tokens?).

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ash (73) · 7 years ago

Graphene based cryptos are far more capable of implementing hardfork/mandatory changes than BTC

With the exception that you need stakeholder approval, after that you need witnesses and proxies to play along, if witnesses do not play with you, they need to be changed.

to make it short: I can barely see this passing stakeholder voting stage.

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cm-steem (67) · 7 years ago (edited)

Why do you believe this kind of a change (enabling the snapshot/sharedrop of an UIA against an external crypto) would not pass the stakeholder voting stage?

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Let's talk about this idea during the Bitshares Hangout this friday

cm-steem (67) · 7 years ago

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cm-steem (67) · 7 years ago

"Bitcoin United Offers 3 Second Confirmations & 10,000 Transactions Per Second On August 1" - HuffingtonPost

Like/Upvote/Retweet:

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huffingtonpost.com/entry/bitcoin-… …

twitterbot (56) · 7 years ago

FractalNode tweeted @ 21 Jul 2017 - 01:14 UTC

#Bitcoin United Offers 3 Second Confirmations & 10,000 Transactions Per Second On August 1

#Bitshares $CNY $USD

Disclaimer: I am just a bot trying to be helpful.

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surpassinggoogle (76) · 7 years ago

So if one had bitcoin on bitshares dev august one, will he get original bitcoin, bitcoin cash and bitcoin uia?

and if one has his bitcoin on bts dex before august 1, is it automatic to get some bts or will he need to go through the tech steps that you enlisted?

This article ranked on google for; what will happen to bitcoin of bts dex in the event of a split. Like first page but result number 6 or 7

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kichen (50) · 7 years ago

Anyway we can get rid of all the miners and electric waste I'm down. Besides I'm the type of person who wants my money quickly, I don't like to make games out of checking account balances everyday to see what's still pending. Props to the bitshares team

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tonypeacock (57) · 7 years ago

I am so glad to be a part of Bitshares. Great people and leading edge technology.

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hr1 (59) · 7 years ago

Isn't the issuer of the UIA a central authority? Can't the issuer issue new tokens as they will?

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9 votes

cm-steem (67) · 7 years ago

Once fully configured, the issuer could transfer ownership of the UIA to either the committee or to null, so as to prevent centralized authority risk.

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dtworker (55) · 7 years ago

Yes, it is, central authority.

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arcange (73) · 7 years ago

Congratulations @cm-steem!
Your post was mentioned in my hit parade in the following category:

Pending payout - Ranked 6 with $ 291,14

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PS
Useful discussion/thread about handling the possible splits and forks on BitcoinTalk, started by Theymos

yefet (56) · 7 years ago

it would sound a bit cynical but it's the true of life - free money is always welcome :)
So come on, do it

but Bitcoin is like the Highlander - There can be only one :)

In the foreseeable future it will be the same coin based on Nakamoto code, so do not waste time & money as no one outside BitShares community would support it.

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cm-steem (67) · 7 years ago

but Bitcoin is like the Highlander - There can be only one :)

So we don't name it after Bitcoin, we rebrand the token yet keep the BTC distribution.

In the foreseeable future it will be the same coin based on Nakamoto code, so do not waste time & money as no one outside BitShares community would support it.

No it wouldn't, it'd be an User Issued Asset, none of the BTC code/functionality/blockchain/mechanisms would be carried over, simply the current asset distribution. There would be very little support required for the UIA once issued, users could import their keys to claim years later without issue.

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yefet (56) · 7 years ago (edited)

@cm-steem

Hi, I'm talking about actual Bitcoin, not your UIA :)
tl;dr
I see no point in issuing an asset with little to no support among current Bitcoin users, but airdrop hunters :)

PS
the use case is the key, what would be the use case for the proposed "Bitcoin" UIA?
BitShares now has a huge challenging project, HERO, better stick with it, I think

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cm-steem (67) · 7 years ago

I see no point in issuing an asset with little to no support among current Bitcoin users, but airdrop hunters :)

Considering we've only begun talking about the idea in the last two days & not seriously attempted to reach out to BTC users yet, I think it's premature to assume that this kind of an UIA wouldn't have any kind of support.

The use case is the key, what would be the use case for the proposed "Bitcoin" UIA?

Primarily as a method of drawing Bitcoin users to the BTS DEX & proving the technological superiority of BTS over BTC.

BitShares now has a huge challenging project, HERO, better stick with it, I think

Considering there are thousands of assets issued on the BTS DEX, we shouldn't as a community focus on only one token.

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aroyl (52) · 7 years ago

Thank you for the information you provided.
I am a newcomer to the bitcoin world.
I just 6 months to know what is bitcoin.
This information is very useful for me.
So I am not wrong in making decisions going forward.
My @aroyl will always wait for the latest information about bitcoin from you.

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appledeguzman (41) · 7 years ago

thanks for that info... im actually wondering whats with aug 1.,

and that explains it all... im still learning so eveytime im confused im looking for answer and explanation.... and you help me with this aug 1 issue....

deffinitely follow you... i know i can find answer on your posts.... thanks

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kishore1988 (51) · 7 years ago

good post

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awpmaster (47) · 7 years ago

Very interesting brother

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rustyshackleford (36) · 7 years ago

"claimable via import of private key at a later date"

Uh, no thanks. Claimable via signature signing would be safer.

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cm-steem (67) · 7 years ago

Then you introduce a middleman to the balance claiming procedure though.. If you're concerned you could simply transfer your tokens out of the addresses prior to the private key import.

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knight101 (38) · 7 years ago

If BTC UIA is not mineable I see no need to increase volume over time. Set at 21 million, inflation out the door and a educate the people.

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johnsmith (64) · 7 years ago

Yes, great idea!

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cm-steem (67) · 7 years ago

Why advance forwards to the 21m instead of simply taking the current coinsupply as the fixed max coinsupply for a new UIA though?

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stan (71) · 7 years ago

That's what we did.

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jamie-smith (51) · 7 years ago

this post is very informative. I find it valuable when I see a post with important info about changing alt coin values and whatnot. I'll be following and upvoting!

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akraees (35) · 7 years ago

I think may be the idea iz fantastic, especially switching from P.O.W to D.P.O.S

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maruharraca (57) · 7 years ago

Thanks for the information!

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kusnibeni (48) · 7 years ago

thanks for the information

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investorlife (25) · 7 years ago

Very Interesting and informative!!! :D

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jheygomez (54) · 7 years ago

Very interesting post.. I like it.

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abue (45) · 7 years ago

😊☺

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dkinx (36) · 7 years ago

follow for follow @dkinx

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jackyx2clic (38) · 7 years ago

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funkit (60) · 7 years ago

There is already a btc uia. It mimics the name of openBTC. And is most probably worthless. No trade for months.

Do not buy uia assets unless you know what they are. 99% of them are shit.

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cm-mobile (41) · 7 years ago

Was this btc Uia you mention distributed against bitcoin holders? If not its not really comparable to this idea..

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funkit (60) · 7 years ago

Since it probably is worthless, it doesn't matter how it got distributed. I have dirty laundry? Interested? Dustballs? Get some!

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cm-steem (67) · 7 years ago

Technically it will be far superior to the current bitcoin alternatives in terms of security, energy efficiency, maintainability, fees, etc.

If you believe it'll be worthless then please do dump it when it's sharedropped, I'll look forwards to cheap coins! ;D

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hattaarshavin (74) · 7 years ago

thank you share information @cm-steem
follow me @hattaarshavin

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