Why the tiny votes?

steevc (73) in steemit • 6 years ago (edited)

View this post on Hive: Why the tiny votes?

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6 years ago by steevc (73)

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stimialiti (60) · 6 years ago

In the past I did not vote my own comments and threads because I considered it ludicrous.
Then, I kept not doing so, to allow and encourage people curation rewards and to get a chance at gentelbot and thing-2.
Then, after I learned the implications of a higher SBD and experienced over 6 months of cheapery with the exception of a generous vote by idealist (I had a few more since then), and after I mastered bidbotry I decided fuck upvotes by other people.
It is not worth it and never was.
It might had been worth it before I joined, but not in the last 12 months.

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

Well you have forfeited a vote from me by buying votes. I could even be tempted to flag this comment to bring the value down, but I'll resist, this time. You may be losing out on other votes by doing this and it's a long, slow way to build your sp

miss-j (57) · 6 years ago

buying votes from bots makes you lose money, every bid.

the vote you buy gets eaten up during payout

luckyvotes (38) · 6 years ago

You got a 35.65% upvote from @luckyvotes courtesy of @stimialiti!

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youtake (36) · 6 years ago

@youtake pulls you up ! This vote was sent to you by @stimialiti!

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steembloggers (66) · 6 years ago

You got a 24.40% upvote from @steembloggers courtesy of @stimialiti!

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rebeccabe (63) · 6 years ago (edited)

@steevc those are not all minnows... one I looked up (I only looked up one lol) is worth over 1.5 million...that my friend is not a minnow..

Then I saw the name of another one that is maybe a minnow I did not look but I am happy when they upvote me.

So maybe the question would be, "Why so tiny the upvotes?" I think the answer is a lot of people are subscribed to vote bots.

resteemed in case someone has question are comments...btw I expect minnows to upvote my post if they comment no matter how little their vote is worth. :)

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

I know pharesim is a whale, but most of the rest are small. I expect a whale to give small votes. There are all sorts of strategies going on here. I ain't worry too much about what I will get for voting. You need a lot of sp to make much from curation. Making connections does you more good when you start off

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samuel-swinton (61) · 6 years ago

I think I can give some insight as to why people give such small upvotes. I used to do this. At the time I wanted to give upvotes to quality submissions in introduceyourself. I wanted to give as many upvotes as possible so I gave small percentages. I did not realize that the help I was giving was so insignificant, even to a new person.

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

I've nothing against sincere voting, but when it comes in a flood like this I have to suspect there's automation involved.

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samuel-swinton (61) · 6 years ago

Regardless, I think the decision to do so comes from the same faulty logic: They think the best way to have the most impact is to make many infinitesimal upvotes. If you want to use automation then you can pick people who consistently do well and allocate a larger percent to them.

miss-j (57) · 6 years ago (edited)

it is, they come at exactly the same time, which also pushes away real curators

julienbh (59) · 6 years ago

What you need to understand though is that minnows are already overwhelmed by Steem information in their first month. Most come from other user friendly platforms and just try to make some money.

By the time they understand they should not comment like the examples you posted, some of them will already have been flagged to oblivion, cuz this is steemit.

I think it might get better, but there is also the non English speakers that are trying to squeeze some cents here & there too by dropping copy pasted comments over and over.

On the other hand, the people that makes it big on steemit are the one that participate actively on and out the platform, not the vote beggars.

So heh. Hope they learn before it's too late for them.

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

I've tried to guide some of them to do better. We need more active users. A lot of people make a bad start and trash their accounts

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schrosct (44) · 6 years ago (edited)

As far as the comment spam, you might want to check out steemplus addon for chrome/firefox. It lets you designate people as 'Human,' 'Bot,' 'Spammer.'
Hypothetically flagging people in this sincerity database will clue other people in that this person probably sends out 1,000 a day so don't bother.
Picture related,

I would assume that the small votes are a curation trail.
The most I've ever made off curation for a day was 0.14SP, i was pretty happy :D
But if someone follows multiple trails they may be downscaling their vote proportional to the leaders vote in weird ways so that could explain some microvotes that don't really make sense. Idk how reputation works, does it at least give you a small boost there?
Edit: Song for the bots, https://soundcloud.com/nick_1-1/ghost-in-the-shell-stand-alone-complex-ost-scott-matthew-be-human

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

I use Steem Plus. It thinks I'm 99% human :) This is a good way to spot bots and spam quickly

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jumowa (65) · 6 years ago

I suggest to change nice post to nice pizza at least. Lower chance being ignored.

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

But what flavour pizza?

jumowa (65) · 6 years ago

Just pizza. It's the universal non triggering term

dabeckster (59) · 6 years ago (edited)

My guess is that the three comments above (since moved down the list) didn’t read your post. I’m not sure what is up with the 0.8% upvotes. As a 56, I’m happy to get any upvotes, but I’m not sure what their strategy is. Seems like spreading the peanut butter a little too thin.

miss-j (57) · 6 years ago

im guessing .001 isnt profitable unless you got 125 bots. 125 times .001 is profitable. and they dont care if it offends post authors.

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slobberchops (74) · 6 years ago (edited)

As @schrosct mentions, these are likely to be a curation trail. I get a stream of these votes from @thesteemengine when I'm mentioned in their newsletter. I to have had the option to subscribe to this and be one of those small voters although I havent done it yet.

They recommend you use around 1% vote as there may be many articles to vote up, this is to stop your VP from draining too much. If they were immediately followed by a whale vote, then that's probably what this is.

pennsif (79) · 6 years ago

Hi Steve - all the little votes I believe are part of the Curie curation trail.

You got a 'mini-Curie' - most of the voting power for the trail comes from @hendrikdegrote

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

I did wonder. All those tiny votes probably only add up to a few cents and I just don't see that they will make anything from it as the curation rewards will be less than 0.001. I've not looked into these things too much as I prefer the human touch. I was using some trails, but I dropped them as they were using my vote on posts I wouldn't support.

basicstoliving (58) · 6 years ago

That is why I dropped using curation trails, they upvote some stuff that I would not normally vote on also. I like to vote on a post and then leave a comment or ask a question. Hopefully, it will start a conversation in the comment section among some of the commenters. I think it is more about the conversation than anything and in the end that will get you more upvotes as you go along on your Steemit journey.

pennsif (79) · 6 years ago

Yes I think that will be the case. Particularly on these mini-Curies.

roselifecoach (60) · 6 years ago

I'm still doing my own Upvote and I love every one of it, because I will have to read the post before I vote and that have given me so much satisfactions of reading good posts!

Resteeming this as well! Thanks @steevc

chiama (62) · 6 years ago

Sometimes, all I really want is for people who read my post is to engage by making good comments, just like you said.

Imagine taking time to vlog and edit and you only get one view or comment. I guess it takes time to reach that level.

I shall keep steeming, I love this space too much

gillianpearce (65) · 6 years ago

I just came across this post @steevc. Could this be your answer? 😢

https://steemit.com/steemit/@firedream/another-way-of-milking-the-system

gillianpearce (65) · 6 years ago

The whole spam accounts thing seems to be getting out of hand @steevc. A friend of mine joined Steemit a couple of weeks ago and was really excited because they got over sixty followers in the first ten days.

When I checked for her, every single one was spam of some sort.

I've only been here since last December and that's a big change since then. 😢

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

It will change again when it really starts to grow. I fear the spam will be a real problem unless we get the tools to deal with it.

gillianpearce (65) · 6 years ago

I'm just amazed at how much it's changed, and keeps chaning for the worse, in the short time I've been here.

The latest seems to be people just posting comments on posts so they can self-upvote. I just had someone do that with three consecutive replies to the tune of more than $1. I've muted them and reported them to Steemcleaners but I'm not sure they are actually doing something that's not allowed #sad;

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

Anything is 'allowed', but it's a case of what will be tolerated by the community

gillianpearce (65) · 6 years ago

And "quite a lot" is the answer I feel. 😁

Have a lovely Bank Holiday Monday!

foremostwiseguy (48) · 6 years ago

I totaly agree that there are a lot of spam comments out there @steevc.I've seen people spamming worthless comments on every post.They do not bring anything to the discussion and people that do that should get punished because they bring this trash everywhere and don't even read the posts.All they care about are upvotes that they eventually might get.However I cannot agree with this part of your post:

'I wait for your next post'. Have you nothing else to do?
'This is a valuable post'. Well it's really just me posting about my life.
'Thanks for sharing'. Very generic. Everything we do here is sharing.

Personally most of the time I try to make comments on point and bring something into discussion but sometimes I just write short comments for sake of supporting content creators.I don't think that commenting your followed artist even with stuff like "Interesting thoughts,keep up your great work etc." is that bad.As long as you don't spam all over the platform,letting content creators know that you enjoyed their post is somehow supportive in my opinion.So anyway:this was a valuable post,I wait for your next post and thanks for sharing😂😂
Have a great day sir🤗

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

The problem is, how do I distinguish your honest opinion from a copied spam comment unless I know you? If the comment shows they actually read the post then I'm more likely to take it seriously.

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foremostwiseguy (48) · 6 years ago

You are totaly right sir.That's why Im trying to never write short comments under new creators that I just discovered.Even if I would just be nice and appreciate someone's effort in writing post they could take me like spammer and just ignore or even downvote.That's why the only people that sometimes get short approval comments from me are those who I "know" for a little and I commented their content a couple of times before.I didn't really express my thoughts clearly in my previous comment.Sorry if you misunderstood me but as we can clearly see sometimes I have hard time writing in english since it's not first or even second language that I started to learn.Anyway I totaly agree with your statement about spammers and all I wanted to point out was the fact that short comments are not always made by spammers.Thanks for your response.

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

As I don't have much time I'm not going to check out every person to see what they do so I will have to ignore comments that look like spam even if the person really did like what I did. Don't worry about voting for me as I want you to use you votes where they make a difference.

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stephen.king989 (64) · 6 years ago

I was thinking the other day, the amount steem might be worth in some of these other countries might be a factor as well. For some, 1 or 2 steem/SBD could be enough to live off for a month. Not that it justifies these horrible comments, but I can see why some might be tempted to leave a higher quantity of comments over fewer quality ones; especially if they are new and English isn't their primary means of communication.

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

I know the money makes a bigger difference to some people, but I still think it should be earned. Maybe in time people will form more regional communities where they can chat in their own language. I know there's a big Korean presence here, but I may not even see those posts.

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verhp11 (67) · 6 years ago

It came to my attention also about the loads of small upvotes. I couldnt believe it has to do with any curration rewards because the rewards are just to small. Couldnt find out the real reason but Im convinced it indeed is automated. The nothingsaying comments keeps comming, I decided to leave them for what they are...nothingsaying :)

Have a great night !!

firedream (61) · 6 years ago

It seems we were asking the same question at the same time :)

romaincrx (52) · 6 years ago

I also noticed that on some of my posts. Can't explain it either.
Regarding the Alexa rank, it would be interesting to look at the rank of other sites like busy.org. Maybe Steemit looses at the benefit of other platforms.

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

I looked at them a while back. Some are getting good views, but Steemit is well ahead of them all. That may change in time as Steemit Inc want there to be alternatives.

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romaincrx (52) · 6 years ago

And do you know why Steemit Inc wants alternative? They are afraid to not be able to manage all the new users?

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

That's part of it, but they also have limited development resources and I think they prefer to concentrate on developing the blockchain side. It's great that we have so many options already.

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romaincrx (52) · 6 years ago

Thanks for the info! I didn't know all that. Yes it's great, the different options are almost infinite!

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aaarif (54) · 6 years ago

Some new steemian are being taught that they have to comment in every post they visit whatever the subject is.

There is a negative side of it. May be a blooger get boring by seeing those and ignore a real commenter. Seemit have no personal message inbox. otherwise they can be warned by messages.

obest (59) · 6 years ago

Fascinating and interesting post, I think those that write meaningful comment on post should be encourage with some upvote in other for them to continue to post valuable comments @steevc

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

We each decide what deserves reward on our own values. I vote to reward good stuff and encourage them to keep going

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katharsisdrill (71) · 6 years ago

Sometimes you will get the tiny votes flooding. It has the feel of a bot army I must say.

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

Seems it can be profitable if coordinated with a big vote. Steemit need to fix issues with giving accounts to scammers. Their vetting process does not seem to be effective

katharsisdrill (71) · 6 years ago

There are so many things in Steemit that could be fixed technically - I think I would like to see some of them done. As for vetting it is a difficult work.

godsngh1 (48) · 6 years ago

I am a minnow but I don't upvote just any post I mostly think I should upvote because no mater how tiny the value might be, it make the author realize he has done a great job. One thing I realize is that most people upvote to get attention and others too give comments that are not relating to the post just because they want to be the first to comment.

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

Just doing these things for attention will not get you far as they won't gain you real followers who will support you. I don't mind if minnows don't vote on my stuff. They can use it elsewhere to help others. I can spot comments that are not real.

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scalextrix (60) · 6 years ago (edited)

This is a generic reply. It took me many seconds to write it so please upvote.

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

Now I have to decide if this deserves anything, but then I know you are having a laugh with me

scalextrix (60) · 6 years ago

Sorry man, mischief got the better of me

usman93 (62) · 6 years ago

It's strange to see.
I think if someone having low voting Power and he is giving votes of 1% or 10% or what ever, these people shouldn't give upvote instead of low voting. Most of them are Spammers. Who Comments on every post and give a little upvote just for attendance. They mostly don't Read the full Blog.
By the Way, I Hope That Steemit Alexa Rank will also Cover Soon. I Always Hope For Best.

philnewton (57) · 6 years ago

I have been wondering this for a little while now. I had a post I'd written the other day receive 123 upvotes, for a grand total of $0.82. I noticed the votes coming in and wondered what was going on, and was left rather confused. I assume it must be some sort of curation trail?

sebbbl (63) · 6 years ago (edited)

Curation trails are evil. As much as bid bots.

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steevc (73) · 6 years ago

Real manual voting is the ideal, but this is an open platform where people will try alternatives. I expect it's a few people making most of the money from trails.

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sebbbl (63) · 6 years ago

Yes, it's a shame. There will always be some workaround that will allow votes buying and automation.
People don't see high gains on their posts are an illusion when they use bots.

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chehkuna (57) · 6 years ago

We are very grateful for what has been given to us, we also try to get involved as well as we hope to be able to vote. This is also an endeavor for us...
I agree with you

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tigerplus (48) · 6 years ago

God post

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steevc (73) · 6 years ago

Exactly the wrong sort of comment

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valeriarodriguez (39) · 6 years ago

Interesting is your publications. REGARDS

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steevc (73) · 6 years ago

Why?

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josuhimovic (44) · 6 years ago

nice post my dear friend

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steevc (73) · 6 years ago

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aaarif (54) · 6 years ago

@steevc, they did not even read your post about spamming. hahahaha.

And also may be they will not see the reply of yours. So you can happily keep flagging them or hire me as a assistant of yours to do that flagging (with salary) :-D

steevc (73) · 6 years ago

I wonder if they will notice the flag. I did warn them

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