A community’s ability to self-govern can be judged by the safety of its members. When you can leave your doors unlocked and not worry about breaking and entering, then you know you live in a solid community. When you can leave your wallet unattended in a public place and not have it stolen, when you can leave your bike unlocked, then you know you have good governance.
In a world where every door is impenetrable, every wallet locked down, and every bike secured a community doesn’t know whether there is good governance or not. Without the freedom to “be bad” there is no ability to know whether people are choosing to “be good”. In such a community it is likely an unlocked bike will be stolen and unattended wallet pilfered.
When a community resorts to stronger and stronger locks it has a much bigger fundamental problem and no one is really safe. Such a community relies on the strength of its security technology against the strength of the bad guys. This is a never ending arms race and it creates a “blame the victim” mentality.
This is the attitude the cryptocurrency community has adopted whenever there is a hack. It is the victim's fault for not using multi-sig, for forgetting his password, for not having a hardware wallet, or for not auditing their smart contract. This is not a community that respects property rights, this is a community that has embraced hacker-might makes right.
A truly safe community respects property rights without requiring everyone to live in a prison of inconvenient security measures. Aggression is not attempted because the community recognizes the crime and cooperates to deny the attacker their profits and their place in the community.
Privacy Chains prevent Good Governance
Many blockchains are focusing on improving the ability for criminals to hide their profits by reducing the ability for the community to identify and remove a bad actor. If this approach were universally adopted the criminal element and organized crime would be much better off.
I am a firm believer in the right of people to use any technology they want so long as they don’t initiate force or fraud against others. The challenge every community faces is how complicit it chooses to be in supporting those who indirectly enable aggression.
For example, if you knowingly buy stolen property and benefit from the discount in price are you in some way complicit in the original act of aggression? If a community tolerates people who buy stolen property, doesn’t that community foster the increased profitability of organized theft? What about someone who is 2x or 3x removed from the original aggression? What about someone who buys something that only has a 50% chance of being stolen? What if a community profits from crypto-currency gains financed by demand from unbanked criminals?
By this same virtue, a community which facilitates the theft and laundering of stolen property is also facilitating and enabling acts of aggression. This is not a recipe for creating a free society that respects property rights. This is a recipe for creating a dog-eat-dog economy of hackers, thieves, and digital kidnappers.
Good Governance and Steem
Steem has excellent security on accounts, but very poor governance. The community reward pool is the preverbal wallet on the park bench. Those who are voting for themselves and hiding behind pseudo-anonymous accounts are thieves stealing from the community. Those censoring posts on EOS through use of down votes of posts that decline rewards are not held accountable to community standards of behavior.
With proper governance the Steem reward pool would not be pilfered for private gain. Achieving this requires much stronger transparency with identity verification and dispute resolution systems combined with incentive structures that disincentives self-voting (like n2 curve).
Freedom of Expression
Some people worry that absent anonymity, people would self-censor out of fear of community reprisal. There is a legitimate need for anonymous publishing, but it has no place in a community that is distributing financial rewards from the public purse. Steem is an exercise in massively decentralized community governance over community funds. Transparency and accountability is the only disinfectant that can prevent abuse.
There is no reward curve or solution to abuse of community funds until a proper dispute resolution system and identity system is put in place.
The Future of Crypto Governance
I will be moving toward transparent blockchains with strong identity, good governance, and a commitment to protect property rights while disempowering those who would launder profits from digital kidnapping. We must take responsibility and hold others accountable for indirect acts of aggression. Hiring someone else to steal for you (knowingly buying stolen goods) is just as bad as stealing yourself.
Replying to some comment with all “your” suggestions.
You told me twice, in 2016 and 2017, SMTs were a bad idea, “because there can only be one global currency”, before going off to market multi currencies in your new project. Now you’re back to propose microscopic changes to the STEEM rewards contract. There is no need for forcing these proposals in the face of SMTs.
Contributed from my iPhone. Please excuse grammatical mistakes and errors.
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Hi ned,
I told you 2 months ago, that the Steem Economic System is currently completly broken
And by the way, where is the app your "CTO" promised for December?
Don't get me wrong. I know that IT projects are usually not delivered in time. But as Investor into STEEM I expect that late deliveries are communicated.
Please update the timeline for the major milestones of your roadmap (currently SMT, APP, Communities) for instance on a monthly basis. That would increase the trust in your team massively.
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Hes is not the CTO, remember ?
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ned specified that he is a Private Contractor, rofl and they have no control over him or his actions.
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That's ridiculous. If that were true why does steemit inc pay him? Obviously private contractors are under the control of those who contracted them in order to get something done. Why else would a contractor be hired?
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Just clarifying, you know I am referring to Sneak right?
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The way you two interact @dan & @ned with each other is exactly the same way as to how a divorce couple interacts with each other after being married for more than 10 years 😂😂😂
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They also have at least two common children - Steem and Steemit 😂
What is the number one parenting advice? Never argue with your (ex)spouse in front of children. Both parents will always lose a little bit of respect and authority in the eyes of a child.
Children usually loves both of parents - they are feeling uncomfortable seeing own parents fighting.
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Steem and Steemit are their common children and they both love and cherish them
However the problem is about accepting their step-children: SMT, EOS, BTS.. which they need to keep calm and then they can reconsider about their re-marriage..
Their common children needs both parents.. but that is only possible when each can accept the younger step-children :P
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not sure if Bitshares even cares about Ned or Dan, actually. Parents, we're ok, just feel free to act as you wish ;)))
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they could just write an email or call, after working together they should have private means of contacting each other...
Sadly the "vibe" i am getting from Dan is that he is "dissing" his former project Steem to promote his new one...
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Ned, love your work. Please ignore all the whinging replies. I don't think SBD and STEEM would be where they are now with out prospect of SMTs. There are now tons of original content creators earning a living here, not just a select few, and we thank you for that.
I am utterly perplexed as to why anyone is unhappy right now. Work on your blog, work on your network -> make ridiculous money. What's the problem? If you can't make money here with SBD at $9, the problem isn't Steem.
The SMT effect:
![](https://steemitimages.com/640x0/https://steemitimages.com/DQmd5eWdjRpiD5bsNut9u3gCTgsvwfbFYoGM6tXnxcSy3qc/image.png)
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I second that.
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Somehow you are correct! What I am worrying about is the fact that they are printing additional more SBD almost everyday to make the price stabilizes back to $1 USD.
Personally, I am from South East Asia and I can quit my day job and focus more on Steem if I get a gross total amount of $5 per day on multiple posts. But what if the SBD price gets back to normal? It's going to be a hard time earning a living.
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The discussion is about building a better community long-term, not about making more money short-term.
Market is in a bull run right now so posts are more profitable currently but overall profitability doesn't imply fairness in reward pool distribution.
Working on your blog/network may give you ridiculous amounts of money but self-voting gives you even more, and some folks think that is a problem.
SP renting and self-voting are issues that doesn't go away with a high coin price, in fact they are amplified.
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@ned, although I respect your position, let me say to you as I said below you @dan
At the end of the day I thought steemit was self governed, which means users decide. Its a pity that negative posts and comments get more traction than positive ones.
@ned engaging with negativity will lead to more negativity. However if you could engage with the positive stories on Steemit you could make so much more of a difference
https://steemit.com/gifteconomy/@stellabelle/why-no-one-pays-attention-to-the-gift-economy-and-why-they-look-at-violent-stuff-instead
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There is really no improvement needed other than proper use of steem inc's SP. Misterdelegation has enough SP to empower the community against large stackholders using their SP and not following community standards.
I am actually a bit glad that you came out of twitter to post this here.
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How is consensus reached for what community standards are and where are community standards posted?
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Steemcleaners community standards is pretty much accepted by all the big guys. Try violating that and they will go after you. Haejin wasn't shut down because what he did didn't explicitly constitute violation of anti abuse community standards.
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Interesting that you can make almost $500 by by commenting on your OWN platform @ned...
Seems like THIS was the way you all could've "Paid" yourselves for building SteemIt, instead of Pilfering the platform right out of the gate. The Pilfering of the economy is the only real problem here, not the way the voting works. When you imbalanced the economy in this way, you made a very powerful Plutocracy... what did you expect would happen?
~Frank
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You mean stake weighted voting is causing an imbalance? I do agree. It’s like scrabble where every time you create a word you get to play the next turn with more letters (than the seven letters you used to be permitted per turn). New players show up but can never catch those who began earlier who win more and more easily. Unlike n^2, players in linear at least don’t win more and more easily. Nevertheless, to counter this “imbalance” I am working on identity driven Oracles in SMTs to enable token systems that are analogous to scrabble games where everyone begins on equal footing, has the same number of letters to play each turn and the game ends/starts over predictably.
Contributed from my iPhone. Please excuse grammatical mistakes and errors.
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Nice strategy @ned. Explore the promise of the original sandbox through blueprints of autonomous extensions (SMT) without unduly interfering with the status quo - a good tack.
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Sounds good! Where is the official website for SMT? I am wondering if there is some kind of airdrops.
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https://smt.steem.io/
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I don’t know if you’re already familiar with Steemify but reading in your comment, your contribution coming from an iPhone, perhaps you might be interested in a dedicated notification app for iPhone users only called Steemify, we as @blockbrothers build this app. Just download it for free and never miss out on any notification anymore!
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Every your comment = one $iPhone.
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I am only in my infancy of understanding crypto and steemit, but I am learning more and more daily, thank you for contributing!
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I think preventing large stakeholders from being able to "win" easily is much less critical than making sure they only win when the whole community wins. A longer vesting schedule might help with that, and I favor curation penalties as well so that regularly voting against strong stakeholder quality consensus has a cost.
Whether people mainly vote for quality or just to reward themselves will determine whether Steem devolves into a Ponzi scheme or not, and I see that as the largest risk for the network.
Once too much stake is held by abusive voters, the only way to recover will be forking them out. The sooner we can stop abuse from being profitable the less likely that is to be necessary.
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I don’t know much about corporations....Question, how many companies allow investors decide how it’s going to operate?
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Short answer: Not many, but it depends on how united and vocal the investors are.
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I always felt the market was the driver, unless there is a monopoly...I am still learning about economic structures, business and different forms of governments. Steemit has driven me to dig deeper. I've read a great deal since 2007, especially different forms of abusive government structures. Thank you @glenabrethsen.
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Perhaps it's time to have a meeting of the minds for the sake of the continuity of this platform and its underlying blockchain. EOS trades over $300M daily and is valued at over $5B - Dan clearly has done something right there. Since his post, steem is up over $1 and its 24 hour trading volume is approaching $20M on CoinMarketCap - over 3X its daily average of around $6M seen over the past few weeks. It's currently trading at just under $4.
Steem does have the potential to be among the top cryptocurrencies but it necessitates self-introspection that ultimately leads to constructive improvements for the benefit of all. As I see it, the price action over the past 24 hours suggests the crypto market was seeking this open discussion and it's an important one to have for rejuvenating confidence, whatever the outcome.
If Steve Jobs and Bill Gates could resolve their differences, maybe both of you can too.
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EOS just did a crowd sale at the right time. It hasn't even launched yet so we cannot know whether it does something right.
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Thanks for the comment. I brought up EOS because the market has clearly voted in favor of it in light of its considerably fast rise in the crypto space to a valuation of over $5B at the time of this post. It has achieved this status in the last few months of this year. Steem has been around since 2016 and is just now finally trading above its all time highs from then.
I understand that blockchain development is still up and coming and we will not realize the full extent or potential of this technology for perhaps many years to come. Nonetheless, I think it is fair to encourage the cofounders of steem and steemit to reconcile for the sake of the community at large. Dan clearly has some insights to offer that the market reacted positively too, in light of steem's value appreciation over the last 24 hours since his post.
This discussion is needed and in my opinion should not spiral down to a "he said, she said" commentary about past disagreements amongst whales, but rather an acknowledgement of what is and isn't being done right and how steemit can ultimately improve for the better moving forward.
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Well, steem is now decisively trading above its previous all time highs from 2016, currently around $5 per Coinmarketcap. Considering the timing and extent of bullish momentum, I have a hard time believing that Dan's post and the resulting discussion weren't the precursors for this renewed buying interest to kick off 2018. The market seems to be in favor of an open dialogue towards improving steemit and by association steem's perception within the crypto space. Steem was trading around $3 when Dan published his comments regarding governance yesterday and the 24 hour trading volume is now over $40M.
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I always imagined "non-linear rewards" to mean sqrt(n) and thought n^2 was a typo.
Have you considered the sqrt(n) approach? It would mean the influence of steam power would have diminishing growth as n increases.
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Exactly, n^2 (n squared) doesn't make sense? Or is n the amount of SP or not?
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Flagging because I do not feel this comment is worth $550. Just a bit of a balancing act.
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SMT's are not going to solve the issues caused by the distribution of Steem. Look at the mess being made by the terror of incompetent, absent or psychopathic whales already. Good whales simply can't keep up. You are only going to compound the effects and potential for harm by building out the steem economy and increasing its complexity on such a terrible foundation. Fix the distribution. We need thousands of engaged whales and zero mega-whales. Power within the Steem economy needs much more balance. Is anything being done? Is there any recognition of this? This economy should be on a journey to being for everyone or it's for no-one. Can you imagine Steem becoming a globally accepted unit of exchange, store of value etc with some of today's whales holding the power they will have, wielding it as they have been? No frickin way bud. Zero chance. All you'll end up with is a fancy feudal-like system. Please tell me how you control the abuse and how long it will take to implement.
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https://steemit.com/eos/@dan/proof-of-good-governance#@ned/re-frankbacon-re-ned-re-dan-proof-of-good-governance-20180101t232544604z
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I read your comment thoroughly ned, thank you. I believe I just about understand what you are hoping to implement with your scrabble analogy. The issue (and I recognise that I am not an expert, far from it) I have is if you successfully create colonies of value within the steem network that can shut out the stake weighting of the supra-token, steem, then doesn't that challenge the value and validity of steem? Why would the majority of steemians even use steem if it were possible for a different token to supplant steem because it acted potentially more fairly and in their interests? Perhaps I just don't comprehend the way SMT's are deployed and operate within Steem. I still believe the bad distribution of steem will continue to negatively affect everything built upon it. A bad whale that is blocked from every other community based around an SMT will still continue to be able to access the reward pool according to the stake weighting.....correct?
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@ned I love your view on things like playing a game. But scrabble? ;-) I was surprised to see on the live communitys that people still play counterstrike and not because it works on all computers like as I was 14 :-D Short rounds, benefits in the long run - 2 partys, fast and easy even for beginners that gain in skill, not in time of being there in the community.
I went in here active a few days ago and I feel all the time as a new guy in a company after 3.5 years of training and it seems like I need or have to "dig into whale asses" to evolve in here not for being diligent or hard work. (In facebook I felt way better at the start) I understand that money gives power but if it is possible what you want to change that only "diggers" could rise up great content creators will pass over time. So if I understand you right, you want to strengthen the fundamental players and creators. That is only possible to share or reduce the power of the big players and has to be done to give this community a future (not by utilizing one new platform after another when the fundamental basement (steemit.com) is rotten)
Thanks for your effort - I hope it pays out for you and the whole community
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Actually, as much as i dont want to admmit it, in a Games Theory perspective, Steemit is not incentivized in making great content, but into acumulating power so its easier to accumulate even more.
I'll explain in Games Theory:
First round:
The whale has strong incentives to post to make money, so he makes content knowing he will win.
The minnow has strong incentives to post to make money, so he makes quality content expecting to win.
Second round (t +1, after publishing):
The whale won more power and more money, now he needs less effort to gain the same amount in the next round. (The more steem power the more visible someone is)
The minnow gained little or nothing after publishing, so he has less incentives to give same effort in the next round, hence, he makes poorer content.
Third round (t + 2, after re-publishing)
The whale gained even more so he needs even less to gain the same amount in the next round.
The minnow gains little or nothing again, so he have incentives chase whales content expecting to get some upvotes.
Fourth round (t +3)
The whale gains even more (now that another little minnow is following him, commenting, etc.) knowing that it doesnt really matter the quality of his content... cus minnows will post and comment expecting his upvotes...
The minnow luckily got something from the whale, so now he has no or very little incentives to create more of his own and original content.
Results:
Poorer and poorer content being rewarded in the platform, and no incentives to do great as a minnow.
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I like the SMT concept and the use of Oracles. I think there should be levels of privacy based on community standards, and I think communities is going to be necessary for Steem to scale because I do not see how everyone will be able to agree with all the decisions that are being made as they is no community consensus on many of these decisions.
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It has been an interesting experiment and I feel the linear reward curve is more beneficial to the community as a whole.
Minds.com is integrating a crypto currency into their platform as another way to get paid. Is there any chance it will be a SMT @ned?
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Hello @ned and @danHappy New Year
We may find some problems in society but there is no system without mistakes
I would like to talk about the idea of proof of personality
This can only be done
Factors that help
Accounts recorded daily on the network and previous accounts are confirmed by mobile and network number rather than numbers and services and phone numbers
You can limit and add two teams. A team is equipped and we make an announcement to raise the balance of the accounts and it is confirmed by the competent team. This will make the stop limit of the counterfeit accounts the factor of assigning the IP numbers to the users.
Good in the community The project is on a wider scale around the world. I am from Egypt and currently the English language is not good but from a year here on the community I see a lot of people around the world here.
There are many ideas and equipment that help the community here
I am very sorry because the subject is too large and it is not right to write some words about it
Dan's brother @dan when the decision was almost 10 months to resign, and the ISO project was opened. The idea is not wrong. Many projects from the community team and independent projects. The problem is that the declaration of resignation in Rae
Happy year for everyone
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Hi @ned,
I realize this post is past payout; but, it is the quickest way I know of to contact you. I've tried maneuvering the Discord chat; but, admit I haven't quite found my way around the site.
This reminds me of a recent suggestion to utopian.io regarding a CONTACT tab added to the blog page. I will leave the link below, even though it was not accepted due to others making a similar recommendation.
The purpose of this communication is to ask that you review a current suggestion I’ve offered to @utopion.io. I hope you will review this contribution; and, give it an up vote if you envision this idea a viable means of growing the Steemit-user base.
https://steemit.com/utopian-io/@spiritualmatters/steemit-referral-bonus-great-incentive-for-generating-new-users
Btw, here’s the link to the post regarding the Contact tab:
https://steemit.com/utopian-io/@spiritualmatters/contact-tab-needed-for-professional-use-in-steem-community
Many thanks in advance!
Peace.
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I was writing about different problem. It is lack of functionality on steemit. We need some categories inside blog, so if someone is looking for something he can find fast. And we need some different approach with exposed posts. In 2 years there is almost no way, someone will show his original post with great content among all this shit posts with load of upvotes. I am right now struggling with my followers and a lot of people are asking me, how come I don't have more followers etc... Yes of course I am gaining every day. It is slow peace, but after 2 years when this will be billion community, then is no way someone will swim to the surface.
Well, mine 50c and if someone is for my debate about steemit future, please reed it here
https://steemit.com/steemit/@wnfdiary/how-to-make-steemit-futureproff
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excellent debate. At least we can watch day-to-day debates between the founders!! Keep growing Steem
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This is the largest comment upvote i have seen on steemit..awesome.
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@ned what type of iphone are you using?..i @smokeasare165 am using iphone 5. (Please it a funny comment i mean no harm)
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Exactly, n^2 (n squared) doesn't make sense? Or is n the amount of SP or not?
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happy new @ned
This is brainstorming. Good ideas, welcome development. bring it on
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what if smart media tokens make everything that is on steem blockchain only to acces with hundreds of different tokens ? If that will be the case I better move on to another decentralised thing man I mean everything people want is freedom
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Honestly, it is just nice to see the OG creators still being active on the platform despite @dan departure. I'm also very happy to see that you two are on a discussion-level basis. It was a shame to see you two split off though I am excited to see how strong @eosio will grow.
As a fellow Virginian with a brother graduating from @dan Alma Mater, I'm compelled to play favorites with him despite his untimely departure from Steem Co. I wish you both a happy new year and I look forward to seeing your activity on the chain!
Thanks for a wonderful platform!
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I just be a korean newbie in the stimit.Its awesome.i will try to do my best .Pls give us more good info .....^&^
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This is the best solution in terms of both perceptional and practical efficiency I have seen so far. But what I am wondering is whether STEEM will be left behind the Oracle. I hope the base currency of SMT (STEEM) also has same or similar tool to address abuse.
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Flagged for aggrandizement I suppose.
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Dear @teamsteem ,
I voted for you as a witness, I have an important question:
for to exchange Steem into another crypto currency we all need an account at a crypto currency exchange. There are 2: Bittrex and Poloniex
Bittrex stopped open new accounts since 15th december, when they start again? Nobody knows.
At Poloniex I tried to sign up a new account yesterday, until today I got no confirmation mail to start the opening procedure!
So what to do?
How can new users exchange their steem? That's the big question and I don't understand why Steemit and the big "whales" not offer any support for that problem, they all have their accounts already.... That makes we wonder, really, because that's the main reason why people join Steemit, to earn a little money, but if there is no possibility for exchange steem, all is useless.
Have you any idea?
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I think opening an account on poloniex should be pretty instantaneous.
Other exchanges are listed here but they are pretty limited.
https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/steem/#markets
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Thank you, I did it now on blocktrades with success
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@blocktrades is fast but quite expensive
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I was really surprised, I changed Steem into lightcoin and send lightcoin to Bitcoin exchange Thailand, the fees were very low, and it was really very fast, some minutes. I really feel better now after my first payout experience, hehehe
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@teamsteem
just finished my post about my first payout experience, I hope I can motivate many newbees.
https://steemit.com/steemit/@zanoni/my-first-payout-experience-on-steemit-100-trust-and-motivation
Best regards, thanks for your time and attention you spend.
Best regard
Tom
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Excellent Idea... or he could just as easily sell it all in big chunks and tank the price.
Your move @dan... your move.
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Fine by me.
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Dan, If you haven't noticed, Steemit has a few bands of thugs strutting up and down dispensing downvotes with impunity to any up and coming bloggers who happen to get more and more upvotes. This is because these bloggers who work hard to earn the upvotes are now viewed as taking more away from the rackets these thugs run. In other words, popular bloggers make the thug's portion of the reward pie smaller and so the thugs arrange coordinated attacks with downvotes, fabricate evidence of bot usage as well as outright lie about multiple accounts. Worst, these thugs are the real ones raping the reward pool while putting out hypocritical agenda on why they will downvote anyone using votebots...all the while, they are the ones running the votebots. It's Fascism 101 and Hitler couldn't have done better. However, we all know how Hitler lost. He was destroyed because the world community united and removed him and his regime.
THE STEEMIT COMMINITY WILL REMOVE THESE THUGS AMONGST US!
Who are the Thugs? Just look at the downvoters of this comment! Because my near 10k followers all saw these Thugs' downvotes of recently posted blogs, they have now resorted to furtively downvoting my just about to be paid, six day old posts.
I WILL NOT BE AFRAID OF THESE THUGS NOR BE SILENCED BY THEM!!
The Witnesses have done nothing about these thugs...core developers have done nothing! Instead they reach out to bloggers like me who often get 10,000 views in the first few hours of posting and ask if I would decline my hard earned payouts....nuts! Have the witnesses and core developers themselves been intimidated into obedience to these thugs? Or, has the corruption soaked so deep?
Meanwhile, the thugs are still intimidating the Steemit community.
What would you propose?
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Identity validation, vote canceling, dispute resolution, bonded behavior, n2 reward curve.
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MIH! Make It Happen.
Who are the thugs? See the downvoters of my earlier comment!
I wish you and loved ones the happiest New Year!
I shall make this year different by making it the same.
Kindest Regards,
@haejin
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If it hadn't been a hypocrite reducing your rewards and it had been for the benefit of the community rather than an excuse to line their own pockets, would you have reacted differently?
This is a genuine question.
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Identity validation - is it not attempted already?
vote canceling - by who?
dispute resolution , bonded behavior - what do you mean?
n2 reward curve - you mean n^2 reward curve like before HF18?
Would it not make large abusers even more powerful?
Only difference for them, is that it would make them concentrate their Steem in less accounts.
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When you say identity validation, do you mean connecting real-world identities to Steem identities? Or just identifying individuals on the network to prevent abuse by bots?
and on vote-canceling, I thought rewards pool is paid out periodically, and once it does that transaction is recorded and made irreversible.
dispute resolution would require Steemit to adopted a constitution, and there will elected individuals, mostly likely from the pool of Witnesses that would have to make decisions that are not programmatic, moving out from the realm of computer-science into legal theory. Do you think Steem is ready for that?
I don't quite understand the last two points but I'm very interested in what you've named as bonded behavior; can you elaborate?
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@dan Identity validation seems pretty useless to me. At the end there are more dead people, than alive, so if there would be a need, it won’t be a problem to get as many identities as needed. I believe that’s the wrong path. The better one would be to leave all curation to the users and focus on growing the community as much as possible (crab bucket mentality).
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Happy New year @dan! My opinion is to have:
reputation separate from SP and it should be harder to gain and easier to loose?
Have random upvote periods (encrypted for 7 days) so that it's harder to coordinate attacks.
Proof-of-human® is also essential but how to do it? Sign/Hash/Encrypt all your fingersprints and ask randomly for one of those prints? A couple of modern phones have digital fingerprint readers...
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Proof-of-human
Proof-of-ban-from-china. How to hide your person when goverment is coming?
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Well, don't use your real name and use a VPN? Or Tor?
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Dear @dan! I have met with interest very many of your proposals. For Steem completely different algorithm at the blockchain level is needed, which would help eliminate any abusements. Mathematics is power! Let's try to come up with such an algorithm.
Maybe we should make all the content anonymous? Do not pay attention to the authors, vote only for worthy posts. Maybe you just need to increase curatorial rewards or even cancel them altogether.
All problems in the field of high technology should be solved with the help of mathematics. I completely agree with the opinion of some people that at the moment very much does not work correctly.
It is not advantageous for me to vote for "quality content" because it brings very little money. Nobody wants to waste their time picking diamonds for other people. The award to the curators must at least be increased 1000 times. Yes. I said it right. People who are looking for great articles need to earn more. This is my main idea.
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The very Idea that self voting earns a reward is bizarre to me. If we must assign a value for a self vote we could make it negative couldn't we? Then it shows that the author is willing to make the sacrifice to stand behind their own work so maybe you should up vote it too.....
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Hello @dan, I wanna see how these thugs can add a flag on this post.
Please check out this screen shot below and decide for yourself.
This is what I have earned below personally by following @haejin blogs.
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I am also for identitiy validation, thanks
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@haejin, I'm saddened by the fact that you still don't get it. I'd like for you to set your rage aside for a moment and try to understand the points I'm about to make.
There is no "band of thugs". Steemit is a community made up of individual users. There are no leaders. There are those with more stake than others, but there are no leaders. The people who downvote you are individuals who believe the rewards you receive are not worth the content you provide. It is not only their right, but their responsibility to do what is in their power to correct that.
See #1. The corrections you experienced were due to the actions of individuals, very few of which had any power to make a noticeable dent in your earnings. Their grievances are as follows:
a. You are receiving dedicated upvotes from a single (@ranchorelaxo) user whose $300+ upvote single-handedly gives you an unfair advantage over similar posts and a disproportionate piece of the reward pool. This user seems to be under your direct control or influence. This affects everybody.
b. The conditions of a. are compounded by the fact that you post prolifically 7-9 times a day. This makes the unfair advantage and disproportionate take you have much more of an issue and of greater concern to the community at large.
c. The content of your many posts often consists of 2 images and a couple of sentences. This is not great content. You will point to your expertise and that would be fine if your followers were paying you out of their own pocket, but they're not. They're paying you with funds from the reward pool.
3.Witnesses have no power to redistribute the reward pool. I don't think you quite understand the meaning of decentralization. The community at large is charged with the responsibility to handle reward pool distribution. If anybody has a responsibility to correct this issue, it is you and the other whales who are on this platform. You want it fixed? You are going to have to engage those whales in discourse, not some flag war.
If you want to resolve this thing, you are going to have to be able to understand and even articulate the grievances of the community opposed to you in a fair way. You have to listen and understand. When you feed trolls, you become one. Do no harm.
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You are uninformed and blind to what's going on.
You fail to mention the following:
How have these thugs been downvoting? With lies and fabricated evidences. Thug tactics.
How does this fit into your input?
https://steemit.com/steemit/@contentjunkie/epic-reward-pool-rapist-grumpycat-unveils-fascist-roadmap
How many of my posts have you followed? They are NOT one or two liners. You clearly don't understand Technical Analysis. Perhaps if you follow rather than base your comment on a cursory look, you can benefit too. The 5k to 10k views are not for usesless contents, as you indicate. Perhaps if you follow my example, you too can get 10k views in a few hours and increase your payouts to above $5 range. I've reviewed you blogs, and they need a lot of improvement and I'd be willing to help, if you'd like.
Technical analysis require timely updates. You can't bundle a whole bunch of analysis for multiple coins. This had been suggested to reduce my payouts but is based on ignorance.
If there are those who have profited MASSIVELY from my analysis and want to reward my blogs with UpVotes, I have zero issues!
No upvotes are under my control. All received upvotes are freely given.
What you don't like is the amount. So, why are the Thugs who take greater amounts than me attacking me? Why are YOU not commenting on how these Thugs are raping the reward pool? Are you even aware? Here is an example: https://steemit.com/kr/@skt1/starjuno
Google translate it.
Do you even realize how much rewards will be released once these thugs stop raping the reward pool?
Finally, I sense your comment is based on how you feel it is unacceptable for my blogs to earn so much while yours earn so little. All I can say is: EARN IT!!
I too shall UpVote your blogs once inprovements are seen. I mean this genuinely.
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That is after downvoting by a single whale (under multiple accounts) and a few minnows/planktons. Do you really expect us to feel sorry for you? Are you really making the case that your blogs are worth that much more? 3 days, @haejin.
Funny you should bring that up. The actions by @grumpycat were inspired by you. It is a hyperbolic metaphor of what you and @ranchorelaxo are doing. It's more disgusting than you guys, but it is a copycat crime. You are a whale. You have the power to do something about it. What actions did you take to stop it?
I understand your analysis to the extent that it benefits this platform. I had actually watched several of your videos and understand the content you are relating to your audience. I still don't think it deserves that much of the reward pool. That is my right as a steemian and the right of the whales as well. I have never downvoted your blog out of fear of reprisal (which you have proven that you carry out). Many other plankton and minnows are the same way. There are a lot of non-vocal critics of your take from the rewards pool.
3a. You've read my blog? I didn't know you were into poetry. Post some of that shit. Let's see if it doesn't shoot up to what $300, $400. I would bet my entire stake that it would. Are you some world renowned poet? No. Even if you were, I'd oppose such a payout. You didn't read my blog, man. GTFOH. Practice what you preach.
I know you don't. I do and much of the community does. It is not their money. It is the reward pool and the community is in charge of distributing that money. We have every right to correct what we don't agree with. In fact, I would say we have a responsibility. Now they can transfer funds to you on steemit. I'm fine with that. That money doesn't come from the reward pool.
My blogs are doing just fine for me. I don't expect to get rich off of the reward pool. The market on steemit for poetry is not the same as the market for crypto discussion/analysis. My conclusions come from analyzing your posts against similar ones.
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Sounds like @haejin cannot say a word against these arguments. The silence is deafening! I mean, how can he defend the un-defendable.
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Your poetry, if you call it that, is both good and original. It's just that what's good isn't very original and what's original isn't very good.
My genuine review of your blogs.
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Well, I'd like to say thank you for that! It was much appreciated even though I don't agree the way you are making money on here taking advantage of your ridiculously insane Steem Power.
Given that, it was such a great pleasure to have the most influential personality on Steem leaving a genuine review and following my blog posts.
It's funny to imagine that you may have thousands of loyal followers but you are following me now. Lol
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LOL, I know this thread is old, but I wanted to point out the hypocrisy of calling me unoriginal while using an insult from Sherlock Holmes. Yeah, you're no Einstein.
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Hey @introvertspeaks, you do poetry too? Man, looks like there are a lot more poets on here than I thought. I'll check out some of your stuff. I looked at your blog and didn't see any in there. Maybe it's buried. @haejin says it's in there, so he must be right (he is right 90% of the time afterall). I did see a meme that was ironically appropriate to this conversation.
"The Ocean Is So Deep but a Duck Doesn't Give a Shit"
So just as @haejin might not give a shit about your poetry, we don't give a shit about @haejin's analysis. [/sarcasm] While his products may well serve those who use them, I don't feel compelled to support payment of those services out of the rewards pool. I look at his rewards and I see no justification for the reward pool to pay for those services beyond the astronomical figures he is already making. You're right. The silence on those points is, in fact, deafening. I wish we could get him to acknowledge that so we could move on to solutions for this riff.
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Nope! Not actually poetry in the technical sense of the word. Just random stream of consciousness, some of them were created for the sake of shit posting, just like what @haejin is doing.
I don't have an idea why @haejin classified those as poetry anyway. It was just the way how I put my thoughts into the written words.
I don't have a proper education pertaining to the subject to begin with.
I am wondering though what prompted @haejin to go full retard on his maniacal act of harvesting the reward pool as if tomorrow doesn't exist.
Perhaps he's merely disappointed with the world around us, like politics, etc? Are we missing something about his grand motivation?
At least lions in the wild forest hunt for food in order to survive from hunger, else they starve to death.
But alas, @haejin who is a fully rational human being, who is rich according to him, is acting more dangerously preparing for his foods for the next 1000 years.
Meanwhile most Steemians, myself included, couldn't even buy a cup of noodles with their whole week of reward payout.
When will @haejin ever learn to act responsibly like a lion in the wild? I really doubt he will. Humanity fails once again.
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When 99,9% of crypto is booming, you don’t need any brains to make useless predictions that some crypto will grow. You are trying to benefit from the community, while you on your own are a stakeholder. If you had some brains, you would not damage your own stake. One of the main reasons I would not invest in Steem are morons like you.
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You are uninformed. Your group I affectionately call the innocent and the idiots. Continue as you have been.
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@haejin, I don't understand why I am getting downvoted repeatedly. The original post regarding the 481 accounts was not speculation, it was based on actual transactions pulled from the blockchain. Nothing in the post was fabricated. Could I have been more objective, certainly, and I edited my post to do so. Your posts are based off of real data, so I would think that you would appreciate my use of data as well.
Moving past that, I might even understand you downvoting that post because it could be interpreted as an attack, but downvoting a 70 cent photography post? Really? What does that accomplish?
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In fact, I have been making some real profits in alts just by tossing coins. People who listen to these type of pseudoscience BS are mentally incapacitated to analyze real-world events by themselves. Pathetic mindless preys get exploited all the time.
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If you can make a huge profit from those 1 image and text posts, then probably it is a valuable content.
For example, I became a Dolphin from profits of trading based on those 1 image posts.
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And he is highly rewarded for that. He currently has over $6000 in rewards coming to him in the next 7 days. That is not taking market value of the SBD into account. This while his income was justly reduced due to the flag wars. The guy is doing fine. His influence while high still only affects a small percentage of users and the reward pool is subject to the whims of all. If you guys want to reward him for those posts, simply transfer steem or sbd into his account. Nobody has any say in what you do with your money. The reward pool, on the other hand, is governed by the community.
By my estimates, the market value for his take will be more than 18k (very conservative). That's a lot of money over 7 days and it is just odd that he's here fighting for more and complaining about it.
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It is OK to invest into Steem, but when we start to use our shares and become part of community we are no more welcome. Very good community.
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You are welcome, but that doesn't mean all have to agree on your choices for how the reward pool gets distributed. You're trying to convince me to use my limited sphere of influence to ensure that @haejin gets more from this platform than he already has. I say "No". I say he has too much already. How do you justify to me or anyone else that he should be getting a greater share than he already is? That is with a whale downvoting him and diminished capacity to upvote his own stuff and @ranchorelaxo's diminished capacity to give him his obligatory $300+ upvote. I'm sorry, but no. That doesn't make any sense to me. If you want to reward him for giving you sound advice, do it out of your own pocket. Giving him reward pool money is not an appropriate reward for a personal show of gratitude.
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How much criticism did Haejin receive before Rancho started giving him $300 a post? How much millions are you prepared to spend in order to buy the pot? The community at large is not using your services. Why should the community at large pay for them?
Why did you guys just go silent on this debate? I felt we were getting somewhere.
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I see no point in commenting when it matters not what I say for it to be flagged to hidden.
I just saw your response though....and how many millions? Not sure, guess it matters how many millions it takes. Downvotes/Flags are fine, but lies and slander are not. I apologize for not extending the conversation. It has gone round and round and round on and off the chain with many people, and gets to be very old saying the same things again and again, but I do realize everything can't read everything. Most of my time is used working on TA and building the brand. Any free discussion time has literally gotten us nowhere so far, so forgive me if I don't feel very confident in reiterating my side of the debate again. You seem reasonable, which is very nice to encounter. If there are any specific questions you have, I'm happy to respond. All the other he said she said has run thin to me.
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Good! Make me more rich in the process!!!
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The people who downvoted you are not a band or collaborating with each other like you are saying. They are individuals with their own views.
If your downvoters were a band, you would already be shut down. @randowhale and @grumpycat combined have 1.7m SP. If we add my and other downvoters' sp, then it will be about 3m. If @transisto joined in downvoting you, then it will be above 4m SP. Surely you will be shut down if we all were a band.
The band is actually you and your followers. You organized your followers and got huge delegation from them. Then you started using it to downvote and censor others who criticized you and the insane reward pool allocation you got.
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Don't lie. Tell the truth.
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Can you explain about what I am lying?
Who was it that censored this post:
Who is it that almost killed off justinashby's blog?
I don't see a single post in your blog below zero. If you think you can continue doing this, you are mistaking.
Hey @dan why are you upvoting this guy while talking about freedom of speech?
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I suspect @dan didn't even have the time to re-view things the way they were happening lately because he's kind of busy fine tuning the @eosio project which is pretty much understandable.
Given that, this platform is doomed for real! I'd rather invest in other alts and make profits trading than investing in Steem Power and have the reward pool raped by these profit maniac comedians.
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In between all these meaningful discussions, the above comment gets $330. I pretty much rest my case.
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From my perspective, you are one of the thugs at the moment.
Your vindictive/retalitory down voting of others isn't good form and isn't helping Steem.
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Just to clarify: witnesses has nothing to do with upvote/downvote drama. Even when casting a vote, witnesses are in the same position as every other (i.e. non-witness) user of the Steem platform. Of course usually witnesses has SP at levels above the average, but even in such case as mine (I've never powered down my witness account, covering all costs using external sources) my SP is negligible compared to involved parties)
Old but not obsolete: Fun with Flags.
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Just an innocent question:
As you said, a user may get flagged due to these reasons also-
Lets ponder on a scenario where someone is betting against steem and is so powerful that he just get bots flagging every genuine blogger. Everyone is in chaos, the value of steem tanks.
What now?
NOTE: I believe we will need to come up with a game theory consistent, consensus driven grievance mechanism or watch the doomsday.
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To act against Steem in that way Malice would have to control 50% Steem Power (locked in for 13 weeks) making him the biggest loser of such stupid actions.
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Nice kawan
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To some extent, you're right. We can not determine the usefulness of the content. I'm afraid that ideas from Dan can lead to dictatorship. Even the best ideas lead to dictatorship. This is problem. This is a very difficult task that no one has yet decided.
If you put flags on each of his posts this will not solve the problem. Current algorithm Steem allows you to abuse your power.
@haejin acts according to the algorithms of Steem and therefore he is in some way right.
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Grumpycat also acts according to the algorithms of Steem. Is he right? Part of the algorithm allows for the community whether whale or minnow to correct them. You can't accept the algorithm to exploit the system then go crying for government when the mechanism to stop the exploit is also put in play.
The community has every right to analyze the worth. They are paying for it. Here's an example of what is happening.
I have a product that I have sold here on steemit. I sold this product for 35 Steem. Now, what if, instead of selling that product directly, i would accept upvotes for that product. So @haejin could come along and upvote my post for $35 bucks and I would send him my product. Did @haejin pay for that product? No. Is mu product worth 35 Steem? It probably is to @haejin. Is it worth 35 Steem to you? No, because you didn't benefit from it. By allowing unchecked access to the reward pool, all steemians are paying for @haejin's services whether they use them or not. That is not right. The fact that we have access to them means nothing if we don't want it. We are allowed and encouraged to have a say in those rewards. That must be respected and even rejoiced in.
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hello haejin
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Do you mean like the thugs who downvoted this post? https://steemit.com/technology/@themarkymark/the-wadsworth-constant
The post was about videos and had nothing to do with the spat. It's easy enough to use Steemd to see that it was people who support you who downvoted it. Who are you calling thugs?
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Exactly as much as I don't like you downvoting just because you put a lot of money into the system inspite of having such a low reputation you nailed it!
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This is all really fucking hilarious coming from one of the largest abusers of this blockchain.
It's all in the history folks. If you've been here long enough or take a few minutes and do some digging, you'll see exactly what I'm talking about.
Practice what you preach @dan. Hypocrite.
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The irony
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Really @dan, inventing Steem was such a disservice to the Steem Community! We would be so much better of without you! :)
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LOL... I googled to see what all this fuss is all about and I got to a post from 11 months ago with the comments explaining what happened. Come on guys, build a bridge.
Took me 15 minutes to decide that I will finally hit post for this comment. Ahahha. I was seriously shitting my pants.
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Could you elaborate? I'm new here, and don't know enough.
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Dan is the creator of the steem blockchain.
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Thanks, but I'm curious about the other portions. Why is Dan an abuser or what did he not practice?
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I always read these posts for the drama, beats the soaps any day.
At the end of the day I thought steemit was self governed, which means users decide. Its a pity that negative posts and comments get more traction than positive ones.
@dan engaging with negativity will lead to more negativity. However if you could engage with the positive stories on Steemit you could make so much more of a difference
https://steemit.com/gifteconomy/@stellabelle/why-no-one-pays-attention-to-the-gift-economy-and-why-they-look-at-violent-stuff-instead
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Dan is the guy who invented Steemit.
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yes I am fully aware of this
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And are those downvoting my utopian contributions held accountable to community standards of behavior? Don't you think your attack on bernie is one sided? I totally agree that what burnie does is not right but is it right that a single person gets 2% of the reward pool?
I can see that you upvoted haejin's comment with 70$ but how would you establish "proper governance the Steem reward pool" if you are giving away 70$ to a comment, not even a post but a comment. That comment has a 150$ payout.
You do understand that you sound like a total hypocrite? At one point you are talking about freedom of expression on the other you are supporting people censoring others. Haejin has sunk a horde of posts by his critics and you appear to be taking the side of those attacking free speech.
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I don't think that forcing people to reveal their true identity will end the corruption or maladaptive behavior you observe. Some of the greatest evildoers of history were quite famous. Many of the most evil deeds being committed in the modern day are also done in the open (drug war, Venezuelan socialism, Syrian war).
Forcing everyone to reveal their identities will just drive away those who need to be anonymous for very good reasons: the gay men in Arab countries, the women being stalked by exes, the drug users subject to kidnapping and imprisonment, the government dissidents.
IMHO, the problem with Steemit is not secrecy or anonymity, but the fact that everyone is forced to be part of the same global community. Right now, the evil whales can grief everyone on the platform. Their victims have no means of cutting off access to the bad actors. What's needed, in other words, are tools for creating and managing property lines.
People behave better when such boundaries exist, because they know that if they behave badly enough, they will cut off from the rest of their community.
Thus, Steemit needs tools to allow people to create and manage their own communities, such as:
If such tools existed, the miscreants would have to behave, lest they be refused entry to most communities. The scope of the damage they could cause would be limited to communities that they created / owned themselves. Eventually, the only people they could grief would be each other.
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There is a balance as well I think. Security is critical, but there is no way to ever guarantee that 100% no matter how much transparency you try to have. People who are willing to break the law will always find ways to get away with it. Should the whole world adopt radical transparency because some people are criminals? Are all crimes equal?
I do see a point behind taking a stance to favor certain designs but I do not think unlimited transparency is a good idea. I think people who are not thieves, not breaking the law, not deliberately damaging the community, do not always benefit from for instance having the amount of money they are earning or holding known to the entire world. As we know, this can make people even bigger targets and nothing the blockchain can do can protect people , so the transparency done wrong actually makes it much worse.
Some privacy in my opinion is critical for improving security. The privacy on the level of amounts people hold and amounts sent or received, should be private between the parties, or as transparent as they like, as in they should be able to select which accounts can see how much money they have or their transactions rather than have everyone see everything like in Steemit.
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Privacy, as a general point, is a fundamental right as I see it. I have the right to privacy in any aspect of my life, whether it be my Steem balance, my personal history or my genetic make-up. Radical transparency will not contribute to more effective self-government. In one point in the above post the author refers to privacy coins being detrimental to effective self-governance of the community, yet later criticises the implementation of AML/KYC laws that attempt to prevent the illicit use of crypto assets that fund illegal activities. These points are directly contradictory.
I choose to write under a pseudonym because I wrote mainly about crypto currency investments. In the real world I am financial adviser and cannot have my professional identify associated with my online identity. Not because I am writing inappropriate content, but because the law has not yet caught up with the crypto landscape and current legislation in my country (Australia) would prevent me from posting for fear of jeopardising my real world business. There is no such thing as a licenced crypto adviser, so to post under my real name would leave me open to losing the license I do have to advise on other more mainstream investments. At the same time it is the knowledge gained from my real world occupations that I hope some crypto investors may benefit from. So I am faced with the choice of either creating what I hope is valuable content, and sharing it with the Steemit community under a pseudonym, or not posting at all.
I am also a military veteran and have considered posting about my experiences both in conflict and since returning to mainstream society. Some of these posts would discuss intensely personal issues and I have considered creating a separate Steemit account to share these. Once again not because I have anything sinister to hide, but simply because I would rather share such personal details in a manner that is not linked to my more public persona, either on Steemit or anywhere else.
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Well said and I completely agree with you.
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Agreed! The reasons why people might want to remain anonymous are many and varied. IMHO, tools for combatting bad behavior should be addressed to the behavior, not the identity of the person exhibiting the behavior.
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Interesting idea on building better property borders. But I am not sure that solves the concerns about "raping the rewards pool" as some people call it. There is after all only one reward pool. Just because you isolate yourself by associating with a few communities, at the end of the day the entire reward pool has to be allocated to the entire set of people participating on the site.
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Isolating property borders would require isolating reward pools. Steem as a base currency, yet rewards to be generated in SMTs, curations to received in SMTs and the SMTs will be valued based on Steem Power the owner accoutns have. Outsider won't be able to flag a community member or upvote them.
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This is the solution we are looking for. You are so on the spot!! Discovering a gem after reading through a 100 comments!! :P
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I also agree with you on the need to have many different communities. Not everyone has the same morals or views on what is right and wrong.
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The individuals and the community must take personal responcibility. No one is coming to save steemit. This is what true freedom looks like. Figure out a way to self govern or the community will die and be used as a point of reference for the next experiment. Its easy to whine, point the finger, and cast blame. It all comea down to what are "you" willing to do about it. Most are asking for policing or a central govt to enforce laws. It what you are used to. True freedom will require a new way of thinking. The problem is clear .There is no organized entity that takes care of Steemit. There needs to be one. Consisting of trusted servants rather than leaders. Where autonomous individual's, groups,areas,region's contribute to the growth and sustainability of the community. we all been sheep that need to be governed , policed and saved for way too long
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Maybe Steemit proves a point of what a community would operate like without any rules, governing body etc. A shit show. Maybe a governing body doesn’t eliminate the chaos but reduces the amount of chaos. Obviously, governing bodies ultimately will form anyhow. But then again, I’m just a sheep. Bah bah bah Bah bah bah.
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I am suggesting well defined guidlines , not rules(laws). Community servants that lead by example and represent their groups. These servants would head up departments like help desk, marketing, events,public relations. They would voluenteer to do these things and be elected by thier peers. There would be 6 month term limits and none of the servants would have any more or less power than others. Yeah I know sounds very ideal. It is already being accomplished in world wide organizations like alcohol anaon and Narcotic Ananon. No laws,No rules, no peneal system etc. Its been working for over 50 years
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There are also no monetary rewards with those organizations where Steem is based on the rewards as the tagline says, "Come for the rewards, stay for the community" I came to blog and now I blog and stay for the comedy.
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Well stated. It is amazing the value the free market will place on a good comedy show. Now up to $5. The show must be getting better.
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Markets are rarely rational as you are aware and more so in an environment that has no regulations such as crypto. IMHO, we’re heading to $10-11 based on pure technicals and fib extensions. Regardless of the comedy show. :)
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Alcoholic anon is not a monetary system. If it was, it would be dead !! Your idea resembles so much with socialism/communism. It would be wise to review it once more!! :)
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It would be wise to offer solutions to problems rather than complain that the current system is not working. AA is an example of a decentralized non profit that has been around for over 50 years. Please explain the similarity to socialism or communism. ib
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Isolate property boundaries: Where communities are isolated economic entities with their own currency (SMTs). This solves two problems-
STEEM remains the default exchange mechanism for SMTs. But no rewards are generated in terms of Steem (only SMTs)
The communities are free to remove/add members and enforce their rules of conduct.
A communist thought comes into play when we propose a bureaucratic incharge (elected or otherwise, as election will be stake weighted not adult franchise which will rule out majority participation) who defines his laws for a very large community.
My solution would divide the community into small manageable groups who do have leaders , yet, function in a consultative way, evolving their set of rules/guidelines and evolving their personal framework for revenue generation.
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I agree with a lot of what you have said and a lot of the concerns you've raised but again you take the time to put on display the positive benefits of moving to a more transparent blockchain but leave out the negatives such as acountability for every action by every user using that blockchain with as yet unprovable claims that this technology could not be oevrtaken in some as yet unforeseen way by a societal element able to hold to account and punish as yet unprescribed behaviours.
Again, you stand to benefit massively from any technology introduced so your opinions and views must be scrutinised and analysed thoroughly.
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Fear of community judgement is rational, especially when the community is not rational. The mob can be scary and empowering the mob has consequences for non-conforming individuals.
My goal is governance without violence.
Others aim to ensure each individual has atomic weapons, invisibility cloak, and impenetrable armor. Such is the logical outcome of maximizing the individual approach.
The middle ground, electing a governing body which "sees all", "judges all", and "enforces all", but which allows individuals to attempt to be private from the "mob" is the worst out come. It enables unaccountable corruption in the hands of individuals with the power of the mob.
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I understand completely where you're coming from but my vision of the future is one where we work together to ensure that everyone has everything they need negating the need for any violence or governance. I know that is an idealistic view but I think it's one worth working towards rather than admitting defeat. The world in which we live and the actions of those within our society are all socio-economic, propagated by those standing to benefit from the continuation of the current system which leads to us being trapped in a never ending cycle of competition with each other for what we are told are limited resources, most of which are not required to live a healthy and happy life and many of which are actually detracting us from this possibility in future. I would suggest that all things being equal, the vast, vast majority of men and women are good and conscientious and given the opportunity, would demonstrate such. I believe a handful of us are fucking things up for the rest and this element will always be a part of us but if we are knowledgable about the dangers of the few within our ranks, we should be able to keep them at bay and identify them easily. In this environment, having suffered the modern society for so long, I think most would be happy to defend their new found freedom, rather than looking to others to do it for them.
As far as the abuse being seen on the platform, I would suggest that this is something that could be countered simply by those within the community with the power to do so to lead by example and I'm sure this example would lead to change.
Cheers and Happy New Year to you.
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If someone doesn’t find Steem to be the funniest platform they have ever used then they don’t have a sense of humor. Whomever thought that people would use a platform responsibly where money was involved obviously didn’t think that through. This place is a joke and I stay for the humor that it is. It attracts the most desperate people from the entire world looking for a quick buck. Hilarious IMHO. Good luck fixing anything.
In fact don’t fix a thing, I wouldn’t have any thing to laugh at.
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I've been here since June 2016 and some of those desperate people were truly desperate I'm talking living huts with no running water and earnings from Steemit got them out of a desperate situation.
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I was reading a book on "Investing in Cryptos" recently. They were pretty fierce on the criticism of STEEM and steemit.com. They asked how dumb you would have to be to launch a crypto that had 100% inflation per year built in as base working assumption?
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What if you shift from an idea of a, "judge" and let the users speak using the already in place voting sysyem. Example: User's and witnesses notice extreme theft of reward pool community brings this to the witnesses, witnesses vote amongst each other to impose mass vote, users do the research and make the final choice. Rarely used, but would show fuckers the potential losses of coming with that bullshit. We already have mass voting built in. And think about it, how else does a decentralized platform protect itself? Fb,YouTube centralized control mass bans people, I'm not talking that we do that- but we have to protect ourselves too. That's why the flags are in play, but they aren't working.
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Why empower the mob when you know the mob is not rational? Not only is the mob not rational but it is not capable of being rational. This means the mob is not capable of being moral in my opinion, which will lead to all the problems which people fear will come.
Explain how you can make the mob rational to avoid continuous persecution by an irrational mob?
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In a different system the mob will have a different character.
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Show me that "different system" where the character of the mob has changed.
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How can I? It hasn't yet been able to form of course....but the process of reaching that point has begun.
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fightings and disagrements wont help the steem blockchain,we minnows might not have much stake here but we love steemit and the steem blockchain, not only because of the money but because you guys gave us in real sense what an online community is supposed to be. i would advice you shouldn't throw away the baby with the bath water, if steemit fails, you have failed, you might have moved on to some other projects that becomes very successful but if steemit should fail you would always be indentified with it failure. i propose that you guys should come to a round table and dialogue and get steem on course, steem is the most undervalued blockchain because of all these bickerings going on. steem is your baby,fight for it for us all,dont stand aside and watch it die when you could have prevented it.
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This is too much...steemit is an incredibly successful experiment. No-one can prevent the issues generated with the token distribution and governance model.
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A powerful article @dan! Thanks for sharing views that are largely understood and thought about here on Steemit. tend to have a fairly free and wide understanding of this issue, I guess, and find myself coming to the same conclusions on almost all points of your discussion.
So far, I tend to believe that self vote has its place, as long as it is not to exceed passed the point of legitimacy... This one being hard to judge, especially from an outside point of view is hard to delimit and asks for input from the community as well as from the individual behaving in such a manner.
As for any ethical matters, a one-on-one conversation might give the light necessary to evaluate properly the intention and leitmotiv behind actions x,y & z for instance. As for me, I know I do vote for myself freely, sometimes even to a high percentage. Sometimes, I stop and wonder if I should do so with a higher or lower percentage and purposefully pause on this matter as the sustainability of the platform is of the utmost interest to me and us all. Thus, I reward others as well as my self for interactions and content that I see as being benevolent to us all.
I have not yet delved into the flagging system other than thinking about its repercussions and, most importantly, its abuse which we all have sadly seen over time more than once... The governance in relation to this topic as been discussed over and over by many great minds and, so far, nothing fully working has been set in place to dissuade the abuser(s). Thus, the abuse keeps on deterring many amazing people away from our platform, people that actually brought about great content and spirit to our community here on Steemit.com So far, the best coercive technique I can think of is one where a system that measure the degree of repulsion of one individual over large groups could be measured and give the reflective impact on its actual account, thus diminishing its power to affect the entire community with its negative interaction. Anyway, it is a long conversation we often had here on Steemit, I guess it is not necessary to delve into any more than we already did.
Thanks again fro all the amazing works you do among ourselves, the planet and each individual and communities all over the world. You are changing the face of the Earth for the better and, though no words can thank you enough for it, at the may the 100% upvote be the reflection of my tokens of appreciation for you being who you are among us.
Namaste :)
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I highly respect Dan as well and thank him for his creation and contributions. I also believe in self voting in moderation but there should be a balance of upvoting other accounts as well.
I would really like to resolve the abuse problem without requiring identity verification. Here's an idea- what if a certain number of flags against an account could temorarily suspend a user from voting, flagging, delegating, earning curation rewards and making transfers. After each suspension is up the suspension becomes longer at each subsequent offense by that account. After a certain number of suspensions the flags begin taking away Steem Power from the offender permanently in accordance with the number of votes, the flaggers' Steem power, and reputation score. The offender should still be free to post, earn rewards from other voters and power down if they want to get out while the getting is good. They should not be able to vote, flag, delegate, earn curation awards or transfer Steem during the suspensions. This would require a coordinated, community-approved flagging campaign with hundreds or thousands of accounts voting. Those that are in favor of the account and it's alleged abuse should be able to organize a counter campaign which could be weighted to reputation score first and maybe Steem Power last.
In addition, after the suspension ends a suspension of flaging power should continue for a period of time to reduce the risk of retribution, with increased flagging suspenion periods between suspensions.
Basically, this would be a structured way of flagging an account instead of flagging a post.
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Hi Dan. I'm not sure if you read the comments on your posts or not. And I do understand you have stepped away from Steem, though I get the impression it is still a project with some meaning to you, otherwise you might post these thoughts on Medium, or some other platform, without dipping your hands in to the muck here on Steem.
You still have power in this account to make a big difference in the "Self Policing" of the platform. If you were to power up your Steem and delegate to people you trust to help with mitigating these issues, you could greatly impact how this all plays out.
I am guessing that becoming a form of "Steem Police" doesn't hold any interest for you, but perhaps by commenting here, other people with the same level of power as you may decide it is in their best interest to put their efforts into making Steem work better for everyone.
Thanks for all you do! Looking forward to seeing what EOS does in 2018!!!
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It would be a futile effort because the bad-guys have the advantage under current steem rules... they can quickly move to new accounts and have elaborate systems to hide their abuse. They will make some profit but it is all costs to the police.
I proposed several systems to fix this:
It is a losing battle under current rules.
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I fully support 1 & 2.
I remember reading about some of your thoughts on number 3 but I don't remember reading about a clear implementation. If you have an idea about how to implement it for Steem I look forward to reading about it.
This part made it very clear for me why n2 cure made sense and why it should be reinstituted.
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Please explain why going back to n2 curve, isn't just putting more power in the hands of the biggest whales?
Are you assuming that this outcome will be a good thing because you believe the biggest whales are "the good guys"?
To me, as a minnow, returning to n2 would just mean that the king wants to be the king again, the king got tired of sharing even a few small crumbs with the minnows, and the king is not so greedy that he wants all the crumbs for himself.
Isn't that a logical and reasonable conclusion of what an n2 system represents?
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Wow! Thank you once more for your awesome efforts and those uplifting thoughts.
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1 and 3 are related to the one of Ostrom's principle to shared resource management, setting a clear boundary for accessing the resource.
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SO Right
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@dan I agree It does feel like a losing battle at the moment for us lowly minnows but I have worked hard and I am building up my account without paying for votes or using sock puppets but the reward system does need to change as I see too much abuse!
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What happen to this proposal sir @dan? What did the authority said about it? Im not a techy guy and I don't understand these terminologies but I'm hopeful that somehow steem will be a great community.
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This is a very sad observation of the state of the platform. I wonder if it pains you at all to say that about what should have been a shining example of your proof of stake concept.
It seems to me that current management has shown that they are uninterested in changing the rules in a way that meets any of your suggestions, instead relying on the "self policing" mentality which continues to prove to be an unacceptable solution.
We will see what the future holds. Thanks again!
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Yes 1,2 ,and 3! I have to be identified if I join an exchange and trade money there. I can trade money on steem, yet no verification. I would think you would just impliment it on new accounts, and then as we flag the abusers, they slowly can't join without verification, and can no longer play that game.
I just joined steem, invested some steem i had from an exchange, and I'm really hopeful if I can get all my friends to join that i can do pretty ok. But I see these evil whales telling people what to do, flagging people for commenting on posts they don't like, and I'm honestly scared that my friends will just turn tail if they see that side of things. Fingers crossed that this stops most of the abuse. Thanks for what you have created @dan Happy new years.
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So in other words, no more pseudo-anonymity? What is non-linear reward curve?
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On the issue of identity verification by trusted parties, this is one of the areas which has become a big conversation I've been having with some colleagues in the #promo-steem community, and which we are hoping to find solutions for. Without wanting to ever get into a form of KYC, which I feel would be a terrible thing, we are working on building an off-site construction which we hope the community will support, and perhaps even bring into the ecosystem in the future. Ultimately, we all want Steemit and the Steem blockchain to thrive, and there are clear problems with the current way things are done. Naturally, these will take time to evolve, and many people have their own ideas about how it evolves.
Taking on the issue of people "raping the rewards pool", it seems to me that the purpose of Steemit itself is evolving. What makes a great post is subjective, but ultimately, I think what makes a great post is simply does it add value to peoples lives? If @haejin and others get great rewards from posting their TA, then fair play to them. Unfortunately, getting seen can be a problem. I have recently released some really high end music onto the DTube platform, stuff which hasn't taken me days, weeks or even months, but literally a number of YEARS to write, record, produce, mix and master (mainly due to its complexity) and received virtually nothing in the way of upvotes. However, I know there are people out there (some even commenting on this thread) who regularly post someone elses work (with a link to avoid plagurism of course) who regularly get huge upvotes for what is essentially 5 minutes work. For people who are trying to make great content, this might take them off the platform for a bit, because some content genuinely takes ages and ages to create.
I would like to see a situation where great content creators, even brand new ones, can share in the rewards and make this a place where everyone, regardless of how much Steem they hold, can grow and thrive. The biggest problem to this is the circle-jerking that goes on amongst some of the whales, and these are the people who are causing the rewards pool to be drained. The whales will benefit if the community benefits from the rewards pool, because ultimately this makes the platform attractive to great content generators, and in turn raises the price of Steem. If you have a couple of million SP in your wallet, who cares if you get a hundred dollars in a post? What makes you even richer is the price of Steem going up to $10, or hey how about even $100? And this occurs when it becomes a sound vehicle for creators and investors alike. Unfortunately, this requires more of a behavioural shift, and educating those who hold the most influence to act in a way that is more altruistic towards the minnows. That way, everyone gains at some level.
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Here I was thinking 2018 will be great for Steem - now I just read how the creator of Steem is displeased with his creation. As someone who spends his time and money on this platform, this sounds worrying to me... Will these issues be present with the creation of SMTs? I'm a bit uncertain now with my investment to say the least..
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I don't get the sense @dan is displeased with his creation, but more with the people who abuse it. I think if he didn't like the creation he wouldn't bother writing this post, which to me shows he does care. Anyhow just hang in there @showtime24, as I see it Steemit is the first of MANY apps on the STEEM blockchain and while it may be flawed it is but a small piece of the STEEM puzzle. 2018 is gonna be great for holders of STEEM.
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Thanks for the reassurance. I agree the blockchain itself is very impressive and it reflects Dan's work ethic. I meant to rephrase that, I know he's pleased with his creation, but like you said he's not pleased with the abusers. Hopefully this will all be left in 2017, and 2018 will be filled with some pleasant surprises!
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@dan, Invaluable insight in an area of material importance. Having come from the hay-days of LBOS, Junk Bonds and insider dealings, I know the significance of transparency and governance, which are my pillars. Pillars that will be the foundation in future ventures in 2018! Expecting only the best for you in 2018.
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Hypocrite. We're all following your lead. Again, it's all on the blockchain, you should know this of all people.
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I agree in principle with the logic of your arguments except that the Crypto world does not live in a vacuum. The biggest thiefs on the planet (pretty much all governments) see it as their right to confiscate part or all of your whealth by physical means if needed.
Sure there can be governments that will be linient if we are willing to play ball by policing ourselves and pay our taxes. So I guess it's a matter of choosing the lesser of two evils.
The n2 curve was disproportionatetly biased to big stakeholders giving practically no voice to small accounts. By small accounts I mean someone willing to invest 10,000 USD (which in itself is a fortune in poor countries).
To be honest I was surprised that a linear curve was selected given the fact that there were other options on the table.
As always I follow what you have to say with interest...and happy New Year!
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Yes I am painfully aware of their extortion. But until we can govern ourselves in a decentralized manner the extortion will continue. Hiding is not a strategy for victory, it will only come when extortionists and those who are complicit in their crimes are held accountable in transparent manner.
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You were sent a message on telegram. I hope you will stay tuned for what we have planned.
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Are you going to bring back a limit to the amounts of post able to be paid on daily? Most of the current issues have arose over short post being made up to 10+ a day getting max upvotes.
You can say your proposed fix will fix some things but will it fix milking the system in that manner?
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Dan has not been a member of Steemit Inc for nine months (after his resignation) nor is he a witness. So he is not the person to be asked these questions...FYI.
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Oh hell, I thought it was @ned. I guess, I should have looked at the 1st tag and realized who was crying here.
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I am not a technical kinda person in crypto,but wouldn't it be very easy to correct the problems @dan pointed out?
We could cap the maximum reward accepted on posts, or make it a certain amount the more followers or reputation you have.
I guess we could easily code our way to prevent self-upvoting, either by greatly reducing these rewards, or even completely removing that functionality.
Anyway, this posts considers steem as tied to steemit, and not as the currency for Smart Media Tokens. SMTs will create many sub-economies with different whales and rules to steemit. I don't why the problems of steemit must apply to steem as a whole.
I really like EOS and I believe it will be a great platform in the future, but it's sad to see @dan criticizing steem so easily when it can be improved. Wish he was still working on steem as well as EOS
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I’m guilty of voting on myself and using a vote bot....but this is how Steemit works right now...I’ve gone back and forth on this issue, abusing votbots and farming comments and author rewards is wrong when using these tools to rape the reward pool. Also flagging to bring down ones competition is dugusting, I see this happening all the time but I don’t have a clue how to fix the problems.
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I happen to believe that you're a Model Steemian my dear ; )
The folks that built this "Platform" really didn't think the whole thing through when they RUSHED this version to market.
And why the RUSH?
Probably to "Game" the system in such a way as to give themselves a MASSIVE advantage...
So massive in fact that "Self-Voting" is a very small example of this advantage.
The fact is, this network was broken right out of the gate thanks to this MASSIVE advantage the designers gave themselves and their friends. So MASSIVE was this advantage, that many of the "Advantage Class" have to avoid using the very network they built and decline payouts so as not to take TOO much advantage... of the MASSIVE advantage they've already given themselves.
That all being said, I use this platform to interact with the Model Steemians such as yourself and use the established Oligarchs as examples to point out to other professionals in Crypto; don't be like "THEM".
No amount of "Philosophizing" on this problem will fix it. We'll likely see a better solution on a subsequent version. SteemON Sis-Star! ; )
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I had come to the same conclusion after the last hard fork and Dan left. The system is set up to milk the profits to fund new ventures by the huge accounts that run steemit. Once the cow is milked out it is used for hamburger...just my simple farmers view of this platform right now.
Thank you Mr @frankbacon, I will be working on your portrait this new year. I read about frank bacon whilst research my subject. He was an amazing and complicated person.
Steemit has introduced me to a wonderful new world but it will be corrupted just like our old fiat/tax slavery system if we all can't change our old trauma based conditioning of bonding and supporting our abusers and picking the corn out of their shit just to survive.
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Touche
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Epic!
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Why can't the next hardfork solve these issues? Current problems won't be here forever, and steem is not tied to steemit. Smart Media Tokens can change the internet.
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If a platform gives you an advantage in your every day life, you want to use it. when you are on the outside of steemit, you see it as something great. Then you realize some people gave themselves a huge advantage, which is not ethically right, but why should you care? a user will join steemit because he can also benefit from it, and this is what he saw before joining, even while others were abusing the system... This is why the platform can and will grow despite these problems. Anyway they will be fixed eventually.
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"Good Governance and Steem
"Steem has excellent security on accounts, but very poor governance. The community reward pool is the preverbal wallet on the park bench. Those who are voting for themselves and hiding behind pseudo-anonymous accounts are thieves stealing from the community. Those censoring posts on EOS through use of down votes of posts that decline rewards are not held accountable to community standards of behavior."
~@dan from above.
For the record:
IMHO... SteemIt is a remarkably Chaotic experiment, with a very big Gorilla in the room.
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Whenever their is money, their is corruption. Here, money is much accessible even in the absence of corruption. You just need to have a tremendous stake and you can assure the stream of cash will directly flow at your doorstep. We could not blame the rich because that's how the system were created.
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I knew the n2 was better, better to change the bad behavers rather than take freedom from all.
What do you think of a sigmoid curve that targets low 5 digit investors?
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Hi @dan,
Starting from a philosophical standpoint and moving to more practical issues, I would approach this argument with the observation that there are two versions of the world in which we live.
There is the idealised world in which we would like to live. This is a world in which radical transparency and the associated ideas raised in your post (and the previous one that you wrote a little over two weeks ago) are effective and humans are able to harmoniously co-exist and self-police, without the need for external influence.
There is also the world in which we do live, which is populated by real people, with selfish motivations. This is the world that surrounds us in real life, and Steemit is but a microcosm of this world.
While it is essential to have aspirational goals to guide the development of our community, it is also necessary to face the fact that these goals can only ever be aspirational. In the day to day world that we all must face, radical adherence to aspirational concepts leads to disappointment and failure.
Asymmetry will exist in any community structure you wish to nominate. If you live in a community governed by violence, then the strong hold an advantage over the weak. If you live in a community where intelligence is valued, then the smart hold an asymmetric advantage over the less intelligent. There has never been, nor will there ever be, complete equality between all people. Flowing from this concept, there will also never be perfect governance, either communal or otherwise. Human nature is such that every set of rules that could be imagined will be gamed, so that those who hold the advantage in the system you have designed, use this advantage to further the interest of themselves, their family and their associates. All human beings are flawed, no matter how noble their intentions. The reason why the likes of Ghandi and Nelson Mandela are so well known is precisely because individuals with this level of moral selflessness are so rare. There are a handful per generation. The rest of us must deal with the reality that self interest is at the heart of the human condition. No set of governance rules will ever perfectly solve this problem. The same goes for lines of code. No algorithm will ever eliminate the ability of those smart enough to game the system. Steemit is broken because humans are inherently conflicted. This is the real world that I reference at the start of my post. Some may call this cynical, but I would fall back on several million years of human evolution as my proof. This is not to say that we shouldn’t aspire to improve the system, as all people should aspire to live in a world that more closely resembles the first (ideal) world than the second. These goals can only ever be aspirational however. We will always live in a world where the weak take advantage of the strong. The only differentiator is the definition of strength in the system that you choose to govern yourself with. If the rules of the game are changed, then someone will figure our how to game to new rules to their advantage. It is perpetual cycle.
Having read this and your previous post, there is a strong theme of anti-establishmentarianism that comes through. This is unsurprising as this is one of the foundations on which the concept of blockchain technology is built. As such it is unsurprising that this theme comes through so strongly in the views of many of the block chain community’s thought leaders. An issue that I think this community (and I refer to the blockchain community more broadly) has yet to grapple with is the fact (at least I believe it to be fact) that at some point there must be some form of centralised authority for the system to function effectively. The “Leviathan” as Thomas Hobbes coined it in the 1600’s. Despite the many failings of most forms of centralised government, the rise of the leviathan over the past several hundred years has, more than any other factor, led to the dramatic increases in health, wealth and prosperity of billions of people. Centralised democratic governments reduce the incidents of warfare and state sponsored violence, not increase them. I refer you to Steven Pinker’s excellent book “The Better Angles of our Nature” for a comprehensive discussion of this point. We currently live in the most peaceful time in the history of human evolution, and this “Outbreak of Peace” can be shown to directly correlate with the outbreak of democracy that followed the end of World War Two.
Are modern democracies perfect? Far from it. But they represent the best solution yet developed to the problem of governing a mob of self-interested individuals. The biggest failing of modern democratic government is that it has become so inward looking and conflicted that it has lost the faith of an entire generation of young people. The fact that the system is flawed however, does not mean that the solution lies in throwing the baby out with the bath water.
More practically, I admit to being very new here, but I have been a student of human nature for far longer than my brief membership of this platform, and as stated above, I believe the flaws evident in the Steemit community are simply a microcosm of the flaws present in wider society.
While pitched as a truly decentralised, peer to peer platform, Steemit is in actuality an oligopoly (or perhaps kleptocracy would be a better term in light of the views you have expressed above). As in all other human ecosystems, the strong take advantage of the weak. In this case the strong are those whales who game the system, and the weak are the rest of us. There is much criticism of upvoting bots and other means by which minnows attempt to climb the ladder. This is somewhat hypocritical however, as for those of us at the bottom, the climb to the top is getting longer and longer. Steemit of January 2018 is not the Steemit of June 2017 and certainly not the Steemit of June 2016. As membership grows and the number of daily posts grow with it, the ability of a new member to get noticed decreases proportionally. There are any number of comments from more established users that while the journey is long and hard, the key to success is to persevere and produce good quality posts that generate genuine engagement. This undoubtedly remains true, but a journey that may have taken 3-6 months when Steemit had 50,000 users, could easily take 12-24 months now that the community has grown. For those who are already established to criticise those of us just starting our journey, for using any meagre advantage that is available to us smacks of hypocrisy. This is especially so when in the oligarchic community in which we try to survive, it only takes one whale to take a dislike to you and you can be down voted out of existence.
In reality however, if upvoting bots (and self-upvoting posts) are anathema to the vision of the Steemit community then ban them. If they are allowed to exist then they are, by de facto, legitimate. Leaving ethical decisions such as when it is, and isn’t appropriate to use these tools in the hands of inherently conflicted and self interested individuals is a recipe for failure. Once again we return to the difference between our ideal world and our real world. Decisions such as this require the presence of a centralised authority however, a leviathan, and from what I can glean from the above commentary, the vast majority of Steemians appear to not favour the establishment of such a body.
In closing, one of the biggest flaws in the Steemit system, from my observation, is the system of downvoting. I have never downvoted, and doubt that I ever will. While this function appears to have been conceived to allow the democratic curation of content, in reality, it amounts to little more than a means of censorship, especially in a system where so few, exert so much influence. It is my firm belief that I am but one person, and I hold an opinion. That opinion is worth no more, or no less than that of any other Steemian. You may not agree with my opinion, but that does not make it wrong. Nor does the fact that I hold it, make it right. It is what it is. One opinion. If you disagree with my opinion, then the way to change it, is to engage with me and convince me through strength of argument. The current system however, allows my opinion to be obliterated simply because it doesn’t agree with your own. Even if you were to choose engagement over obliteration we return to one of the central points of my discussion. If you are more intelligent than me, or better educated, then you have a better than average chance of changing my opinion, as you are likely to be more persuasive. Your influence is asymmetric, and we return to the point that all systems are flawed. It just depends on your perspective as to where the flaws lie.
So I see one of two paths forward from here. The system (Steemit) remains in its current form and exists in an anarchic state, where the powerful exert outsized influence and the rest of us do the best we can, hoping we can one day reach a point we are the powerful. Or the system changes to allow a group of individuals (witnesses were suggested above) to make decisions on behalf of the community and govern it for the benefit of all members. Neither solution will be perfect.
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I wholeheartedly agree. I think there can be a microcosm based on such values in a chosen community like joining a club, you have to play by the rules and if you don't you're out. There seem to be no rules here so we are suffering at the hands of human nature. That is why I post mostly about Buddhism, meditation and other fun stuff, but The Noble Eightfold Path and it's corresponding teaching and practices, because of these human tendencies. The abuse here hurts my heart but also bonds me more to my ethical path wherein my true peace and power lies. I have little power on Steemit and I don't need to have any.
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Modern democracy is a deception. An illusion used to justify rule by deep state.
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When the author becomes reductionist in this article, it is problamatic because much of the 'reasoning' is propaganda devoid of evidence.
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this goes way beyond complexity of game theory
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With all the spam that goes here you chose one of the few honest (Yes, honestbot or more precisely, its owner sethlinson is honest) bots and downvoted it.
It does have some impact on his business.
I do not love these comments either, but of all the things you could do with your VP, it is below the average.
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This comment has received a 39.53 % upvote from @steemdiffuser thanks to: @stimialiti. Steem on my friend!
Above average bids may get additional upvotes from our trail members!
Get Upvotes, Join Our Trail, or Delegate Some SP
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You got upvoted from @adriatik bot! Thank you to you for using our service. We really hope this will hope to promote your quality content!
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You got a 5.47% upvote from @minnowvotes courtesy of @stimialiti!
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Great post! You've earned a 23.81% upvote from @dolphinbot![](https://steemitimages.com/640x0/https://image.ibb.co/nwFta7/dolphinbot.jpg)
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You got a 100.00% upvote from @greengrowth thanks to @stimialiti! You too can use @GreenGrowth by sending your post URL in the memo field to the bot. Minimum bid is 0.01.
If you feel this post is spammy or not worthy of @Greengrowth you can contact a moderator in our Discord Channel https://discord.gg/6DhnVTQ.
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Anyone looking for ways to increase transparency and counteract abuses in the short term can make use of the voter ranking system and tracking tools available now at Steem Ocean.
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Great post Dan, I agree with a lot of your general philosophy but I am struggling with your anti-privacy stance.
I value my privacy partly because I am concerned about reprisal from politicised zealots. I want freedom of speech but as we have seen time and again in the real world, when extremists don't agree with said speech they will attack. How do you get past the politics of the extremists and their desire to attack individuals who disagree with their dogma? I don't want those nutters knowing where I live that is for sure!
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Not just knowing where you live but knowing how much crypto you have too? How does that benefit your long term safety?
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excellent post
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Kinda sad to see you moving to a 'guilty until proven innocent' approach.
Trust is the only important factor in crypto, find a way to incentivy this instead of forcing people to give up their privacy.
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You have anarchist/voluntarist leanings, right Dan?
Yet, forcing people to "be transparent," as you seem to be advocating, wouldn't be very voluntaristic, would it?
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I'm sure this post has a lot to do with the chaos currently happening on here. As much as I welcome your input, I can't but to think that it might fall on many deaf ears.
I won't disagree with any of the points you outline, as a matter of fact I will go as far as saying that identifying the problems with Steem might even be easy for anyone who has participated of this platform for at least a month.
I know my request might fall on deaf ears, but like grandpa used to say, if you don't ask the "no" is guaranteed.
Is there a way you could outline in a concrete way a possible solution to the reward pool abuse, the self voting and the censorship issues. Is this something that can be done with a fork, or are we waiting for it to rain in the desert?
There are many investors currently powering down, loosing faith on the platform, and it really hurts to see that "loss of faith" happening before my eyes. I know you are out, so I'm not implying you pull a Steve Jobs and fix Steemit, I'm sure you have moved on.
But the truth is that your voice holds weight, and a suggestion from you might shift general consensus. It might...
In any case, I'll stop my little rant...
Happy new year Dan
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He is the creator of steemit, and as a creator, even if moved to create another, still will adore its creation. Somehow @dan, still has concerns and thoughts about the future of platform.
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The power down is not lose of faith...steem as all other altcoins grew and people want to sell at least a portion of the stakes after quite some time spent around 1 dollar...there is really no loss of faith happenng right now in one of its golden ages in terms of demand for the token...
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Another controversial blog post from @dan
There is so much more to good governance than this. What about human rights? What about the lack of victimless crimes? What about freedom of thought (lack of thought crimes)? Perceived safety is very important but it is a mistake to make it the only measure of good governance.
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I saw some absurdly high paid comments in this post and flagged them to contribute to balance and to protect the pool. Please do not take those actions negatively or in bad taste. It is only a contribution to the health of the network.
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I only upvote myself because downvoting all the trash on here would take a lifetime.
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Well it is refreshing to hear from a position of authority talk about it. I had commented on a comment earlier today about fraud on steemit. All day in the back of my head, 8 had been planning a post. Well no need for that now.
The current platform set up is like a playground without rules and without monitors. People are getting hurt. Beyond that steemit is getting hurt. There are many forms of stealing on steemit. Voting bots are draining the reward pool and so is the behavior you mentioned. Unfortunately there are many other tricks. I have a suggestion that does not come from a cryptocurrency world ( no experience) but does come serving on some other boards. Governance and witnesses should govern. They should not be allowed to run bots and schemes and when in governance they should not have voting powers. Then they can govern without trying to figure out every day how much more money can they pilfer.
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Simple approach. But will never be implemented. My feeling is the top 50 witnesses are composed of about 25 who are constantly scheming to figure out how they can make more money from the platform.
No issue with people scheming on how to make money. That is the basis of capitalism.
Big issue if we tried to put the schemers and bot runners in charge of governance. That would be bad for all.
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I agree. Governance should separate itself from lowly goals.
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Oldschool #opensource quote: "security by obscurity isn't good" :-)
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I'm suprised that government didn't do false flag saying terorrist was using anonymous of crypto's as funding. Yes, we need more of transparency on Steemit.
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That’s not what censorship means, and I’m pretty sure you already know that.
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"Only a virtuous people are capable of freedom. As nations become corrupt and vicious, they have more need of masters." ~ BF
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Or maybe the presence of masters creates immortality in the people.
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I wrote a while back on my philosophy on Mutual Consent and Freedom. It was my first Steemit post. Your (@dan) previous post on Radical Transparency has me doing a lot of soul searching. Thank you...
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Radical transparency can only succeed in an egalitarian society. Private motive will find a way to exploit the transparency and find back doors to crash such an open system before it gets started!
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Very important debate here. This is what is naturally on our minds. Our thoughts evolve according to our experience. Many of us libertarian types used to think, "we don't need no stinkin' governance. All society is self organizing." And so we do still believe.
HOWEVER just as the ego exists in a human being, not exclusively for self-destruction, but rather for functional purposes such as self preservation and adaptiveness; so too, Every Organization needs some type of guidance or governance to make critical decisions at the proper time. Artificial Intelligence is still: garbage in, garbage out. It takes a human, or rather Human Action.
Secrecy, privacy, transparency, accountability, judgement, open sourcing, aligning interests, freedom of expression and suppression of thought.
All this is on our mind because it does matter, or rather Matter will take the form of our Mind.
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Proof of Morals and Ethics
@dan and @ned, I really think whales like you both should be limited by the system you created, in way that you do not get too much of the reward pool. And this should be a rule that affects all whales and dolphins alike.
Minnows on the other hand have no limitations. Limitation is directly proportional to increasing reputation and or amount of vests each user holds and or increased number of active users on the steemit community.
This should be similar to how mining difficulty increases in traditional bitcoin mining overtime.
There is really no need for a rush to make it big, as ones's rewards will get lesser and lesser. This is the same principle as you whales opt not to receive payouts on your posts. Why not just make it be part of steemit.
And there is limitation of non-activity on all users, as your funds get depleted if you don't contribute one way or the other.
A variation of this idea can be looked at to limit too much power that may lead to abuse as we are seeing too much of lately.
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Upvote you you have invested in ripple or electroneum , that is the future of crypto currency
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Unfortunately one bad apple spoils the bunch. Maybe one day we can live in a world where you could leave your doors unlocked or your wallet on a park bench. Until we're there as a society I can at least take comfort in knowing there are brilliant people out there like yourself working hard to empower humanity with systems that reward integrity. Thanks @dan for all that you do. Happy New Year!
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Congratulations, your post received one of the top 10 most powerful upvotes in the last 12 hours. You received an upvote from @thejohalfiles valued at 212.44 SBD, based on the pending payout at the time the data was extracted.
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Congratulations @dan, this post is the second most rewarded post (based on pending payouts) in the last 12 hours written by a Superhero or Legend account holder (accounts hold greater than 100 Mega Vests). The total number of posts by Superhero and Legend account holders during this period was 27 and the total pending payments to posts in these categories was $1867.15. To see the full list of highest paid posts across all accounts categories, click here.
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Why is Dan Larimer's payout for this post blocked? (it shows a striked-out on the $356.52). Anyway thanks for building Steem and looking forward to EOS - though will sell EOS before the launch date, then buy back directly. (the registration and processing via Ethereum is a tad complex to some of us)
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He chose not to take rewards
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Coz he is rich and $300 is 1 cent to him.
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Again, IT'S ALL ON THE BLOCKCHAIN PEOPLE!!!! YOU CAN CLEARLY SEE IN DAN'S HISTORY, REGARDLESS OF THE BULLSHIT HE SPEWS.
Also, I upvote my comments because @dan killed my account for telling the truth about him. Just like this.
Fuckin Vitalik wannabe..
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I went through his posts as far as 6 months and all I saw was dev updates and eos status. Nothing to me suggests any bad play. Maybe a quick recap for everyone who has no clue as to what all this is about.
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Stuff Bernie Sanders. I don't know anything about him but your work says more things about you than mere words thrown. Some people don't really know what you are trying to achieve but EOS is taking us there.
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You going to sell then buy back? Registration is straightforward. Where did you buy your EOS?
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Bought from Bittrex then Binance. If there's some way to register easily within Binance, then will keep it that way. Else will sell before June then buy back.
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Nah i dont think binance will accomodate that. If its easier for u then do that. I think its best to keep it in a cold wallet
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On the topic of transparency - Steemit's current claim that authors receive 75% of the rewards and curators get 25% is I think not true. By my own calculation, authors only get around 40% of the rewards (curators probably get much lower than 25% but its hard to verify since there is no audit trail). That begs the question - who gets the rest of the rewards? I have no problem with authors getting only 40% if thats what Steemit thinks they deserve. My concern is the transparancy on rewards distribution. As a corrective measure, I think Steemit should either update its calculation to enure it follows 75% 25% rewards distribution claim or let Steemians know that author only get 40%, curator ??% and Steemit ??%. Here's a link to my post on the rewards calculation Link. On Governance, I firmly believe DOWN VOTES breeds greed, hatred, violence and disempowerment. A better alternative is to limit the rewards that each post get as well as putting a daily ceiling limit on rewards per Steemian. While I think bid bots help sustain red fish and minnows, I'm not sure how they foster transparency, governance and commitment to protect property rights.
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I do not think you assertion that creators only get 40% of the rewards is at all correct. I am never seen a post not be split correctly.
If you do have a post in mind, could you please show me?
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That's probably true. Now how do we, the little guys, push toward that and make it happen?
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Great question and something to think more about as many of us have been.
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Dear Dan, I was always pro you, since the last couple of days I am 10x pro you. I hope your efforts pay (not talking about financially) and you end up creating the best blockchain ever. Once again, thanks for being active and interacting in the telegram group. I wish you a happy new year, and great health and believe the rest will follow :)
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Dan is live! is it the reason for steem and SBD price rise? 😜
And seriously - it's nice to see the masters are here, caring for the platform and want to fix the problems, using radical methods if necessary. It would be nice to think what the community thinks about those changes to be - gonna peep the comments.
can someone explain why would anyone want to harm the EOS price by downvoting related posts? I am in the dark on this topic :(
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The only place I can make some income thanks for posting done
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I agree, a shift to the n2 curve could be very beneficial for this platform.
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Nice write up very true and eye opening
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The more laws, the more rules, the less trust there is in a society. Look at the laws passed with these tax bills with 2,000 pages. 1,999 are for the 1%, and just one page for the common man explaining how they didn't get screwed... yeah right.
Peace '18 !
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That's what happens when you basically give a freedom to make crypto by your own work. There will be always abusers. Same thing happens in real life with fiat currency from you dayjob.
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Congratulations @dan!
Your post was mentioned in the hit parade in the following category:
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Well, thanks for pointing out the mistakes that you made when you created this thing, I guess
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Hi @dan, this was a great post with so many substantial points. We would all like to think others are as honest as we are but unfortunately, sometimes we are proven wrong. I think it’s admirable that the leaders of Steemit are doing their best to beat the aggressive behaviors and take care of the abuse that’s taking place. Thank you for all you guys do.
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Just because you have a lock on your door, doesn't mean that you live in a bad area. It's like having a strong fence around the backyard where your ferocious chihuahua lives. It's a warning. "The lock on my door isn't for my protection, it's for yours, so please knock before entering."
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When you have your place ready for occupancy I would really like to know so I can stop by and try a room out. I like the way you worded this post, and the way you think. It would be nice to have a digital home where I did not have to worry about theft, and other digital bullying.
If @blahblahblah is the same person as @hereherehere, and they are trading votes, and stealing from the community then the people have a right to know. I don't care what their real life identity is, but if they have multiple alias accounts and they are all "owned" by one person then people should be able to know that, when one of those names causes a problem.
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I thought you hated governments, compared them to the mafia? Ironic that both DPOS, as well as what you are suggesting, are just new forms of government
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I am against violence in government. You won’t end violence in government without non violent alternative that secures our liberty.
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Now this is responsive. And VERY true.
But the exploited value gained by the “bad players” of this game can be allegorically compared to violence.
In other words, Whales carry big sticks.
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Very well said Bacon man! :)
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Thank you @rawdog!
I've been keeping an eye on your comments as well.
SteemON!
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I felt the presence of the all seeing eye looking down on me. Knew it was Frank Bacon. :)
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Interesting
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yes, something need to change for good in this platform!!
Happy New year @Dan
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Hello @dan,
My name is Ankur Siddha from India. I want to be a part of the steemit community. I am into Blockchain & Crypro-currency field since last 1 year and have been part of many ICO's like Tokenstars, Verime, Budbo, Teky etc to help them in their marketing. I am also on the team of Upcoming ICO's Zohem, Flying Money & WEcrowd. I came to know about Steemit a few days back and loved it. As I am a traveler & Photographer. I have started uploading my experiences & work here. I also preparing more content from my past and also planning to keep on traveling and adding new content to it.
I am here to request you to curate my content to support me in my mission. I will also be expecting feedbacks & suggestions to improve my skills. I have some following on my other social channels and I am sharing my content with them also. In this little time, I have managed to make 5 of my friends join steemit. Hope to get your support in future. So, I can do well. Willing to so STeemit full time leaving my job and become an important contributor to the community.
There are a few of my recent contribution :
https://steemit.com/travel/@ankursiddha/dharamkot-a-hippie-village-in-the-himalayas-travel-blog
https://steemit.com/photography/@ankursiddha/the-taj-mahal-7-wonders-of-world-ankur-siddha-photography
https://steemit.com/travel/@ankursiddha/orissa-tourism-ankur-siddha-photography-nandan-kanan-botanical-garden-bhubaneswar-orissa-post-1
https://steemit.com/photography/@ankursiddha/humayun-s-tomb-delhi-unesco-world-heritage-centre-new-delhi-monument-1
https://steemit.com/love/@ankursiddha/my-love-what-i-feel-for-you-is-amazing
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thank you dan, thanks for steemit, this is a really great place for anyone of us!! this is where I found a job where I am my own boss, and as you said it, we feel good and safe in here!! doors are open in this place!
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I like your work and am looking forward to EOS but this post really rubs me the wrong way. Like you're just bashing steem and its users. You made the damn thing and then ran away from it instead of trying to fix it. So waaa waaa, cry me a river that you're so distraught about the state of affairs here. Give me a break.
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The original design used a nonlinear reward curve. It seems unlikely that those behind changing that are interested in Dan's assistance in fixing either that or the other issues. I'm still hopeful that Steem may last and be successful, but I'm also quite concerned about its future. There are a lot of highly influential actors involved who don't seem to be doing it any favors.
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@dan The non-linear reward curve you like so much appears to favor, greatly favor, those with the most stake. The current linear reward curve pushed by @ned seems to take the huge bias towards whales away, and puts everyone on equal footing in proportion to their stake.
I wonder if your thoughts would be different if you hadn't participated in the big pre-mine and started from day one as one of the mega whales?
Situations often look much different when you are truly at the bottom, looking up and trying to grow.
Versus starting from the top based on the ninja pre-mine, that made you a centralized controlling authority from day one.
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I will say this, the Steemit which had the different rewarding was a different incentive for bloggers. The current Steem encourages frequent "high volume" posting on current topics, instead of the less frequently thoroughly researched timeless posts. This was a decision made by Steemit Inc which changed my posting strategy and many others.
The other issue is, there are too many unwritten laws of the community which get enforced but which members do not know about until they violate. The community needs to be required to post it's current laws and norms somewhere and only be able to enforce that which is public.
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Wow, cool. I didn't know that. Thanks Dan and sorry for my rash response. Can you explain linear reward curve and what its implications are?
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I am glad to see this, Thank You....
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Also its just bonkers that you are calling people who vote for themselves thieves. It's absolutely absurd. Your made this and you decided not to make any rules against it. Anyone doing almost anything on Steem is just engaging with the system you created, with the rules or lack thereof that are in place, to make money. Your own personal wacky ideas of morality don't mean anything
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Self voting occasionally for good content is ok. Self voting for worthless content in automated and systematic manner is abuse that undermines integrity.
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How do we determine the worth of content?
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Also, the biggest problem right now is non-transparency in GOVERNMENT.
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And people are government
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@dan i guess you still have enough power to make differences | & if talking on governance , there is nothing perfect in either cryptos or world , this thought of yours is highly skeptical . Atleast you are in position to survive here , but what about people like me ?? the new comers joining Bchain daily ?? Losing Money | Losing Time | Just Because of lack of knowledge !!!
So Instead Of #blaming govern'ment' why not try to be a part of governance ?
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Thanks for this post, Dan. Although further discussion regarding approaches to governance is inevitable, it's nice to see that you're still interested in the improvement and success of the steem blockchain and by association the platform upon which it was built, steemit.
It seems the market has reacted positively to your post. Steem jumped nearly a dollar in the past 24 hours. To me that suggests that the crypto community was seeking clarity on the direction of this site. Though you're no longer with Steemit Inc, your voice is nonetheless pivotal as having been an originator of the steem blockchain. Whether anyone with any influence behind this platform at Steemit Inc executes changes that are necessary to take it to the next level and protect it from a downwards spiral remains to be seen.
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Glad someone said it.. Are we now working toward D+1
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If Steemit doesn't evolve beyond reward-pool parasites, then they will bring it down. That's the plain fact.
All the words in the world about "transparency" won't do much if there's nothing there to mitigate the gaming of the reward pool.
More action, less words - or someone will build a platform that will turn this place into MySpace.
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Hey @dan maybe people shouldn't voice out their opinion because of @ozchartart @berniesanders and crew will take you down. Just got all my posts downvoted. Maybe a reiteration of flagging is in order.
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I do not understand you !!, if you think about everything you write, you should not even develop blockchain and peer to peer software, if you do not need anonymity ?? then there should be no tax havens in a perfect world !!, they should not abuse positions of government to keep us slaves ?? if your idea is that of nudes naked while they are well hidden, I do not find it an inteligent idea nor a shareable idea---
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There is no governance system for managing the air people breathe. Even though it's a vital resource, people let anyone use as much of it as he/she needs. There is no need for setting up a system to protect people's property rights when it comes to air.
How come? Anyone would see air as much more important than cryptocurrency or money or any other financial asset. Yet we let any person have as much of it as they want. We don't govern that at all. Why?
There is an abundance of air. Plenty for everyone. Well, what if we produce a similar abundance of the best available education, best available medicine, transportation, entertainment, housing, etc.? In that situation we won't have to worry about people gaming the system or stealing - there is nothing to steal because everything is available to everyone, without having to wait in line or fill out forms or have connections with certain people or anything like that. Universal abundance, without any damage to the environment, is the only solution I see where the community can have security. If there is scarcity rather than abundance, people will have a reason to steal, harm each other and game the system. And all the technical solutions you are talking about seem to attempt to minimize that. What's the point? If we can produce abundance, we don't have to worry about people even thinking about doing such things.
If this makes sense to you, here is something to watch to look more into it.
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You don't think there are any regulations imposed on "air" and that it is all free?
Maybe you should compare average air quality in US with average air quality in China.
Nothing is free. Clean air is not free.
Clean air requires a government and regulations, or else you have tragedy of the commons and everyone "rapes the clean air rewards pool", and you end up with the dirty dangerous unbreathable air they have on Bejing on regular basis.
And then people die.
So your entire post was meaningless from about sentence 3, since you were so far off track right from the beginning.
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I think you clarified the issue quite well with the concrete example you gave. What you are pointing out is that clean air can become scarce. And when there is a scarce resource, you have to set up rules to regulate the resource.
For the entire history of mankind, up till industrialization, clean air has been abundant. Now, it is scarce in some regions of the world. So we have problems in those places. And the scarce resource needs to be regulated.
Now does it make sense?
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What if the benefit is indirect? For example, I buy stolen property for the purpose of returning it back to the owner and obtain a reward. Does this promote or hinder complicity?
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It still promotes complicity because the thief gets rewarded; you're only shifting the onus of victim-hood from the original owner to yourself. Also, if there are no changes in the system, that same owner can (and most likely will be) victimized again. So, in essence, you're causing the owner to be traumatized twice!
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Yup, I can see that.
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Complicity is being involved in illegal or wrong activities. While you did not steal from the owner, you paying for the merchandise is you normalizing and profitizing the bad behavior. This will lead the culprit to continue such behavior. Profitizing might not be a word but you know what I mean lol.
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Finally you spoke what I wanted to hear :)
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I support Steem community but yeah there are many down points to be resolve. I mean someone votes worth is quite low it means he is paying something but he can't. Community should allow some upvotes for a day with some limits any one could do that. Or may be I am newbie and don't know the criteria of upvoting. Please tell me, I ask many people that how much upvotes I can do per day, so that my earning and steem power doesn't get effected.. #thanks
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What I find amazing is people making more on one comment than some accounts make in an entire month! Wish the love was spread around like that in our neighborhood! Sad to see the greedy selfishness wreaking havoc on a platform designed to share. Really don't understand why people would want to do that. I mean, wouldn't it make more sense to upvote a bunch of undervalued Steempeeps instead of downvoting with a vendetta? Seems to me, that would balance the rewards pool in a much more acceptable way and gain people's trust vs. acquiring haters and driving people away from the platform. I am a fairly newer user here, so I may be out of touch with some old quarrels or something, but -
Seems to me, you have hit the proverbial nail on the head.
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Hmm, what if I am a part of the conversation? Someone notice? :D
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@dan,
Well reasoned and well done.
The entitlement syndrome and the scarcity mentality is a difficult spectre to diminish; especially in a community that spans multiple generations (e.g., Steemit).
I hope more Steemians venture past the front-end circle and explore the back-end, beautiful spiral behind from a different vantage point.
Namaste,
JaiChai
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until there is no transparency in the system nothing will work anyways wishing you a very happy new year @dan
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Once apon a time in the fifties, when ethics was so high that you could leave your model 🚂 out of sight and nobody would steal it.
http://tmrc.mit.edu
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another step towards the proof of god
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When i joined steemit i genuinely thought the self vote in the post creation section was a test to see what type of person i was. Of cousrse later i discovered the many pros and cons of the self votes.
Some people at the top are abusing this and so in a trickle down the new users feel they must just to keep up. It's sad to see the greedy eating the system that created them.
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great article, thank you Dan
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As simple is that if u care for your people your people will care for you,think about the nation and the progress of nation this is the real governance.
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Dan, I love and support your Utopian Idealism as in your previous blog. But, I have to support @ned here. Steem is an opt-in system. It's potential can be best explored through SMT's if only because SMT's will foster new voices and ideas to hitch-hike onto the original premise or to develop a singular hybrid possibility to improve on the original. I love listening to both of you guys and thank you for your frank discussion, but at the same time, I'm incredibly excited about the potential for new voices through SMT's as well.
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Dear @dan, there are so much more things to achieve with Steemit! Please! What about a "spend a part of my rewards"- button to Charity in the editor?
https://steemit.com/steemit/@brainnipper/would-it-be-possible-to-blockchain-charity-with-steemit-i-wish-for-a-spend-1-of-my-rewards-button
What about tools to bring people in idea pools together for getting global problems solved? Why do we need states and banks for solving the world's problems, when we have STEEMIT? There has a planet to be moved! Just let's do this shit! It could be the Club the Rome. But better. The "Club of Home".
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I have a question- I automatically upvote my posts but never my comments. Before you pass judgement please consider more often than not I receive less than $2 per post- I def make every effort to post meaningful content- mostly having to do with real news- for instance the other day I put ar least a couple of hours into writing this article which I feel puts forth a compelling case in support of the hypothesis that we aren't being told the truth about what's going on in Antarctica. https://steemit.com/disclosure/@thelightreports/as-predicted-the-pedo-elites-will-use-antarctica-mother-ship-and-ruins-as-a-distraction
I'm a guy with pretty high moral standards and I make every reasonable effort to live by the golden rule and I don't feel as if I am stealing from the community by upvoting my own post- especially when I put forth a significant effort creating that content.
I guess if I were pulling in $20-30 a post I wouldn't feel compelled to upvote my own stuff but that simply isn't the case and again I make an honest effort to put forth quality content.
Please don't take my comment as that of an ingrate- I love steemit.com and I am always talking it up to friends and family- and I'm overall very satisfied with the value of my account after one year of being a steemian- although I understand that some can be abusive rewarding their own comments (posted specifically to award themselves) but I don't think in all cases that it is wrong or stealing from the community to upvote your own post depending upon circumstances.
Oh and I also try to take the time to read other content and award it curation points regularly. I'm sure there's some stat somewhere on my history that will reflect that effort on my part.
I'm open to entertaining opposing opinions and open to being convinced that I should no longer engage in this practice- all ears- thanks and HNY to all- gonna be a GREAT ONE!
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This is just my personal opinion. I lived in a small village where you can leave your door open and I now live in a big city and my apartment has a steel door with two locks, and I prefer the latter.
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Effective governance (for example whether we should remove rewards for a particular post through flagging) requires those governing to know at least the following:
All of this would take considerable time, which means governance would need to be delegated (and ideally paid - via comments upvoted?) to trusted individuals (who could be rotated frequently along the lines of witnesses).
On the issue of whether we should allow other people to contribute to flagging via curation trails or delegation or whether flag power should just come from a single account pool decided on by one (or a team of people actually chatting first) I'd say the later only as the former would risk auto-flag trails and it's auto-upvote trails which are largely the reasons for unfair rewards - i.e. people not actually engaging/ reading!
So in short, if you want effective governance I think 'real' manual anti-curation is the only solution. sort of off-line amendment to a virtual environment.
Actually on that last note (if anyone's going to bother reading this?!) I don't think we should get too hung up on 'algorithm only' solutions to platform problems - we are a human-technology assemblage after all, it may be that technological solutions alone will not work?
Finally (sorry) - to offer up something very concrete - in order for people governing to be transparent they should have a post outlining their own standards and ethics - now there's something we could all do as a January project maybe?!
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Its still a question of morality. Whatever form of community a person has, if theirs immorality then we are all not safe. On the current state of life and technology, there is a big question on this because there are really those who doesn't care for other people. About what you are saying regarding the safety of the bicycle and the wallet is not achievable anymore in the present life not unless their is a miracle. Of course we wanted those kind of security since nobody would wanted that their properties will just gone with the wind. The vulnerability of the systems will drive the immorals to do their thing.
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DAN, this was illuminating on many levels, mostly on the state of mind of many people, and it doesn't look pretty. I would suggest all of you take some classes on Buddhism..
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I am not sure if this comment will get noticed here, which is why I made a post with my thoughts on this piece.
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This is a very enlightening post. Although, I'm of the opinion that good governance can only be good when everyone is of a good conduct and intention (which is almost impossible). Even though the governance is the best or trying to be the best, some people would still make it want to look bad by indulging in those bad things they are used to doing. Good governance starts with us as individuals. Thank you.
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great insight. am new here and would really love to invest in eos. @dan thanks for sharing and i did mention you in my post. regards
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Dear dan
This comment has nothing to do with this article, I just wanted to let you know that you are absolutely awesome.
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I think linear rewards is a backdoor fix for the totally shit distribution that this place has. I have no idea how you all figured out a way to get 93+% of the Steem in the hands of under 100 accounts. Exponential rewards are clearly better, but not when the distribution is this totally fucked.
Good news is that as the price is rising some of our whales are selling off stake. That's good for us.
I do think that Linear rewards can work, but I think it takes this whole place downvoting. It's not fair to the "good whales" to ask them to blow their curation reward protecting the reward pool for everyone else. It's a community problem and we need tools to do it.
What we need is a better distribution, which can happen from platform inflation that isn't stake weighted, but distributed through the rewards pool. It will also happen as the price continues to rise and our existing whales bail.
What we need is a second pool for downvotes.
Then we need our community downvoting more frequently to get actual price discovery of content.
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This is actually a huge topic of accountability and good governance and if this goal could be achieved it would be disruptive and transformation really merit getting this right. I know that many investments don't end up happening because of this transparency issue. I'm not going to mention compliance mechanisms like Sarbanes-Oxley and others ended in failure to prevent large corporations stealing millions from people and 'cooking the books'.
If we could get this right it would position us with leading edge social research and networks and open floodgate of future ventures.
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