RE: who controls the knowledge and why...

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who controls the knowledge and why...

in christian •  8 years ago 

Well, I don't have the Greek to follow all you've said here, so it's going to take me a while to search it all out. Actually, all the Greek I have is from memorizing the alphabet in college:)

I do have some initial thoughts on some of this though. First, I think you are forcing some interpretations on a few things. Like the flood and Sodom and Gomorrah, lake of fire, etc. being eternal. It is one way to look at it to say it's eternal because it lasts forever, but you could look at it as eternal as in final. There's no coming back from it, ever.

In that sense, the lake of fire doesn't have to punish eternally because the punishment itself is eternal. The lake of fire existing eternally doesn't need to imply that those cast into it do.

Also, I think it's possible to look at some of the extreme statements of inclusion as hyperbole instead of literal. Like, wipe every tear. If you stretched that to its literal extreme that means every tear ever cried by anyone ever. It could just mean every tear for those left. Similarly with mankind, I think. I've got to do some digging on that one.

However the bible does say some things will be everlasting or eternal that clearly won't be. Israel's possession of the promised land is said to be everlasting, but later it is tied to obedience. God judges them and removes them. The Aronic priesthood is said to be everlasting, but My reading of Hebrews seems to imply the old priesthood is done away with. Same with the Day of Atonement; it's said to be an everlasting statute, or law.

As for the flood, it seems like a picture of the new creation. God destroyed the Earth, then renewed it. He didn't bring back all the people destroyed, though. He started over with Noah and his family.

Ephesians 2:8 - This one causes a whole lot of problems if you try to think through all the implications. Some do form a theology of a capricious God who just picks some people to burn in hell forever. I don't think that works, though, if you're looking at Jesus as the perfect representation of God's character. I like Wesley's idea of Prevenient Grace, where God gives everyone the grace to be able to believe. I don't really think He's going to toss everyone out who couldn't come to faith because they didn't ever hear the Gospel, or had some other physiological or emotional barrier to it. I tend to think at the resurrection there will be some sort of purification for those people.

I have some real problems with the idea that people who actively reject God and instead turn to evil not facing justice. I don't think it's being capricious to think Hitler, Mao, Pol Pot, etc. will face Justice. I have a hard time reconciling how people whose lives have been destroyed by evil people will live in the new creation holding hands with the guy who raped and tortured them and never repented.

I do appreciate your insight, and I'm going to study it further. Whatever I think, I want it to be in line with what the bible teaches, and with what the Holy Ghost leads me to.

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hello and sorry for taking so long to get back to you... had a RAM failure, just plugged the new ones in.

I'll try to answer you later today or tomorrow. I have a lot of work to catch up on.

cheers

Bob